Kung Fu and fighting

[YouKnowWho]

training low but fighting high does not work. You have to train how you use it,

The low stance training is to separate "man" from "boy".

The low stance training is to push your body to the limit. I have always believed that you train just like you fight. But if you don't push yourself hard enough, you can only be on an average level, and you will not be able to move yourself to much higher level.

If you can hold on your opponent's waist belt and throw him over your head (you have to sink down very low), when you grab on your opponent's arm, you can easily throw him over your head.

If you can do the following drill. You will have no problem to escape your leg when your opponent attack your leg.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKCSiZs7RYI

If you can walk in duck walking in fast speed, you will be able to move fast in any stances.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-z1jNVfy-GI

[Faux Newbie]

The low stance training is the separation between "man" and "boy".

The low stance training is to push your body to the limit. I have always believed that you train just like you fight. But if you don't push yourself hard enough, you can only be on an average level, and you will not be able to move yourself to much higher level.

If you can hold on your opponent's waist belt and throw him over your head (you have to sink very low), when you grab on your opponent's arm, you can easily throw him over your head.

If you can do the following drill. You will have no problem to escape your leg when your opponent attack your leg.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKCSiZs7RYI

I agree that low helps some things, but if you train striking exclusively low, and then fight, I have not seen this work.

If you can walk in duck walking in fast speed, you will be able to move fast in any stances.

Muscular strength is important, but beyond that, if one doesn't have good technique in footwork, they will still be slower than someone who does.

I am not criticizing deep stances for a purpose, but to achieve that purpose, you still need to do moves in their natural stance a lot.

[Faux Newbie]

To clarify. Moving fast in striking AND being aware of what an opponent does has more to do with economy of motion and good ability to read the opponent than strength. If you cannot read the opponent, and always react at the last moment, your footwork will lumber compared to them regardless of your strength. If your economy of motion is poor, obviously this is an issue as well.

Working low stance does not solve either issue. Sparring in low stance with others who do so does not either, as speed is relatively slow.

Leg strength is important, but does not solve these problems. Light footwork comes from method, knowing efficient ways to transfer weight and knowing how to read opponents. Strong legs alone are just strong legs.

[David Jamieson]

why bench press 200lbs?

When are you gonna need to lift 200 lbs?

when you bench press mostly.

[sanjuro_ronin]

I used to do low stance work, good solid work.
I am talking with a weight vest even and sometimes a partner on my shoulders.
I thought that was real tough.
Then a did a 20 rep squat program and died.
For those of you that don't know, a 20 rep squat set is where, after you warm up for a couple of sets, you do 20 reps with a weight that you can only do for 10 reps.
Yes, you heard me.
Then you collapse, puke, crap yourself and die.

Lots of things seem tough, until you do tougher.

[sanjuro_ronin]

why bench press 200lbs?

When are you gonna need to lift 200 lbs?

when you bench press mostly.

Well, if you are into fat chicks...

[YouKnowWho]

I agree that low helps some things, but if you train striking exclusively low, and then fight, I have not seen this work.

I didn't know you were talking about "striking art" only. Since most striking art has throwing skill "hidden" in it, their low stance training may be the same as the "throwing art".

I once spared with a Karate guy. I dropped in a very low fighting stance. My opponent didn't know how to attack me since he was good in high kicks. After that sparring, he refused to spar with me. He made a comment, "You Kung Fu guys just stand too low."

[YouKnowWho]

To clarify. Moving fast in striking AND being aware of what an opponent does has more to do with economy of motion and good ability to read the opponent than strength. If you cannot read the opponent, and always react at the last moment, your footwork will lumber compared to them regardless of your strength. If your economy of motion is poor, obviously this is an issue as well.

Working low stance does not solve either issue. Sparring in low stance with others who do so does not either, as speed is relatively slow.

Leg strength is important, but does not solve these problems. Light footwork comes from method, knowing efficient ways to transfer weight and knowing how to read opponents. Strong legs alone are just strong legs.

You are talking about combat "development" and "testing". I'm talking about combat "enhancement". Both are needed and there is no argument on that.

Here is my personal experience. I don't do traditional forms any more (I know more than 50 forms). I have replaced it by my combo drills training. One day I suddenly felt something was wrong. I could train my combo drills for 30 minutes none-stop but I don't felt tired at all. When I trained forms, I could get tired in 20 minutes non-stop training. I then realized that since my combo drills were the same as my combat application, I didn't sink low enough, and my body didn't turn to the maximum. I then modified my combo drills to be much lower, more turn, more extension, more ...

[Faux Newbie]

I didn't know you were talking about "striking art" only. Since most striking art has throwing skill "hidden" in it, their low stance training may be the same as the "throwing art".

I once spared with a Karate guy. I dropped in a very low fighting stance. My opponent didn't know how to attack me since he was good in high kicks. After that sparring, he refused to spar with me. He made a comment, "You Kung Fu guys just stand too low."

LOL!

We don't have to talk striking exclusively, since a lot of kung fu is both.

I think stance strength is important, especially for throwing.

I also think speed for footwork in striking is based more on reading your opponent and efficiency of motion.

That said, in striking, even if you are good at reading an opponent, you can be fooled, and will need all the leg strength you can use to redirect and make up for the mistake.

That said, even in throwing, especially in throwing, there are times where setting up your opponent will depend more on reading their movements and efficiently moving with the slightest use of strength.

[Faux Newbie]

You are talking about combat "development" and "testing". I'm talking about combat "enhancement". You have to go through "develop" and "test" stages before you can take the "enhance" stage. There is no argument on that.

I don't do traditional forms any more (I know more than 50 forms). I have replaced it by my combo drills training. One day I suddenly felt something was wrong. I could train my combo drills for 30 minutes none-stop but I don't felt tired at all. When I trained forms, I could feel tired in 20 minutes non-stop training. I then realized that since my combo drills were the same as my combat application, I didn't sink low enough, and my body didn't turn to the maximum. I then modified my combo drills to be much lower, more turn, more extension, more ...

I follow you. For me, I tried to get around this when I focused more combo drills by often trying to fit in ankle pics from my style and other moves that require the lowest stances. In push hands, we called these "dropsies", at least every third move had to be this kind of move.

This way, if I want the leg workout, it's there, without making other aspects that shouldn't be carried out low in combat done differently for the sake of my workout. Plus, instead of always being low, a premium is placed on getting low quickly.

[YouKnowWho]

For me, I tried to get around this when I focused more combo drills by often trying to fit in ankle pics from my style and other moves that require the lowest stances.

The way that I modified my combat drills (use kick, punch to set up throw) is I always image that I'll smash the back of my opponent's head onto the hard ground. This way I have to force my hand to touch the ground which is some extra challenge that I didn't have before.

Here is an example.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTF8...ature=youtu.be

[Faux Newbie]

The way that I modified my combat drills (use kick, punch to set up throw) is I always image that I'll smash the back of my opponent's head onto the hard ground. This way I have to force my hand to touch the ground which is some extra challenge that I didn't have before.

I will definitely remember that for certain moves! Thanks!

[Faux Newbie]

Here is an example.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTF8...ature=youtu.be

I actually do this with this same move, but I am definitely going to start focusing more on the stance in throws in combos. Again, thanks!

[Faux Newbie]

Then you collapse, puke, crap yourself and die.

At least you die relieved.

[TenTigers]

"the first martial arts fantasy film"

and the last, thank G'd

you left out, "Gymkata."