Decision on Kung Fu Schools - New student

[mjwny]

So i'm new to the site, Kung Fu and martial arts in general. This past summer I spent a good month in China, and a few days at the Shaolin Temple and International Shaolin Kung Fu Academy outside of Luoyang. Watching, seeing and semi-participating I became fascinated with the art; philosophy and discipline. I promised my self I would take up Kung Fu once time freed up at home. As for my self, i'm in my mid 20's, pretty fit and have my own business, so i'm quit busy but looking to supplement some time at night, and even change my gym routine up to something different.

So that time has come, and in the past few weeks I have been visiting several Kung Fu schools in the area (Long Island/Queens.) Unfortunately there aren't many. From the three I visited, 2 seemed based solely upon self defense and application of the art in the real world. But, i'm not one to be a fighter, I dont pick fights, I have never been in a fight, and i'm not quit sure that's exactly what I want; though it seems cool to know. I already knocked 1 out of the 3 schools out. I'm having a hard time deciding really between the other two located in Flushing NY.

So to start with the first; it was based on Shaolin Kung Fu, fundamentals I saw in china. Practicality, I don't know yet; as far as applications I haven't seen enough either. But in an hour class, I broke a nasty sweat and used muscles I never even knew existed before. I could barely walk the next day... And i'm used to going to the gym, running 3-5 times a week. The unfortunate part was the mix of very few adults, some kids and a few immature teenagers; as well as the language barrier. It was very hard to communicate with the Sifu; (who did study at the Shaolin temple in China) some of the students had to translate for me; though when I wasn't doing things right, he physically moved me. As a traditionalist, this school had no belts; and no fee's for testing which is a plus.

The second school, the Sifu was very pleasant, knowledgeable in traditional Kung Fu, and has been practicing for over 20 years. I was able to easily speak with him, and understand all the physical movements and application. He also helped translate how one movement can be seen as a grab or punch. But from other friends in Martial Arts for years, they mention these are things you don't or shouldn't need to know until you master then basic fundamentals which can take months or even years. The class was 3 hours though, it was a lot of information to take in at once. However in 3 hours, I didn't break a sweat. A few stretches, a few movements, punches on a bag etc... Movements were tough but other students took their time and helped me. Some of the skilled students practiced weaponry towards the end which was pretty cool to see. But watching people of different belts; it seemed there wasn't much fluid motion to a lot of the movements; a lot of staggering, though some of these guys did know how to defend themselves. All adults in this class which was comfortable as well.


So to sum it up; I'm stuck between deciding on two classes which seem to be two different styles of Kung Fu from movements to philosphy. More then anything i'm looking to hear peoples advise and experience in what they trained/mastered in; expectations etc... I'm looking at the long haul here.

Thanks in advanced.

[GeneChing]

Never mind what we think - what feels better to you? What works better in your schedule? Which one will you be able to practice more?

[MasterKiller]

The one with the hotter chicks is always the best. Pretty girls hate losers.

[MightyB]

The one with the hotter chicks is always the best. Pretty girls hate losers.

I 2nd this!

[mjwny]

The one with the hotter chicks is always the best. Pretty girls hate losers.

This would have been my first go to point, but unfortunately neither have Chics. So now I'm back to square one.

As per comfort level, I wouldn't know. In a single day of trials they both seemed pretty easy, Shaolin was a bit more of a challenge which i liked but this was also the class that seemed to show less application.

But again, looking to hear others stories, experiences etc... Trying to keep an open mind. If I had the money, and time I would do both!

[Robinhood]

This would have been my first go to point, but unfortunately neither have Chics. So now I'm back to square one.

As per comfort level, I wouldn't know. In a single day of trials they both seemed pretty easy, Shaolin was a bit more of a challenge which i liked but this was also the class that seemed to show less application.

But again, looking to hear others stories, experiences etc... Trying to keep an open mind. If I had the money, and time I would do both!

I think you came to the wrong place for advise.

Good Luck

[YouKnowWho]

I think you came to the wrong place for advise.

Good Luck

I wonder what kind of advise that mjwny may get if he goes to a forum that talks about:

- health,
- self-cultivation, and
- inner peace.

People in this forum may not have all reached to the "spiritual level" yet, but at least we all care about "combat".

[Lucas]

So when you say that in the shaolin class you broke a good sweat and got a good work out, but there was no real application work, do you mean that the entire class was composed of form work, or was there some good solid conditioning and drills taking place? Have you asked the current students if there are application days where that is the focus? a lot of times you may not get the full spectrum in one day.

I am skeptical of a martial arts class where you do not break a sweat in a 3 hour class. Perhaps that was a special occasion day? I also am skeptical of a class that does not begin a new student of martial arts by building a foundation through introductory beginner basics. These are required building blocks that one needs to be able to progress at a consistant solid rate of understanding.

all in all, as a beginner, i don't believe in many cases you will get a full picture in just one class. if you have some experience and know what you are looking for this is definately possible, but if you have absolutely zero experience, you may want to visit two or three more times to get a more rounded idea of the actual exposure you would get there.

[YouKnowWho]

He also helped translate how one movement can be seen as a grab or punch.

When someone gives explanation like that, there may be some problem there.

A

- grab cannot be a punch, and a punch cannot be a grab.
- step cannot be a kick, and a kick cannot be a step.
- hip throw cannot be a shoulder throw, and a shoulder throw cannot be a hip throw.

