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Thread: Wing chun kuen What happen in 1855

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  1. #1

    Wing chun kuen What happen in 1855

    So, today we have data to see what extremely likely to happen in 1850 wing Chun kuen evolution.


    1. 1855 is the years Lee Man Mau lead his army toward kwang Xi and the burning of fine jade in canton.

    2. Prio to 1855, wing Chun is taugh in a one set system. Where we know, both the Wong wah Bo line and the yik kam line inherited them. One can read the Wong wah Bo inheritance of one set system from Leung Jan teaching.


    3. At 1855, lee man mau and his hung mun army when to kwan Xi and start up a kingdom called the great achievement kingdom. This is recorded in the Chinese history. Yik kam is a supporter of lee man mau army. Both of them are opera artists.

    While in canton, the Qing destroy the fine jade which involve the traitors of hung mun, after the burning, the fut Shan group which lead by Leung LAN Kwai or nick name Ng mui, reorganize the WCK one set system into a three sets system , which is application focus different then the one sets system which is body of the art and application balance focus. The intention is to quickly capable of revenging against the traitors,

    These traitors are either hung mun traitor or taiping heavenly kingdom traitor, they are CLF train. This is where the sensitivity between WCK and CLF started.

    But WCK and CLF are allied in the uprising to against Qing infact, As one can see from the evidence of lee man mau group in kwang Xi, namely, the yik kam lineage or WCK and the co existance of the WCK and CLF in the cho family art.

    So, the group went to kwang Xi with lee man mau doesn't adapt to the three sets system because they are in a different location. While the fut Shan WCK group adapted the three sets system as the standard there on, and one can see these with the art Leung Jan passing down, with both one set system and three sets system , but one set system fade away.


    4. as from the Leung jan and many red boat WCK teaching, WCK is a family art which passed by the yim family to the Leong family, from leong LAN Kwai genertion WCK spread out to the wong wah Bo, yik kam......etc . The members are limited to family relative, close friends in hung mun, or within red boat opera. after the 1855 fine jade assocition destruction it further spread out in the red boat related members.


    5. The story of burning of shao Lin is about the burning of fine jade association, Ng mui is leong LAN Kwai, the cretion of shao lin art against qing is the creation of three sets to revenge the traitor 1855.


    6. Thus, we know any lineage of WCK which goes Pre 1855 is a one set system. Three sets system is post 1855. Via the kuen kuit of the one set system and three sets system of this era we can observe what is WCK very likely to be in that era.


    7. Wing Chun is not weng Chun. As we know the wing chun history above and also the kuen kuit of siu Lin tau in that era. As for weng Chun Evidentally it evolve CLF set such as the peng kuen which is a very different combart principle and engine development.
    Last edited by Hendrik; 03-12-2013 at 12:03 PM.

  2. #2
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    A very nice story, thank you. Is there any evidence to support the details as they relate to Wing Chun history?
    "No contaban con mi astucia!" --el Chapulin Colorado

    http://www.vingtsunaz.com/
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  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Grumblegeezer View Post
    A very nice story, thank you. Is there any evidence to support the details as they relate to Wing Chun history?
    Sure, it is based on Chinese history facts and evidence.

    There will be an article in the new martial hero hong kong magazine which present these in details from different source of the history.

    From the chinese history side, the triad side, the qing side, the WCK lineages side, the technical signature side....etc . These data support the above WCK story.


    These result of the research is make public to promote more research into it. We might not know the exact but we know the ball park because we do have access to critical keys elements of 1855.


    Let the evidence speaks. The more wcners research the better. I am just one of wcner.
    Last edited by Hendrik; 03-12-2013 at 01:24 PM.

  4. #4
    Lee man mau's order in writing

    http://www.fotoe.com/image/10943052

  5. #5
    Sword of the small knive society Shang hai , the ally of lee man mau of 1854 uprising. They all hung mun members same with yik kam.

    http://www.google.com/search?q=點春堂+小...Aul1xQ4ipVM%3A



    Point spring hall of Shang hai , the head quarter of the small knive society.
    http://www.google.com/search?q=%26%2...ipJKBxq880M%3A



    Spring means opera.

    One can read about this connection in here
    http://www.wingchunpedia.org/pmwiki/...ByHendrikSanto


    Next time you are in Shang hai go there and take some photo with the knive of 1855 era exhibit
    Last edited by Hendrik; 03-12-2013 at 01:23 PM.

  6. #6
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    So basically, what you did was take a bunch of stories you read on the internet (many of which are unverifiable), put them together as what you think may have happened? And now an article is coming out which will prove it all eh? What an a55-clown.

    What is most rediculous is your ide of WCK and CLF 'coming together' to do anything. You make it sound like there was a big gang of WCK people coming together with another gang of CLF people. What is this, west side story? Very interesting story, but that's all it is - your made up his-story to try in vain, yet again, to pass off this one-set theory of yours. You have no evidence of any of this.
    Nice try but I think I'd rather read Dr. Suess.
    Last edited by JPinAZ; 03-12-2013 at 02:17 PM.
    What chi sau is, or isn't, or is, or wait, what is it..: http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/foru...2&postcount=90

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    Sword of the small knive society Shang hai , the ally of lee man mau of 1854 uprising. They all hung mun members same with yik kam.

    http://www.google.com/search?q=點春堂+小...Aul1xQ4ipVM%3A



    Point spring hall of Shang hai , the head quarter of the small knive society.
    http://www.google.com/search?q=%26%2...ipJKBxq880M%3A



    Spring means opera.

