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Thread: WSL on LSJC

  1. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Paddington View Post
    I do not have the money or time to travel to train with those people.
    Well then you will never understand it. No point in continuing.

  2. #47
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    You're just difficult to understand, Graham, because in one post you'll say it's wrong, and in the next post you'll say it's for beginners; you'll say it was not replaced but expanded upon, then you'll say it's wrong again. So I'm not sure what your stance on it is.

    Does PB not teach this idea WSL is showing in the video at all? Not even to beginners? Does it have a place in PB's VT curriculum at all?

    ...because WSL obviously taught it.

    If PB evolved his system and doesn't include this stage that's fine too. You prefer his method to WSL's, as do all those students who learned from them both.

  3. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by LFJ View Post
    You're just difficult to understand, Graham, because in one post you'll say it's wrong, and in the next post you'll say it's for beginners; you'll say it was not replaced but expanded upon, then you'll say it's wrong again. So I'm not sure what your stance on it is.

    Does PB not teach this idea WSL is showing in the video at all? Not even to beginners? Does it have a place in PB's VT curriculum at all?

    ...because WSL obviously taught it.

    If PB evolved his system and doesn't include this stage that's fine too. You prefer his method to WSL's, as do all those students who learned from them both.
    It would be clear in person just like it is with everybody I show and explain it to away from this forum. Ask T_Ray. I went to his school for a weekend. He doesn't have any trouble understanding it all. In fact everything is clear. If you want to blame the way I write it up to you me old china!

  4. #49
    ............................and he's met PB

  5. #50
    ..................and he left his old lineage

  6. #51
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    Well, it's a simple question to answer really if you learned with PB from scratch. Does PB ever teach the idea shown by WSL in the video, at beginning stages, or does he not?

  7. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by LFJ View Post
    Well, it's a simple question to answer really if you learned with PB from scratch. Does PB ever teach the idea shown by WSL in the video, at beginning stages, or does he not?
    I didn't learn from PB from scratch. Like most people who become his students I had a lot of sh1t to change and the realization that my Ving Tsun was incorrect and I had wasted 8 years on it was a bitter pill to swallow.

    He also explains the contents of WSL's videos and why things are the way they are.

    If we are talking about videos I have seen footage of WSL teaching in the school. Correcting students and giving advice. All the same stuff as PB. In fact when I was in Spain a while ago one of PB's long serving students said the stuff we do is the same as when WSL was alive and well.

    I have no questions

  8. #53
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    So is that a roundabout way of saying 'yes', or you're not sure because you didn't learn the beginning stages of PBVT?

    Sounds like a yes; PB also teaches the springing energy effect of LSJC to beginners, as WSL did.

    So the only misconception about it is that that's all there is to LSJC, as some understand it.

  9. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by LFJ View Post
    So is that a roundabout way of saying 'yes', or you're not sure because you didn't learn the beginning stages of PBVT?

    Sounds like a yes; PB also teaches the springing energy effect of LSJC to beginners, as WSL did.

    So the only misconception about it is that that's all there is to LSJC, as some understand it.
    No he doesn't teach the springy effect of LSJC. Springy force BS is born from prolonged arm contact which in fighting there is none. If you want to call the force created when you take your arm away during a chi sau drill, springy force, that's up to you.

    I don't explain it that way. That makes me happy

  10. #55
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    Anyone remember the situation with the Algerian extremists in the 90’s, they banded together to attack all those who did not share there feeling and beliefs even other muslims who were not following the true word...... when they had done with attacking outsiders they had nothing left to do other than turn in on themselves and start attacking those within their own extremis community who had slightly differing views and who weren’t as strict in their believes as they should have been……..does that remind anyone of any group on this forum

  11. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    Anyone remember the situation with the Algerian extremists in the 90’s, they banded together to attack all those who did not share there feeling and beliefs even other muslims who were not following the true word...... when they had done with attacking outsiders they had nothing left to do other than turn in on themselves and start attacking those within their own extremis community who had slightly differing views and who weren’t as strict in their believes as they should have been……..does that remind anyone of any group on this forum
    So you are comparing a hobby/pastime/social activity to a situation with Algerian extremists?

    This forum has it all! lol

  12. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    Anyone remember the situation with the Algerian extremists in the 90’s, they banded together to attack all those who did not share there feeling and beliefs even other muslims who were not following the true word...... when they had done with attacking outsiders they had nothing left to do other than turn in on themselves and start attacking those within their own extremis community who had slightly differing views and who weren’t as strict in their believes as they should have been……..does that remind anyone of any group on this forum
    Not so much as it reminds me of the entire WCK community in general.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham H View Post
    No he doesn't teach the springy effect of LSJC. Springy force BS is born from prolonged arm contact which in fighting there is none. If you want to call the force created when you take your arm away during a chi sau drill, springy force, that's up to you.

    I don't explain it that way. That makes me happy
    Okay. Then his teaching method differs from WSL who did explain it that way.

    In WSLVT, it's a teaching technique trained in beginning stage chi-sau drills to ensure proper application of forward intent and correct elbow position for fighting. If the effect is not happening it is an indication of an error in one of those things. So it should help to train away those errors.

    It is less relevant in later gwo-sau stages and in fighting where there is less arm contact. We are not looking for it but it may still happen because it doesn't require prolonged chi-sau style contact. With proper forward intent and elbow position even a millisecond flick of contact on the arm will cause a slight forward springing effect like the pluck of a guitar string. You may not notice this happening because fighting is fast and you're focused forward already. But if it doesn't actually happen it may be the result of hesitation or bad position.

  14. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayfaring View Post
    Not so much as it reminds me of the entire WCK community in general.
    Not only WC. Most martial art communities. In fact any area where debate is created. All different people with all different ideas and opinions. The human factor as always.....................

  15. #60
    Okay. Then his teaching method differs from WSL who did explain it that way.
    Yes because unlike most PB wasn't only present just for seminars.
    In WSLVT, it's a teaching technique trained in beginning stage chi-sau drills to ensure proper application of forward intent and correct elbow position for fighting. If the effect is not happening it is an indication of an error in one of those things. So it should help to train away those errors.
    What do you mean correct elbow position? The elbow is not fixed. Only for training. Explain what you mean s'il vous plait

    It is less relevant in later gwo-sau stages and in fighting where there is less arm contact. We are not looking for it but it may still happen because it doesn't require prolonged chi-sau style contact. With proper forward intent and elbow position even a millisecond flick of contact on the arm will cause a slight forward springing effect like the pluck of a guitar string. You may not notice this happening because fighting is fast and you're focused forward already. But if it doesn't actually happen it may be the result of hesitation or bad position.
    Plucking guitar strings in a fight?

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