Dan Chi Sau - Ideas
On the Gary Lam Interview thread, Kevin made an interesting point about Dan Chi Sau:
Originally Posted by
k gledhill
The error of arm sensing bs starts at Dan chi sao with the simple words , now feel the opponents arm and block it, elbow ideas have been lost for " feel me , follow you, feeling me ..." : /
As most people learn Dan Chi Sau before moving onto Poon Sau/Chi Sau, it really is a good place to start thinking about how the aims/ideas of the system are taught.
When I studied with a Wing Chun group in the past, Dan Chi Sau was taught in the following way:
You started with one person connecting with a partner (both in YJKYM) using Tan and Fook. I was told that my elbow should not be too close to the centerline when in Tan, because it was easier for the guy in Fook to punch through. The Tan and Fook were joined, so to speak, but I was taught the arms should be light in the contact - no pushing forward or down, left or right, just bridged and relaxed.
I was also taught that for the opening movement, when the person in Tan attacks with a palm strike, the person in Fook sinks the elbow and arm down a little and converts to Jum Sau to stop/block the attack. You stuck to the opponent's limbs so you could feel where his attacking comes from.
Where I study now the emphasis is different.
We start the same way (YJKYM + Tan and Fook), but the elbows should be in and there should be forward force from the elbow. We are taught to try and keep the forearm and wrist relaxed, but to try and drive the limb forward from the elbow (at this stage of the training).
Essentially the Tan wants to go forward and convert into a punch, as does the other guy's Fook, but as both are doing the same thing (forward force from the elbow), on the same line, stick is created and neither can 'get through'.
When the person in Tan starts the cycle with the palm strike, the structure changes slightly with the strike, as does the direction of force. The person in Fook Sau doesn't convert it to Jum to block the palm strike, the Fook coverts to Jum because with the changing Tan (to palm strike), the Fook automatically moves forward to strike with the elbow down (as we would punch).
From there, the basic cycle moves through the next stages, punch and Bong, back to Tan and Fook, but the emphasis remains the same - the stick is created because you are trying to strike to center, and so too is the other guy. When there's no stick, your strike moves in.
(the bong sau is a little different in the sense that it is not trying to punch per se, but the forward force is there - the hand trying to spring into the center - using the same rattan-cane or springy force that Leung Ting writes about)
As a cooperative drill, you stay within the confines of cycle (unless you are working other ideas, and then things might free up/have variations).
The added benefit of the stick is that it can (once you move into Chi Sau proper with both arms), and if you are maintaining good position and structure, help you understand what your opponent's potential options are (by reflex, rather than trying to take the time to think about it ).
So the approach I learned in the past is very different to the one I learn now. Perhaps the one I learn is also very different to Kevin's.
But basically, what I wanted to ask is:
How do you train Dan Chi Sau, what are the ideas within it (as these ideas probably carry over into the rest of your Chi Sau training)?
Last edited by BPWT; 06-27-2013 at 12:56 PM.
No mocking, tongue-in-cheek signature here... move on.