TCMA discussion Part dieux

[sanjuro_ronin]

................

In all fairness, Tabata's were aimed more at the fat burning protocols than the "cardio-vascular" ones.
The typical Tabata's that take you into the 120% of your VO2 Max for a VERY brief period, just don't translate into the fight game.
20 seconds on and 10 seconds off is just to little BUT they can work when done as part of what happens within a round.
The 2:1 ratio is a good one to follow with HIIT.
You need steady state cardio to build the "endurance" for ANY event that lasts more than 5 min BUT you need the HIIT to build the "anerobic endurance" needed for any event that requires "explosive bursts" of energy.

[Robinhood]

Stance training if done right should develop your root, but usually no one does it right or even knows what a root is, so they just do it wrong and it makes their legs a little stronger.

[taai gihk yahn]

Stance training if done right should develop your root, but usually no one does it right or even knows what a root is, so they just do it wrong and it makes their legs a little stronger.

of course; and doubtless, it just so happens that you are the one of those few who do know how to train it right (funny, this forum seems to be a magnet for that supposedly rarified group, as opposed to the rest of the unwashed masses...)

[Frost]

In all fairness, Tabata's were aimed more at the fat burning protocols than the "cardio-vascular" ones.
The typical Tabata's that take you into the 120% of your VO2 Max for a VERY brief period, just don't translate into the fight game.
20 seconds on and 10 seconds off is just to little BUT they can work when done as part of what happens within a round.
The 2:1 ratio is a good one to follow with HIIT.
You need steady state cardio to build the "endurance" for ANY event that lasts more than 5 min BUT you need the HIIT to build the "anerobic endurance" needed for any event that requires "explosive bursts" of energy.

it might be a good ratio to follow for HITT but is it the best type of interval to do as a fighter? id argue not,

Id say to build alactic power you need interavls of explosive power output under 10 seconds, with at least 2 minutes recovery, you need to be fresh for each interval in order to reach maximum potential and become quicker, more explosive etc, and once you have worked on increasing alactic power you then work on capacity (hoe often you can produce said power) by extending the work intervals gradually up to about 14 seconds and decreasing the rest intervals from 1 minute until you are under 30 seconds active rest for each interval
but thats just one example, you also need to work extended intervals at your threshold, the point where you go from majority aerobic to anaerobic energy usage (usually around 170 -175 bpm for fighters) in order to improve how much power you can produce aerobically, these intervals need to be between 5 and 10 seconds a set, for a total duration of about 20 minutes.

just two examples of intervals i think are better suited for MMA, of course then there are intervals which help with recovery from hard sessions which are probably almost as important

[LaRoux]

Why do boxers and Muay Thai guys do distance running?

Many don't anymore, especially the ones who have conditioning trainers with degrees in the field of exercise science.. They do more specificity type training. The ones that still do LDR are still training based on the methods used before there was such thing as exercise science.

[LaRoux]

because the following all rely on a good aerobic system
1) how fast you recovery between rounds
2) how quickly you can recover from an alactic burst and repeat it
3) How much power you can produce at your threshold before going lactic
4) how low your resting heart rate is

All of the above are better suited by interval training. That's why sport fighters do their training in rounds instead of continuous 30 or 40 minute long continuous sessions.

Not to mention MMA fight camp training (and any fight camp training for that matter) is the hardest thing you can do to your body, aerobic work helps you to recover between sessions and not be over trained. definition of overtrained?? go watch an episode of TUF they have hard grappling matches, hard sparring and hard interval sessions right up to their elimination fights...then they gas in the first 5 minutes...go figure

That's because they forget about two other important aspects of training: tapering and peaking.

[LaRoux]

La Roux thinks distance running is an archaic training method that serves no use in fighting. Or maybe that's only when they do it in TCMA, as opposed to when they do it in sport fighting.

I'm beginning to see how this works.

No, it's antiquated in both.

