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Thread: UFC's Lyoto Machida + His Wrestling Coach Kenny Johnson: Chi Sao + Takedown Defense D

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  1. #1
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    UFC's Lyoto Machida + His Wrestling Coach Kenny Johnson: Chi Sao + Takedown Defense D


  2. #2
    Good interview...Machida is a perfect example of training traditional arts realistically....
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

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    Good clip. It's posts like this that keep me coming back to this forum.
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    An MMA champion doing Chi Sao? Say it ain't so!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by KPM View Post
    An MMA champion doing Chi Sao? Say it ain't so!!!
    it isn't so, he was doing some hibred stuff mixing his close range karate hand fighting with his sumo hand fighting he has never had a wing chun class in his life, then what you have is someone classing it as chi Sao because they don't know any better

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    it isn't so, he was doing some hibred stuff mixing his close range karate hand fighting with his sumo hand fighting he has never had a wing chun class in his life, then what you have is someone classing it as chi Sao because they don't know any better
    I think they mention JKD in that clip and it seems that there has been a wider trend of JKD instructors getting into mma gyms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    it isn't so, he was doing some hibred stuff mixing his close range karate hand fighting with his sumo hand fighting he has never had a wing chun class in his life, then what you have is someone classing it as chi Sao because they don't know any better
    Nobody said it was specifically Wing Chun Chi Sao. Chi Sao just means "sticking hands." So from a rather generic perspective, what they are doing is "Chi Sao." And it bears a pretty good resemblance to the "Poon Sao" rolling that the Mainland versions of Wing Chun do. I used to roll with a 6th degree Black Belt in Kenpo using a loose "Poon Sao" platform. He considered it to be "Chi Sao" in a general sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    it isn't so, he was doing some hibred stuff mixing his close range karate hand fighting with his sumo hand fighting he has never had a wing chun class in his life, then what you have is someone classing it as chi Sao because they don't know any better
    This.......................
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    Last edited by kung fu fighter; 11-08-2013 at 07:16 AM.

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    ok so what exactly are these clips meant to show that's big country a man known for his wild overhand punching style, granite like chin and bjj blackbelt, secretly loves chi Sao and wing chun and that's why he wins in the Ufc?? Event though his style is about as un wing chun as you can get??

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    lol big country always reminded me of a tank abbot type of fighter but with a little more polish.
    Originally posted by Bawang
    i had an old taichi lady talk smack behind my back. i mean comon man, come on. if it was 200 years ago,, mebbe i wouldve smacked her and took all her monehs.
    Originally posted by Bawang
    i am manly and strong. do not insult me cracker.

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    I can't buy that drill being some sort of grappling drill. It looks to me like some sort of defense against striking.

    Wrestling already has drills to develop attributes for wrestling roughly analogous to what chi sao does for striking. They are called pummelling and handfighting.

    WC makes much of chi sao developed sensitivity. Grapplers need the same sensitivity but in multiple ranges and planes and for the entire body. Good grappling is as much about redirecting and borrowing force as is good WC. I very much doubt that a decent grappler would find their game enormously enhanced by learning chi sao, other than perhaps as an interesting diversion with some possible marginal benefits.
    "Once you reject experience, and begin looking for the mysterious, then you are caught!" - Krishnamurti
    "We are all one" - Genki Sudo
    "We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion" - Tool, Parabol/Parabola
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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by anerlich View Post
    I very much doubt that a decent grappler would find their game enormously enhanced by learning chi sao, other than perhaps as an interesting diversion with some possible marginal benefits.
    The same could be said for a decent striker.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dlcox View Post
    IMO aspects of chi sao could be elevated by utilizing some of the principles found in grappling especially in the clinch, but unfortunately this may contradict some of the principles of traditional WC chi sao.
    When you protect your center from inside out, a right Tan Shou followed by a left Tan Shou, you can wrap both of your opponent's arms. You can then do whatever you want after that.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwX9-7fkD0Y

    As showing in the above clip, if your opponent's arm spins with your arm, you may need to wrap his arm more than once. Now we are not talking about straight line any more. If you don't go beyond WC principle, you will never be able to open that "grappling" door.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 11-10-2013 at 03:32 AM.
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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonzbane76 View Post
    lol big country always reminded me of a tank abbot type of fighter but with a little more polish.
    Compared to Roy Nelson, Tank Abbot is nothing. He had some wrestling and he could hit hard. Not to say he didn't have his qualities, it's just the Nelson is on a another level. It's more than a a lil polish. Better chin, better hands, better wrestling, he actually has a submission game. Nelson is no dummy. He also isn't a complete douche, which is something a can't say about Abbott. I gotta say, I did like watching him try to throw people out of the cage though.

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