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[anerlich]

Just a btw but a Serbian TWC master and 300 strong group all defected to pb recently. For the same reasons. : )

To be fair, William Cheung should be in the Guinness Book of Records for the number of instructor level students having defected from him over close to five decades. They are legion.

I know a significant number - the first having busted up with him in the late 1960s. By all accounts he was never an easy man to work for or get along with. I've witnessed this first hand and seen and heard tons of hearsay.

I'm glad this was just a BTW and you weren't trying to score a point for pb or anything

[LaRoux]

To be fair, William Cheung should be in the Guinness Book of Records for the number of instructor level students having defected from him over close to five decades. They are legion.

Yet someone from his lineage is the only one who is able to provide evidence of his fighters winning consistently using the WC he has taught them. Interesting.

[LFJ]

Yet someone from his lineage is the only one who is able to provide evidence of his fighters winning consistently using the WC he has taught them. Interesting.

So they are the only ones into sporting competition, and that matters why?

[LaRoux]

So they are the only ones into sporting competition, and that matters why?

Sporting or non sporting, it doesn't change the cold hard fact that they are the only ones who have provided consistent evidence of their WC actually working in full-contact situations. Everyone else has only pontificated.

[LFJ]

And that matters why? Wing Chun training is personal. If only matters if you can use it successfully. You should concern yourself with your own training.

[LaRoux]

And that matters why? Wing Chun training is personal. If only matters if you can use it successfully. You should concern yourself with your own training.

It simply gives them much more credibility than the no-evidence pontificators who post about their made-up exploits using their supposed WC.

[LFJ]

Not sure why that concerns you so. You post more about that than you do discussing their actual system. If you don't think it works you can discuss why you think not, or just not come here and be bothered by the pontification.

[Paddington]

I am not a PB exponent and I have not spent time training with any of PB's students. However, like neil I too found that a lot of what was taught under the Ip Chun and Ip Ching families, just does not work in proper fights or heavy contact sparring. IMO WSL's and others' (that shall remain nameless) interpretations are superior under this context i.e. fighting.To be positive also; from my own experience of training with a very well known student of Ip Chun, the major strengths were the development of relaxation, sensitivity and speed.

However, given the 'traditional' training methods it is very rare that students there would be tested under more realistic contexts.

I remember the furor that kicked up at one gathering in HK where Ip Chun said he would like to see wing chun develop more into a 'past-time' that promoted 'health and an active life' a la 'common' tai chi. Of course this 'focus' would be at the expense of treating wing chun as the combat art that it is. For better or worse I see this attitude in a lot of Ip Chun's students.

[sihing]

Evidence is only needed when ur trying to prove it to others, LAroux seems to want us to do this for him, sorry to break it too Laroux but that is not our responsibility, it is always urs to prove to urself that what u train in works for u. Here on the forum all we can use is words to describe our experience and thoughts on things VT related, which is a poor representative of what that acrually means for us on a personal basis, as my factual experience is only a story for u as it is related here in words.

J

[Paddington]

[...] sorry to break it too Laroux but that is not our responsibility, it is always urs to prove to urself that what u train in works for u. [...]

No words are 'truer' I think.

[Graham H]

He doesn't look like much a fighter to me!

[Frost]

He doesn't look like much a fighter to me!

If he is who guy B thinks he is, La Roux would hand everyone on this thread their backsides in both armed and un armed combat, yours and mine included

[Kellen Bassette]

Now in response to your comment above I'm posting a KK clip. Yes, as Kevin noted, the techniques are strange, mysterious and like monks sending people bouncing away ...almost. You can tell the stuff is mysterious if you turn up the sound track!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6STx6...5FF7C6BCE786AB

I'm not going to touch on how realistic any of this is, but I did notice one thing that was interesting. He seems to keep his chin tucked the entire time he demos. I may be wrong about this, but I was under the impression WC kept the chin raised. Are some of the lineages training with "tucked chin," or is this an example of "bad WC?"

[Neil-Y]

He doesn't look like much a fighter to me!

PMSL....I quite like her atmospheric tunes ;-)

[Graham H]

If he is who guy B thinks he is, La Roux would hand everyone on this thread their backsides in both armed and un armed combat, yours and mine included

You may well be right but on this forum most of us don't know each other personally so why speculate?

We haven't got to the stage where people are going to start knocking on doors have we? lol

BPWT and Keith Myers will be kicking my door in soon then!

Ving Tsun wars!