[Frost]

Many don't anymore, especially the ones who have conditioning trainers with degrees in the field of exercise science.. They do more specificity type training. The ones that still do LDR are still training based on the methods used before there was such thing as exercise science.

so when the likes of martin rooney, joel jamison, and cain vasquez's coach all include running for distance their fighters when appropriate they are wrong then

And the majority of boxers and thai fighters still do run for distance, its the MMA crowd in the states that moved away from distance running, and alot paid the price for it in terms of gassing in the cage

[LaRoux]

RE: Static stance training.
It serves its purpose, which IS NOT leg strengthening or increasing leg muscle endurance.
It build stability and teaches how to "root" oneself.
Is it needed to develop a fighter? Of course not, many systems do not use it and produce excellent fighters.
IMO, it does build a sort of "base" ( if you pardon the pun) for beginners to build off of.

Wrestlers and Judoka arguably have the best "bases" in the world. Little to none of their training involves static stance training.

[sanjuro_ronin]

it might be a good ratio to follow for HITT but is it the best type of interval to do as a fighter? id argue not,

Id say to build alactic power you need interavls of explosive power output under 10 seconds, with at least 2 minutes recovery, you need to be fresh for each interval in order to reach maximum potential and become quicker, more explosive etc, and once you have worked on increasing alactic power you then work on capacity (hoe often you can produce said power) by extending the work intervals gradually up to about 14 seconds and decreasing the rest intervals from 1 minute until you are under 30 seconds active rest for each interval
but thats just one example, you also need to work extended intervals at your threshold, the point where you go from majority aerobic to anaerobic energy usage (usually around 170 -175 bpm for fighters) in order to improve how much power you can produce aerobically, these intervals need to be between 5 and 10 seconds a set, for a total duration of about 20 minutes.

just two examples of intervals i think are better suited for MMA, of course then there are intervals which help with recovery from hard sessions which are probably almost as important

You have to take into account the specific conditions of a sport combat fight.
HIIT idn't as much about BPM as VO2 Max, which is, of course, hard to measure so many HIIT people still fall into the "error" of using the BPM.
The standard 3 min on 1 min off for boxing/MT is being done far less with more emphaises being placed on the 3 min on, 30 sec off ( or 45), for obvious reasons BUT we are also seeing rounds being "played" with:
Withing those 3 min you get drills that go 20 one 10 off or 10 on 5 off or 1 min on 30 sec off ( the off being used to work defense and footwork), so you do HIIT WITHIN the round.
A longer "rest" period than active period is NEVER desirable as it falls into the "best case" scenario ( you don't get many rest periods in a give round).
To train for lest rest and finding yourself with MORE rest is great, while training for more rest and finding yourself with LESS is NOT so great.

[LaRoux]

so when the likes of martin rooney, joel jamison, and cain vasquez's coach all include running for distance their fighters when appropriate they are wrong then

And the majority of boxers and thai fighters still do run for distance, its the MMA crowd in the states that moved away from distance running, and alot paid the price for it in terms of gassing in the cage

Interval training instead of LSD training has nothing to do with them gassing. They gas because (1) it is harder to work at a slower pace in MMA than it is in boxing. (2) MMA fighters are notorious for neglecting to taper before fights.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Wrestlers and Judoka arguably have the best "bases" in the world. Little to none of their training involves static stance training.

Absolutely.
Stand up grappling arts are all about dynamic "stance" training.
Hence me stating that many systems do NOT use any "stance training" at all.

[LaRoux]

Distance running for sport athletes is mostly used to help maintain or get to competition weight.

[YouKnowWho]

This threads about what works in TCMA. If you want to bash TCMA, start your own thread and call it "TCMA sucks because:" and then bash it to your hearts delight.

+1, So what works in TCMA?

From what my guys told me, MMA guys like the following TCMA offer.

1. How to turn your opponent's clinch into your shoulder lock (showing in the following picture).

http://imageshack.us/a/img819/4378/chang2.jpg

2. How to reverse your opponent's MT clinch into your head lock or reverse head lock (guillotine).
3. What to do after you have obtained a reverse head lock (guillotine) on your opponent.
4. How to turn your opponent's single leg shooting into your over hook.
5. How to deal with "pull guard" and "jump guard".
6. How to prevent your opponent from pulling you down backward.
7. How to deal with a front and back "bear hug".
8. How to move in with the minimum risk.
9. How to force a striker to play your grappling game.
10. How to integrate kick, punch, lock, throw, following on strike.
11. ...

[bawang]

dynamic tcma stance training:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSQHuAgV53A


this was secret training in tcma.

internal styles increase repetition, external styles add weight.