Angles, Chum Kiu, the Blind Side, and Mike Tyson

[Vajramusti]

Didnt say there wasnt any power Joy, just not as much

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Our footwork could be different. I have put lots of practice into it and other stepping so as not to leak power..
I am not arguing.

[wingchunIan]

Every action should attack the opponents attack unlike other systems such as the Ip Chun lineage where they are always stepping to the side or pivoting away. In my lineage we go in the opposite direction to Ip Chun

Only found this because it was quoted by Glen. It goes goes to show that whatever your claims to the contrary you have very limited (arguably that should be no) knowledge of the Ip Chun lineage. Stick to commenting on what you do and leave commenting on what others do to those that actually have some idea.

[wingchunIan]

Thats much how id do it, we dont turn for the sake of it and im not a fan of turning strikes in WC, you lose facing which to me is one of the main ideas of WC

Think we might have different ideas of what is reffered to as a turn. As a convenient point of reference in the WSL vid science of in fighting he reffered to it as a shift from memory. You should still be facing your opponent and be able to reach them with both arms the only difference in range between the two arms is an inch or possibly two. The only reason for the range difference is because as you turn the hip of the striking arm moves forward towards the opponent by an inch or so and the non striking hip moves back by the same distance.

[GlennR]

Only found this because it was quoted by Glen. It goes goes to show that whatever your claims to the contrary you have very limited (arguably that should be no) knowledge of the Ip Chun lineage. Stick to commenting on what you do and leave commenting on what others do to those that actually have some idea.

I think youll find it was Graham

[GlennR]

Think we might have different ideas of what is reffered to as a turn. As a convenient point of reference in the WSL vid science of in fighting he reffered to it as a shift from memory. You should still be facing your opponent and be able to reach them with both arms the only difference in range between the two arms is an inch or possibly two. The only reason for the range difference is because as you turn the hip of the striking arm moves forward towards the opponent by an inch or so and the non striking hip moves back by the same distance.

Yeh i get that, im still not a huge fan of the turn to strike in WC all the same.

Just my preference.

[Graham H]

Only found this because it was quoted by Glen. It goes goes to show that whatever your claims to the contrary you have very limited (arguably that should be no) knowledge of the Ip Chun lineage. Stick to commenting on what you do and leave commenting on what others do to those that actually have some idea.

Could somebody (Glenn) please quote this post so that Ian can see it.

Ian I was involved in the Ip Chun lineage for a very long time. I have trained with many of Ip Chun's followers inside and outside of Hong Kong. I have met Ip Chun on several occasions and been to his seminars. I also know people that were involved in that lineage for 20years or more and they share the same opinion as me.

I know exactly what I'm on about and my opinion stands.

When it comes to Wing Chun, Ip Chuns version is one of my least favourites. I'm not saying that nobody in that lineage can fight. I'm just saying that as a combat system it is riddled with flaws.

I am not so far away from you and your peers are even closer. I have no problem in showing you why I have this opinion rather than do pathetic stuff like put people on ignore lists!!!

[Graham H]

My point......................

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvnas8sC4Fw

[LFJ]

Could somebody (Glenn) please quote this post so that Ian can see it.

Ian I was involved in the Ip Chun lineage for a very long time. I have trained with many of Ip Chun's followers inside and outside of Hong Kong. I have met Ip Chun on several occasions and been to his seminars. I also know people that were involved in that lineage for 20years or more and they share the same opinion as me.

I know exactly what I'm on about and my opinion stands.

When it comes to Wing Chun, Ip Chuns version is one of my least favourites. I'm not saying that nobody in that lineage can fight. I'm just saying that as a combat system it is riddled with flaws.

I am not so far away from you and your peers are even closer. I have no problem in showing you why I have this opinion rather than do pathetic stuff like put people on ignore lists!!!

My point......................

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvnas8sC4Fw

Some good example bits of turning the opponent, angling, and facing in here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=km7xuoeF5B0

[wingchunIan]

I think youll find it was Graham

Didn't mean it was from you, rather that I only saw it because you quoted his post. Graham is on my ignore list so i don't see his posts.

[Graham H]

Graham is on my ignore list so i don't see his posts.

