Bench press, flys, or neither?

[Frost]

If my goal was to improve punching power I'd get really strong at squat, deadlift, and bench press so that my muscles are able to generate a lot of power, and also make sure my punching form and technique are good.

But I see what you're saying.

why would you need to bench squat and deadlift to punch when the maximum weight you will be moving is about 16oz??
Come to think of it why do you need to generate a lot of power in a vertical, static line (squat and deadlift) and hold your core muscles statically when the power for a punch comes from powerful rotation at the core with a split stance and foward not upwards momentum?

[Frost]

Well thanks for all the replies . I'll probably stick with bench and dumbbell press as it's the general idea that that's more beneficial than flies, along with doing the basics, dips, pull-ups push-ups etc. Also bawang, for the power you were saying to press fast, how fast would you say? And with how much? About 40% max?

Bawang is on a west side trip i think the below is west side template for explosive bench
firstly remember its not fast its explosive, ie throw it up:
Typically that for a raw lifter is 55-65% of your raw i rep max, best way to do it is to wave, so week 1 55% 8 sets of 3 reps, 1 min rest between each set
week 2 60% for 3 reps 8 sets 1 min rest
week 3 65% for 3 reps 8 sets 1 min rest
week 4 start over again with the same weight as in week 1, there is no need to recalculate your figures

[bawang]

Bawang is on a west side trip i think the below is west side template for explosive bench
firstly remember its not fast its explosive, ie throw it up:
Typically that for a raw lifter is 55-65% of your raw i rep max, best way to do it is to wave, so week 1 55% 8 sets of 3 reps, 1 min rest between each set
week 2 60% for 3 reps 8 sets 1 min rest
week 3 65% for 3 reps 8 sets 1 min rest
week 4 start over again with the same weight as in week 1, there is no need to recalculate your figures

6 sets for drug free lifters

[sanjuro_ronin]

Everything is relative.
To improve punching power you need to have good form/technique so that your whole body weight is behind the punch and it is explosive and you need to have good follow-through and that comes from hitting the bag and pads.
That said you also need strong muscles in your WHOLE body and as such, a good strength training regime will enable your body to have the strength to punch correctly and with impact.

[Frost]

Everything is relative.
To improve punching power you need to have good form/technique so that your whole body weight is behind the punch and it is explosive and you need to have good follow-through and that comes from hitting the bag and pads.
That said you also need strong muscles in your WHOLE body and as such, a good strength training regime will enable your body to have the strength to punch correctly and with impact.

yep but striking is such a speed strength event i would play devils advocate and say if you did press ups, core work, medicine balls throws and hit the bag you dont need to lift weights as well its just taking time away from skill work

[sanjuro_ronin]

yep but striking is such a speed strength event i would play devils advocate and say if you did press ups, core work, medicine balls throws and hit the bag you dont need to lift weights as well its just taking time away from skill work

Oh for sure, many a great fighter has developed KO power with NO weights BUT, as you know, punching power is something that you are born with.
Sure you can always develop it to it's fullest extent BUT if you are not born with it you will always be at a disadvantage to someone that was born with it and does also train.
The crucial element is transference of impact force, all the strength and speed and weight in the world means very little if you can transfer it to the target and do enough damage to compromise it.
And that, in my view, comes from bag and pad work ( and sparring of course).
That said, strength training will give your muscles the strength they need for the task being done.
It must be made clear that a good punch is a combination of gross and fine motor skills and as such, never should ST take priority over training that actual technique.
ST is, for a MA, supplementary work.

[SevenStar]

why would you need to bench squat and deadlift to punch when the maximum weight you will be moving is about 16oz??
Come to think of it why do you need to generate a lot of power in a vertical, static line (squat and deadlift) and hold your core muscles statically when the power for a punch comes from powerful rotation at the core with a split stance and foward not upwards momentum?

I wouldn't worry about bench press, but legs, shoulders and explosive power are components of a good punch. some of the most explosive athletes in the world are powerlifters. from that perspective, the explosive power going into the punch is developed through motions like the deadlift, which works every muscle in the body.

it's also no secret that punching begins with connection to the ground. driving power with the legs. the stronger your legs are, generally the more power your punches can carry.

[SevenStar]

If my goal was to improve punching power I'd get really strong at squat, deadlift, and bench press so that my muscles are able to generate a lot of power, and also make sure my punching form and technique are good.

But I see what you're saying.

I agree, but I'd sub the bench press with the push press.

[SevenStar]

yep but striking is such a speed strength event i would play devils advocate and say if you did press ups, core work, medicine balls throws and hit the bag you dont need to lift weights as well its just taking time away from skill work

looking at it that way, your medicine ball throwing is taking away from skill work as well. Do you need to lift? nah. but why not go in with every advantage possible? as sanjuro said, not everyone is born with KO power - look at mayweather. Some people are born KO kings - look at tyson. I prefer to have every advantage I am capable of having.

[Frost]

I wouldn't worry about bench press, but legs, shoulders and explosive power are components of a good punch. some of the most explosive athletes in the world are powerlifters. from that perspective, the explosive power going into the punch is developed through motions like the deadlift, which works every muscle in the body.

it's also no secret that punching begins with connection to the ground. driving power with the legs. the stronger your legs are, generally the more power your punches can carry.

the deadlift mechanics more closely resemble a lift/bodylock throw than anything else really, explosive power when you are moving such a tiny amount of weight really doesnt need deadlift type of motion to build it
It doesnt matter if you squat 400 or 100 pounds it will make little difference to your punch because you are coming no where near your maximum potential, and to get explosive power in the legs id go for a medicine ball throw it works the specific muscles: legs core shoulder triceps etc in the manner you will be using them to throw a punch

[bawang]

Do you need to lift? nah.

in traditional, "external" kung fu, yes you do.

why would you need to bench squat and deadlift to punch when the maximum weight you will be moving is about 16oz??

because it improves your overall base strength, your GPP

the squat/deadlift is a main "gong" in traditionla kung fu.

[Raipizo]

Off topic a little bit but have you guys ever used a rope for arm exercises?
Such as http://www.youtube.com/watch?nomobile=1&v=uDLQVXTJ5ow

[SevenStar]

Battling ropes are kick ass. I use them.

[Raipizo]

So you recommend them? You use them at a gym or you bought them for your house? If so where'd you buy yours.

[SevenStar]

I'm a trainer. My gym has some that I use with my clients and that I use myself. You can get them in sports stores such as sports authority, or get them online through companies such a perform better.