Secret Wing Chun Form

[Graham H]

I thought Wing Chun was all about reducing superfluous stuff(?)

Exactly but reading through Keith Myers posts you would think otherwise!

[k gledhill]

Thanks Neil, yes I expect you can hazard a guess to which "wing chun" group I might be referring too.
After leaving this group I am very glad to be back on a training path which is correct for me.

Also it could be a lot worse, I could think that this "develops skills need to progress in wing chun", really??!!
http://youtu.be/hWHnbM7IHhw

Lmao ! Things people "do for the fu" : )

[k gledhill]

That was SAS Martials Arts in London, and yes that was serious according to them.
It's run by "Master" Andrew Sofos, not sure about the lineage.

http://www.saswingchun.com/master-andrew-sofos

I met Sid Sofos and Andrew , cult approach. Testimonials at the end of class, strict arse kissing by greatness of grade ; ).

[Paddington]

That was SAS Martials Arts in London, and yes that was serious according to them.
It's run by "Master" Andrew Sofos, not sure about the lineage.

http://www.saswingchun.com/master-andrew-sofos

If memory serves that is the brother of Sid Sofos who reached a certain level of notoriety, for all the wrong reasons of course! There were and still are a number of embarrassing videos of sid and an entire website dedicated to debunking him and bringing to light his cocaine habit and tendency to rip people off and 'brainwash' them. I have no idea if that site is still there.

[LoneTiger108]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHCq...e_gdata_player

Wooopsy.....the secret is out

Do you even know who or what you are looking at?

Not the same form dude but I don't think it really matters. Looks like this thread is dead as Zed

[KPM]

Exactly but reading through Keith Myers posts you would think otherwise!

Please just post something of actual value and stop with the insulting pot shots and taunts. Why are you here Graham?

[hulkout]

People get way too hung up on forms. Your structure, technique, and sensitivity is fare more important than the order of the movements in the form. That so-called fourth form is just a combination of bits and pieces from the 3 main forms in Wing Chun. It was probably invented for the purpose of demos. Seriously, who cares? These are all movements we know. Just the order is different, so why is that such an issue? I will say though that for a demonstration of their lineage and school, some of those guys in that video are horrible. There's no sinking at all. They're at the same height as they are when they're just standing normally. And those Biu Jee kop jarn elbows are just awful. Why do so many people come down with the inside soft part of their elbow joint? You've got to turn it completely over and strike with the hard part of your upper forearm/elbow. It just drives me nuts whenever I see that. Try making contact with the way these guys are doing it and see how your elbow feels.

[LFJ]

And those Biu Jee kop jarn elbows are just awful. Why do so many people come down with the inside soft part of their elbow joint? You've got to turn it completely over and strike with the hard part of your upper forearm/elbow. It just drives me nuts whenever I see that. Try making contact with the way these guys are doing it and see how your elbow feels.

Because it's not a strike, as far as I understand from lineages who do it (mine doesn't). What you're talking about is more like gwai-jaang which turns over and strikes. Kap-jaang is done as an arm-lock controlling technique where you press down with the arm, not striking anything. If you turn over too far they can twist out of it. To keep them where the pressure is tight on their wrist and locks their whole arm, your arm must remain level and just 'press' directly down, which is what the name means.

[hulkout]

Because it's not a strike, as far as I understand from lineages who do it (mine doesn't). What you're talking about is more like gwai-jaang which turns over and strikes. Kap-jaang is done as an arm-lock controlling technique where you press down with the arm, not striking anything. If you turn over too far they can twist out of it. To keep them where the pressure is tight on their wrist and locks their whole arm, your arm must remain level and just 'press' directly down, which is what the name means.

I know what you're saying, but like many techniques, there are many uses of it. Yes it can be used in the way you're describing, but it could also be a strike. Train movement over technique. If your arm gets choked up, you could get out of it with the downward elbow which would get you back to a good position. But suppose your arm is close to your opponent's head. Then depending on your angle you could use either a horizontal or downward elbow or a horizontal angle. Either way, the part to strike with is the hard part of the upper forearm elbow. That soft inside part is very sensitive with a lot of nerves there. Your "funny bone" is there too. You want to protect that part of your arm. People can talk all day about technique, lineage, or whatever, but you can't escape biological facts. That part of the arm is very sensitive and weak and that's a fact.

[LFJ]

I know what you're saying, but like many techniques, there are many uses of it. Yes it can be used in the way you're describing, but it could also be a strike. Train movement over technique. If your arm gets choked up, you could get out of it with the downward elbow which would get you back to a good position. But suppose your arm is close to your opponent's head. Then depending on your angle you could use either a horizontal or downward elbow or a horizontal angle. Either way, the part to strike with is the hard part of the upper forearm elbow. That soft inside part is very sensitive with a lot of nerves there. Your "funny bone" is there too. You want to protect that part of your arm. People can talk all day about technique, lineage, or whatever, but you can't escape biological facts. That part of the arm is very sensitive and weak and that's a fact.

Uh, yeah... Perhaps that's why they don't use it as a strike?

What you are describing is either gwai-jaang (diagonal) or pai-jaang (horizontal) elbows. That's why some lineages have three distinct elbows in their BJ form, because they have different functions. As I've seen, they don't use kap-jaang as a strike. So...

[wingchunIan]

if anyone has a clip of kup jarn being used as an arm lock as suggested by LFJ i'd be really interested in seeing it (genuinely). I use it as a strike and simultaneously a trap or wrist release or both but for me the direction of force whilst having a downward element is forward to the jic seen

[LFJ]

if anyone has a clip of kup jarn being used as an arm lock as suggested by LFJ i'd be really interested in seeing it (genuinely). I use it as a strike and simultaneously a trap or wrist release or both but for me the direction of force whilst having a downward element is forward to the jic seen

22:22 http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMzQwNjM4MzUy.html