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Thread: Train for self-defense

  1. #16
    I'm inclined to agree with Laroux and Lucas here. If you actually want to be able to "win" a street fight...your best bet is to train to fight, (the way a sport fighter would) and add concepts of dirty fighting.

    If your method of training is to focus on conceptual dirty fighting, but not undergo fight training, I think your chances of success are significantly lower.

    It's best if we can admit that "self defense" is western marketing gimmick. You can't sell TMA to suburban kids by telling their soccer moms you want to brainwash them to create a hardened fighter.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    It's best if we can admit that "self defense" is western marketing gimmick. You can't sell TMA to suburban kids by telling their soccer moms you want to brainwash them to create a hardened fighter.
    Starry eyed chi mongers won't buy it either.

  3. #18
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    It's probably just as simple as training to defend oneself vis a vis a martial art.

    To train for self defense there are many modes. They almost always involve the use of a non-compliant resisting or crowding partner.


    Otherwise, everything is just training.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    If you actually want to be able to "win" a street fight...your best bet is to train to fight, (the way a sport fighter would) and add concepts of dirty fighting.

    If your method of training is to focus on conceptual dirty fighting, but not undergo fight training, I think your chances of success are significantly lower.

    It's best if we can admit that "self defense" is western marketing gimmick. You can't sell TMA to suburban kids by telling their soccer moms you want to brainwash them to create a hardened fighter.
    This is very true. The idea that you can learn to apply specific 'tricks' to survive dangerous situations is a very dangerous one.

    In all probability, referring to MA as 'self-defense' was far more tasteful to upper-class Victorian-era sensibilities than 'hard, bruising, sweat-wringing training'. For the most part, these were the ones who were first exposed to Asian MA in the West.

    OTOH, Kevin73 raises a good point as well. There are a lot of factors, and I've also known some people who could never have functioned effectively in a competitive sports environment who successfully 'defended' themselves. And I know of some competitive fighters who have been successful on the street, and some who were not.

    'Self-defense' is awareness, to avoid and/or escape a situation. Nothing wrong or shameful in that. This should be a part of a MA education. Because too many people are simply unaware. Especially these days, when any 10 year-old can pull a trigger.

    But the MAs themselves were intended to harden you for combat. In terms of actual life or death scenarios, they are the last resort when all else has failed.

  5. #20
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    I train strictly for self-defense. I want to defend myself hahaha

    No but seriously, I get in the ring with people and try to use controlled techniques when they are "dirty" and I use "ring" techniques with as much power as fits the situation.

    My best friend and I were at college and we asked some local TKD guys to spar. When asked we were told they couldn't do it because they might kill us. We honestly thought they were joking...they weren't.

    We train to spar and fight and we also train the dirty stuff that we use when doing different "door man" jobs.

  6. #21
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    In defense of self, there is no such thing as "dirty"
    "The true meaning of a given movement in a form is not its application, but rather the unlimited potential of the mind to provide muscular and skeletal support for that movement." Gregory Fong

  7. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by dlcox View Post
    Self defense is studied by those who do not have time or a want of committing to studying TMA.
    I concur....
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  8. #23
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    It's a fact: 95% of people who say they study martial arts for "self-defense" are paranoid weirdos.
    "I'm a highly ranked officer of his tong. HE is the Dragon Head. our BOSS. our LEADER. the Mountain Lord." - hskwarrior

  9. #24
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    fear of retaliation for 400 years of slavery and oppression.

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  10. #25
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    Someone asked, "How is competition or sport testing self defense?"

    Whoever like to use the term "self-defense" always like to get knife fight involved. Their argument are since sport fight doesn't deal with knife fight, sport fight is not good for self-defense.
    http://johnswang.com

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  11. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Someone asked, "How is competition or sport testing self defense?"

    Whoever like to use the term "self-defense" always like to get knife fight involved. Their argument are since sport fight doesn't deal with knife fight, sport fight is not good for self-defense.
    And that argument will actually hold some weight when they regularly engage in real "unarmed vs. knife" fights.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  12. #27
    If someone is going to attack you with a knife, you are better off throwing something at them and running the F away

    If you are unarmed and they know what they are doing, you are likely going to DIE

    The dog brothers discuss the knife when someone is experienced in "die less often".. you should note the title!!!!

    The other reality is that all the effective programs in knife defense (not fool proof, but at least proven) are based upon what is labeled "SPORT FIGHTING" ... "die less often", STAB, and RED ZONE

    Or, in other words, if I put on nice puffy gloves and tell you I am going to punch you in the head, and you still can't defend against it, what hope do you think you will have in a full out street assalt
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    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
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    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
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    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Someone asked, "How is competition or sport testing self defense?"

    Whoever like to use the term "self-defense" always like to get knife fight involved. Their argument are since sport fight doesn't deal with knife fight, sport fight is not good for self-defense.
    LOL. For old time's sake, I'll go there. Sort of. It's not that sport fighting isn't good for self-defense, I believe it's a necessary part of the training (i.e. sparring, not competing)...it's just that there are some useful skills for self-protection that sport fighting alone won't develop, that are also good to have. The concept of the knife explains why someone might want to fight with an extended guard or set up a wrist catch, it doesn't mean jab, cross, hook, uppercut is useless...





    As a side note: I don't know why so many of you want to convince people with no interest in competitive fighting that they have no business in martial arts. That would destroy the industry. Do you want Gene to lose his job?

  14. #29
    If you train in a krav maga class or ninjutsu class, is is very different from let's say a judo class. In a ninjutsu class you will do drills with multiple attackers,lots of weapon training,use of and defense against. in your empty hand training you will focus on targets that are usually illegal in competition. in grappling you will also do techniques like small joint attacks,skin grabs throws designed to land a guy on his face..

    I can compare from judo and ninjutsu class two women of about the same size and skill,which would fare better in a real life survival situation. in my opinion the ninjutsu student would. because judo has so many rules. for a small lady to throw and pin a much larger attacker just seems unlikely. where the female ninjutsu student,could use a vicious defense to stun the guy long enough to escape.

  15. #30
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    Without getting too deep in the weeds.
    Train your abilities to fight in the mind of defending yourself.
    It is a viable method of preventing humiliation and in keeping yourself able.

    Some training is better than no training.
    You have to be willful in order to effectively defend yourself.
    That is an important consideration.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

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