Ring Fu

[Frost]

This is fundamentally wrong based on my point of view.

That's the whole point of a forum.

My point of view is 10yrs traditional, job change, then the only people that I had to play with were Judo, MMA (boxing & wrestling heavy), and BJJ. So my goal has been to use and adapt what I knew to those environments which I feel I've been pretty successful with but I do realize the journey of making that shift could've been easier if I would've just done regular San Da full time at some point in my earlier MA life. Doesn't mean that would've been the end-all be-all of that martial experience, but it could've been a good starting point or base to build on which some people may or may not agree with.

That doesn't mean that is everybody's path, just mine. But I also, IMO, see a lot of bad fundamental sparring when I see TCMA clips. It's my opinion based on my point of view based on my personal experience. Using my worldview, a stubborn traditionalist would've had their arse handed to them time and time again in any of the non-traditional environments that I've been to.

But there’s the rub of it, stubborn traditionalists are a modern phenomenon, in the past when people actually depended on their arts to survive do you think they were bothered if something new came along and was better…..did they think twice about changing what they did if it wasn’t as good, WFH and hung gar for example

And what is bad fundamental sparring? and what do you consider good fundamental sparring can you most clips of good sparring? Because I honestly don’t think I have seen a good sparring clip from TCMA that doesn’t look like kickboxing good or bad…. is that a bad thing? and if so what has happened to make this divergence between what an actual fight looks like and how we train in TCMA?

I guess my point is TCMA should be about fighting, where did things go that wrong that people aren’t getting the sound fundamentals from their style that they should be getting?

And as an aside how many people here have actually made the supposedly more advanced stuff work against a good opponent is sparring or a fight? Just wondering

[MightyB]

And what is bad fundamental sparring?

Extending the lead arm too far, reaching for kicks, not using the non-dominant hand offensively, turned too far in (in their defensive stance) to prevent a single leg or double leg with a sprawl, no head movement, not keeping hands up to protect the head, "limp" jabs rather than "stinging" jabs, lack of offensive combination attacks, standing on one leg and reaching, too much forward and backward straight line running, waiting on the opponent to do something rather than creating openings, flailing about rather than controlled aggressive movement, heavy flat feet...

[MightyB]

Because I honestly don’t think I have seen a good sparring clip from TCMA that doesn’t look like kickboxing good or bad…. is that a bad thing?

This is my point all along. Why fight against that concept when you can just go ahead and develop good kick boxing habits when a student is just beginning? Do whatever training you want after that base is developed. That way they always have that base to draw from when the cr@p hits the fan and they'll be better for it IMO.

[YouKnowWho]

"Making a person a good San Da player will make them a better traditional martial artist".

Agree with you 100% there.

In San Da, after you have caught your opponent's kicking leg, You either pull/sweep/hook his standing leg, he will be down. After you are good at both leg catch and pull/sweep/hook take down, you then go back to your style and look for moves that match these application. You may be surprise that you may not be able to find both the leg catch and pull/sweep/hook counters against kicking in your style/form.

In San Da, you will find that the best striking combo is jab, cross, hook, hook, or jab, cross, upper cut, upper cut. After you have detected that and use it well to against your opponent, you then go back to your style/form to find this combo. You may also not be able to find it.

Why? Did the original style/form creator had never

- caught his opponent's kicking leg and used pull/sweep/hook to take his opponent down?
- used 2 straight punches followed by 2 curve punches?

If you put 2 kids to spar each other for 2 years, they may be able to figure out how to use these 2 skills without any TCMA teacher. If that's possible then why these 2 basic combat skills are not in "ALL" TCMA systems?