    One can read about this connection in here
    http://www.wingchunpedia.org/pmwiki/...ByHendrikSanto


    Next time you are in Shang hai go there and take some photo with the knive of 1855 era exhibit
    More "scientific research".......

    Its not.

    Never was.

    And never will be.

    Its you grasping at straws trying to find evidence to make you theories fit.

  8. #8
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    1
    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    So, today we have data to see what extremely likely to happen in 1850 wing Chun kuen evolution.


    1. 1855 is the years Lee Man Mau lead his army toward kwang Xi and the burning of fine jade in canton.

    2. Prio to 1855, wing Chun is taugh in a one set system. Where we know, both the Wong wah Bo line and the yik kam line inherited them. One can read the Wong wah Bo inheritance of one set system from Leung Jan teaching.


    3. At 1855, lee man mau and his hung mun army when to kwan Xi and start up a kingdom called the great achievement kingdom. This is recorded in the Chinese history. Yik kam is a supporter of lee man mau army. Both of them are opera artists.

    While in canton, the Qing destroy the fine jade which involve the traitors of hung mun, after the burning, the fut Shan group which lead by Leung LAN Kwai or nick name Ng mui, reorganize the WCK one set system into a three sets system , which is application focus different then the one sets system which is body of the art and application balance focus. The intention is to quickly capable of revenging against the traitors,

    These traitors are either hung mun traitor or taiping heavenly kingdom traitor, they are CLF train. This is where the sensitivity between WCK and CLF started.

    But WCK and CLF are allied in the uprising to against Qing infact, As one can see from the evidence of lee man mau group in kwang Xi, namely, the yik kam lineage or WCK and the co existance of the WCK and CLF in the cho family art.

    So, the group went to kwang Xi with lee man mau doesn't adapt to the three sets system because they are in a different location. While the fut Shan WCK group adapted the three sets system as the standard there on, and one can see these with the art Leung Jan passing down, with both one set system and three sets system , but one set system fade away.


    4. as from the Leung jan and many red boat WCK teaching, WCK is a family art which passed by the yim family to the Leong family, from leong LAN Kwai genertion WCK spread out to the wong wah Bo, yik kam......etc . The members are limited to family relative, close friends in hung mun, or within red boat opera. after the 1855 fine jade assocition destruction it further spread out in the red boat related members.


    5. The story of burning of shao Lin is about the burning of fine jade association, Ng mui is leong LAN Kwai, the cretion of shao lin art against qing is the creation of three sets to revenge the traitor 1855.


    6. Thus, we know any lineage of WCK which goes Pre 1855 is a one set system. Three sets system is post 1855. Via the kuen kuit of the one set system and three sets system of this era we can observe what is WCK very likely to be in that era.


    7. Wing Chun is not weng Chun. As we know the wing chun history above and also the kuen kuit of siu Lin tau in that era. As for weng Chun Evidentally it evolve CLF set such as the peng kuen which is a very different combart principle and engine development.
    Hendrik,
    A very unique perspective of wing chun history! i enjoyed reading it

  9. #9
    The art, the people, the history, and the era. All fits into a single picture.
    It tells what happen, why, who, when, where and how.

    Ten years ago people might not be able to accept it. Ten years later people will have even more accurate details to present it.


    It is a time all WCK lineages union and strengthen the root , a neccesary step before the next evolution which grow wing Chun kuen further.

    Quote Originally Posted by kung fu fighter View Post
    Hendrik,
    A very unique perspective of wing chun history! i enjoyed reading it
    Last edited by Hendrik; 03-12-2013 at 04:18 PM.

  10. #10
    [QUOTE=Hendrik;1218278]


    So, the group went to kwang Xi with lee man mau doesn't adapt to the three sets system because they are in a different location. While the fut Shan WCK group adapted the three sets system as the standard there on, and one can see these with the art Leung Jan passing down, with both one set system and three sets system , but one set system fade away.


    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The one set system has not faded away. It takes time to be taught and to learn the full set.
    The parts of the set are interconnected- but most students don't finish the set in a systematic way.

  11. #11
    Great sharing, the more WCK preserve the stronger the art. The better the further evolution is.

    [QUOTE=Vajramusti;1218430]
    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post


    So, the group went to kwang Xi with lee man mau doesn't adapt to the three sets system because they are in a different location. While the fut Shan WCK group adapted the three sets system as the standard there on, and one can see these with the art Leung Jan passing down, with both one set system and three sets system , but one set system fade away.


    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The one set system has not faded away. It takes time to be taught and to learn the full set.
    The parts of the set are interconnected- but most students don't finish the set in a systematic way.

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