When a teacher tried to map a form move into application, he is taking the wrong path in the 1st place.

[mjwny]

When someone gives explanation like that, there may be some problem there.

A

- grab cannot be a punch, and a punch cannot be a grab.
- step cannot be a kick, and a kick cannot be a step.
- hip throw cannot be a shoulder throw, and a shoulder throw cannot be a hip throw.

When a teacher tried to map a form move into application, he is taking the wrong path in the 1st place.

Exactly the kind of feedback i'm looking for, thank you. Now, as I have no experience, so please dont mind my ignorance but after learning forms for lets say.. a year, aren't they eventually put into application of some sort?

[YouKnowWho]

You will need many tools in combat. A teacher should

- help you to develop one tool after another tool,
- not help you to learn one form after another form.

[Kellen Bassette]

Exactly the kind of feedback i'm looking for, thank you. Now, as I have no experience, so please dont mind my ignorance but after learning forms for lets say.. a year, aren't they eventually put into application of some sort?

They should be put into application almost immediately. You should be learning applications as you learn the form, then trying them out with partners. It's not a bad thing to learn the applications before the form.

Don't be afraid to ask for it. Some guys will just keep going with the form if no one shows interest in application. I always questioned any app that wasn't obvious.

[YouKnowWho]

The 1st day that I met my longfist teacher, I was only 14 years old, I asked him, "What will you do if I punch at your face?" He said, "Come and punch me." When I punched him, he pulled my arm into him, used his foot to block my leading leg, and threw me forward. For the remaining years, in his mind, I was always a bad boy who cared nothing but fighting.

Today, I'm a teacher myself. I only teacher students who "cares nothing but fighting". A bad teacher always teaches bad students.

[Raipizo]

The 1st day that I met my longfist teacher, I was only 14 years old, I asked him, "What will you do if I punch at your face?" He said, "Come and punch me." When I punched him, he pulled my arm into him, used his foot to block my leading leg, and thrown me forward. For the remaining years, in his mind, I was alway a bad boy who cares only fighting.

Yeah exactly don't do that to your sifu lol. But at that age a child hardly knows the boundaries of rudeness.

[Raipizo]

So i'm new to the site, Kung Fu and martial arts in general. This past summer I spent a good month in China, and a few days at the Shaolin Temple and International Shaolin Kung Fu Academy outside of Luoyang. Watching, seeing and semi-participating I became fascinated with the art; philosophy and discipline. I promised my self I would take up Kung Fu once time freed up at home. As for my self, i'm in my mid 20's, pretty fit and have my own business, so i'm quit busy but looking to supplement some time at night, and even change my gym routine up to something different.

So that time has come, and in the past few weeks I have been visiting several Kung Fu schools in the area (Long Island/Queens.) Unfortunately there aren't many. From the three I visited, 2 seemed based solely upon self defense and application of the art in the real world. But, i'm not one to be a fighter, I dont pick fights, I have never been in a fight, and i'm not quit sure that's exactly what I want; though it seems cool to know. I already knocked 1 out of the 3 schools out. I'm having a hard time deciding really between the other two located in Flushing NY.

So to start with the first; it was based on Shaolin Kung Fu, fundamentals I saw in china. Practicality, I don't know yet; as far as applications I haven't seen enough either. But in an hour class, I broke a nasty sweat and used muscles I never even knew existed before. I could barely walk the next day... And i'm used to going to the gym, running 3-5 times a week. The unfortunate part was the mix of very few adults, some kids and a few immature teenagers; as well as the language barrier. It was very hard to communicate with the Sifu; (who did study at the Shaolin temple in China) some of the students had to translate for me; though when I wasn't doing things right, he physically moved me. As a traditionalist, this school had no belts; and no fee's for testing which is a plus.

The second school, the Sifu was very pleasant, knowledgeable in traditional Kung Fu, and has been practicing for over 20 years. I was able to easily speak with him, and understand all the physical movements and application. He also helped translate how one movement can be seen as a grab or punch. But from other friends in Martial Arts for years, they mention these are things you don't or shouldn't need to know until you master then basic fundamentals which can take months or even years. The class was 3 hours though, it was a lot of information to take in at once. However in 3 hours, I didn't break a sweat. A few stretches, a few movements, punches on a bag etc... Movements were tough but other students took their time and helped me. Some of the skilled students practiced weaponry towards the end which was pretty cool to see. But watching people of different belts; it seemed there wasn't much fluid motion to a lot of the movements; a lot of staggering, though some of these guys did know how to defend themselves. All adults in this class which was comfortable as well.


So to sum it up; I'm stuck between deciding on two classes which seem to be two different styles of Kung Fu from movements to philosphy. More then anything i'm looking to hear peoples advise and experience in what they trained/mastered in; expectations etc... I'm looking at the long haul here.

Thanks in advanced.

First of all, welcome friend. Maybe you should ask the first sifu if there is an adults only class? I believe I know of that sifu if he is who I think he is, not personally. Secondly do what you prefer, is one class easier to get to, fits in your schedule better, more relaxed/intense, everyone treated equally or by rank etc. Ask yourself these questions and more or if you really like both try both or even be enrolled in both if you can, Most sifu these days don't really mind you taking another class.