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Thread: Most important part of learning

  1. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo View Post
    How many Krav Maga guys are also top MMA fighters? Yet I doubt anyone in their right mind would call it unproven, impractical or 'dying'.
    Krav actually takes a lot of what is effective in nhb and mma and makes use of it. And the military version has seen effective use but in comparatively few instances. The civilian version is almost always hardcore Tae Bo for soccer moms and folks who want to seem hardcore by doing an art associated with the IDF.

    There are very valid systems which teach self defence well, and you'd be right in claiming none of those system's proponents are top full contact fighters but they do have methods for training self defense which far outmatch TCMA's in situational, legal, and often technique.

    So as far as king outside the ring TCMA fails there too.
    Last edited by Bacon; 01-27-2013 at 05:50 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ali. R View Post
    I’ve sent a lot of overzealous men down to their knees with that... watch the wonderful reaction/whimper you’ll get from that person.

    The ‘ginger fist’ really works.

  2. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon View Post
    Kathy Long won in kickboxing but it's still a step in the right direction. I would say it's acceptable only because it would be impossible to showcase a lot of Kung fu techniques with boxing gloves on. So it's not the best example but I give a little leeway here. Still I'd be more than willing to bet she was training as a kickboxers even though her training is listed as San Soo and Aikido.

    Don Wilson trained in Goju-ryu and kickboxing so that's not viable as an example.

    There's not enough information on Jason Yee's training background for a determination.
    You can't win in kickboxing without training in kickboxing. .

  3. #93
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    Adaptability.

    Thats the important thing.

    If you train only the application of the sword your screwed when guns come along.

    But sword or gun, drone or nuke the timeless principles of the art of war are still the same.


    MMA, this is one manifestation. We can adapt Kung Fu to MMA and it will look just like it. But we shouldn't destroy it in the process, because one day you will want to apply kung fu to something else. And it has as many applications as you have the ability to imagine.

    To think that all violent encounters can be summed up by 1 situation is foolish.

    Let your body absorb the theories of Kung Fu and you will never find it a hinderance.

    Above all enjoy it, as thousands have done for millennia.

  4. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by LaRoux View Post

    As long as CMA practitioners don't see the problems with these kinds of statements and simply take them at face value, they will be continued to be looked down upon by other practitioners.

    Put your thinking caps of for a few seconds when you read posts like that and you will see how nonsensical they are.
    I'd have to see it done, how he would lock both arms, but getting a headlock from clinch isn't difficult, I've done it on many occasions. Also real simple to lock one arm with an overhook from the clinch.

  5. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I'd have to see it done, how he would lock both arms, but getting a headlock from clinch isn't difficult, I've done it on many occasions. Also real simple to lock one arm with an overhook from the clinch.
    We are talking about the MT plum position. First of all, getting an overhook from there is not a simple proposition. If it was, the MT plum would not be the effective technique it is. It could easily be countered with a simple overhook.

    As far as a headlock goes, sure it's easy, but no one would do it because it's such a bad idea. Again, put your thinking cap on here for a second. What happens when you put a heallock on someone in MMA?

    Supposedly, this is some kind of new thing that the MMA community has never seen, other than in this one MMA gym. Do you really think that if this was real, it would never have leaked out of that gym?

  6. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by LaRoux View Post
    You can't win in kickboxing without training in kickboxing. .
    Kinda one of the points I was making with regard to sanda.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ali. R View Post
    I’ve sent a lot of overzealous men down to their knees with that... watch the wonderful reaction/whimper you’ll get from that person.

    The ‘ginger fist’ really works.

  7. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon View Post
    Kinda one of the points I was making with regard to sanda.
    Of course, you probably wouldn't do so well in Sanda without training some Sanda.

  8. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by LaRoux View Post
    You can't win in kickboxing without training in kickboxing. .
    Those were two very good examples. If they teach Kung Fu, I think it's pretty safe to say that's what they consider their base and what they find effective.

  9. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon View Post

    Don Wilson trained in Goju-ryu and kickboxing so that's not viable as an example.

    There's not enough information on Jason Yee's training background for a determination.
    If Don Wilson is a Kung Fu teacher, I think that's your answer Bacon. You wouldn't draw any more kick boxing from Go Ju Ryu than you would from Kung Fu.

    Jason Yee trained Praying Mantis and Hung Gar. He was also a forms champion.

  10. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by LaRoux View Post
    Of course, you probably wouldn't do so well in Sanda without training some Sanda.
    Actually personally I'm very fond of Sanda's ruleset allowing takedowns. I'd love it if we could have one rule format to encompass sanda, kickboxing, and muay Thai. Essentially have muay Thai rules but allow takedowns.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ali. R View Post
    I’ve sent a lot of overzealous men down to their knees with that... watch the wonderful reaction/whimper you’ll get from that person.

    The ‘ginger fist’ really works.

  11. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    If Don Wilson is a Kung Fu teacher, I think that's your answer Bacon. You wouldn't draw any more kick boxing from Go Ju Ryu than you would from Kung Fu.

    Jason Yee trained Praying Mantis and Hung Gar. He was also a forms champion.
    I'm saying it's a confounding variable as is any kickboxing training. For example Thai pads, focus mitts, boxing gloves, etc haven't exactly used used in TCMA before the last few decades. I wouldn't consider using that equipment and training as a kickboxer traditional CMA training and I'd be willing to bet they all did so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ali. R View Post
    I’ve sent a lot of overzealous men down to their knees with that... watch the wonderful reaction/whimper you’ll get from that person.

    The ‘ginger fist’ really works.

  12. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by LaRoux View Post

    As far as a headlock goes, sure it's easy, but no one would do it because it's such a bad idea. Again, put your thinking cap on here for a second. What happens when you put a heallock on someone in MMA?
    I've used headlock from clinch many times, put weight on the neck and undercuts to the ribs.

  13. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon View Post
    Actually personally I'm very fond of Sanda's ruleset allowing takedowns. I'd love it if we could have one rule format to encompass sanda, kickboxing, and muay Thai. Essentially have muay Thai rules but allow takedowns.
    This is done quite often. China and Thailand do several "versus" fights with combined rules. Essentially your allowing elbows into sanda and throws/sweeps into muay thai.

  14. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon View Post
    I'm saying it's a confounding variable as is any kickboxing training. For example Thai pads, focus mitts, boxing gloves, etc haven't exactly used used in TCMA before the last few decades. I wouldn't consider using that equipment and training as a kickboxer traditional CMA training and I'd be willing to bet they all did so.
    Well it's modern equipment. I've always used mitts and pads in Karate and Kung Fu. I'm not sure when the modern style mitts and pads came into being, but I got to believe Muay Thai didn't have them, in the same form as today, if you go back to the past.

  15. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I've used headlock from clinch many times, put weight on the neck and undercuts to the ribs.

    Is this what you are describing as a headlock?


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