What a Poof!

[Graham H]

Some good example bits of turning the opponent, angling, and facing in here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=km7xuoeF5B0

Some good examples yes.

[wingchunIan]

Thanks LFJ for reposting.

Could somebody (Glenn) please quote this post so that Ian can see it.

Ian I was involved in the Ip Chun lineage for a very long time. I have trained with many of Ip Chun's followers inside and outside of Hong Kong.

Your observations and level of understanding of what we do would suggest otherwise.

I have met Ip Chun on several occasions and been to his seminars.

aren't you the one who normally draws the distinction about training and seminars when ever WSL is mentioned?

I also know people that were involved in that lineage for 20years or more and they share the same opinion as me.

I know exactly what I'm on about and my opinion stands.

I dispute that you know what you are talking about re the Ip Chun lineage but you are of course entitled to an opinion as are the others that you mention

When it comes to Wing Chun, Ip Chuns version is one of my least favourites.

Fair enough that is your choice

I'm not saying that nobody in that lineage can fight. I'm just saying that as a combat system it is riddled with flaws.

Again you are entitled to your opinion, the many that have and do train within the lineage and fight as doormen, prison officers, police, bodyguards and in a few cases paid matches along with those who have had course to use it in self defence scenarios would obviously all disagree.

I am not so far away from you and your peers are even closer. I have no problem in showing you why I have this opinion rather than do pathetic stuff like put people on ignore lists!!!

I doubt that I will take you up on the offer, if I decide to explore the PB methods at any point I'll get over to Germany and talk with the man himself. Thanks for the offer though and who knows we may get to train together at some point.
As for putting you on my ignore list, if all of your posts were like the one above then you would not be on my ignore list. I am always happy to have open exchanges of ideas and adult conversations however opposed the viewpoints are. There are others on this forum that have similar views to yourself but whose posts I am happy to read. I got fed up of reading posts filled with childish comments and insults that detracted from threads I was reading and hence individuals got added to ignore list which I believe is its intended purpose.

[Graham H]

Your observations and level of understanding of what we do would suggest otherwise.

So I would be happy for you to show me then we can at least be on the same page.

aren't you the one who normally draws the distinction about training and seminars when ever WSL is mentioned?

Yes but I have been in the room with the guy and practiced his teachings. I did not have that with WSL.

I dispute that you know what you are talking about re the Ip Chun lineage but you are of course entitled to an opinion as are the others that you mention

I am interested to find out otherwise. Maybe my former teachers were not a good advert.

Fair enough that is your choice
Again you are entitled to your opinion, the many that have and do train within the lineage and fight as doormen, prison officers, police, bodyguards and in a few cases paid matches along with those who have had course to use it in self defence scenarios would obviously all disagree.

men can fight without Martial Arts. Its the system I'm unhappy with not the people inside.

I doubt that I will take you up on the offer, if I decide to explore the PB methods at any point I'll get over to Germany and talk with the man himself.

If you contact PB he will tell you to contact me depending on your location or Desmond Spencer in London.

Thanks for the offer though and who knows we may get to train together at some point.

That would be interesting.

As for putting you on my ignore list, if all of your posts were like the one above then you would not be on my ignore list. I am always happy to have open exchanges of ideas and adult conversations however opposed the viewpoints are. There are others on this forum that have similar views to yourself but whose posts I am happy to read. I got fed up of reading posts filled with childish comments and insults that detracted from threads I was reading and hence individuals got added to ignore list which I believe is its intended purpose.

The majority of the threads on this forum turn into trash. I find it amusing sometimes and a little bit of mud slinging doesn't harm anybody mate.

[GlennR]

What a Poof!

Thans Graham, didnt know you could say poof here....... ya poof!

[LaRoux]

I know these are different topics, but look at this clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VB6F22feBiI

That float step to the angle is awesome. You guys got any thoughts on what we are developing in WCK facing that fits in here?

The guy that did this clip was one hell of an armchair quarterback if you ask me. And that's a definite compliment.

The key to Tyson's success with his angles was tying that in with both his head movement and his devastating hooks and uppercuts. Without those, he would have been just an average fighter, if even that.