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Thread: Choking out children

  1. #16
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    From Gina Carano? I will pay to have her choke me out!
    For whoso comes amongst many shall one day find that no one man is by so far the mightiest of all.

  2. #17
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    do I get an autograph with that as well?
    Originally posted by Bawang
    i had an old taichi lady talk smack behind my back. i mean comon man, come on. if it was 200 years ago,, mebbe i wouldve smacked her and took all her monehs.
    Originally posted by Bawang
    i am manly and strong. do not insult me cracker.

  3. #18
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    You are cutting off the flow of blood to the brain until a state of unconsciousness is reached. That can be very, very damaging, and not worth whatever training effect might be gathered. I saw a guy refuse to tap out once, and a few minutes later he was being taken away in an ambulance. Not worth it. All you need to do is cut off the blood flow for a brief moment, and the panic and sense of impending loss of consciousness is usually enough to drive the point home.
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  4. #19
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    Martial arts are taught for only one good reason. If you can't take it, don't do it. I never felt that kids should be taught any different than adults as they have to be responsible for their actions too. There is a big difference between the RNC and the sleeper. Most people do the choke like they teach in jiujitsu, but the best method is to clench the hands directly in front of the throat and using a thumb into the throat you pull them in tight and sling your victim like a dog slinging a rat. A proper sleeper only cuts off the blood flow until the victim goes to sleep. I started at 10 years of age and by 11 I could choke the snot out of the other kids.
    If you are going to teach kids, then teach them. don't let them grow up with some false sense of confidence. We are only talking about just one move out of many that can cause them injury.
    Jackie Lee

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Chiang Po View Post
    Martial arts are taught for only one good reason. If you can't take it, don't do it. I never felt that kids should be taught any different than adults as they have to be responsible for their actions too. There is a big difference between the RNC and the sleeper. Most people do the choke like they teach in jiujitsu, but the best method is to clench the hands directly in front of the throat and using a thumb into the throat you pull them in tight and sling your victim like a dog slinging a rat. A proper sleeper only cuts off the blood flow until the victim goes to sleep. I started at 10 years of age and by 11 I could choke the snot out of the other kids.
    If you are going to teach kids, then teach them. don't let them grow up with some false sense of confidence. We are only talking about just one move out of many that can cause them injury.
    Nobody's saying don't teach it. We're talking about going to full cycle and actually knocking a child out by cutting off blood supply to the brain. This in and of itself is dangerous, reckless and quite frankly a stupid thing to do.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  6. #21
    Kids class

    only play fight with rules and safety.

    Nothing serious.

    Actually, many adult classes are for wannabe, too.

    Unless, of course you are training for pro ring fights or job requirements.


  7. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by -N- View Post
    Any volunteers?



    Her smile is "deadly" (dearly) enough.

    She had me at smile.

    No need to choke physically.

    I am choked with drooling already.


  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPJ View Post
    Her smile is "deadly" (dearly) enough.

    She had me at smile.

    No need to choke physically.

    I am choked with drooling already.

    If you liked that one...

    Last edited by -N-; 01-10-2014 at 11:02 PM.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Chiang Po View Post
    Martial arts are taught for only one good reason. If you can't take it, don't do it. I never felt that kids should be taught any different than adults as they have to be responsible for their actions too. There is a big difference between the RNC and the sleeper. Most people do the choke like they teach in jiujitsu, but the best method is to clench the hands directly in front of the throat and using a thumb into the throat you pull them in tight and sling your victim like a dog slinging a rat. A proper sleeper only cuts off the blood flow until the victim goes to sleep. I started at 10 years of age and by 11 I could choke the snot out of the other kids.
    If you are going to teach kids, then teach them. don't let them grow up with some false sense of confidence. We are only talking about just one move out of many that can cause them injury.
    Agreed!

    If you teach martial arts, then teach the whole shabang. Don't teach some watered down, candy a$$ version of martial arts. Leave that to the fakes.

    I don't teach children. My school is only open to teenagers and adults. I don't believe children should be trusted with the responsibility that comes with learning TCMA.

    I learned hadaka-jime (rear naked choke/figure four choke) as a teenager and have used it many times in fights. It was usually enough to only apply the hold until the opponent realized he was screwed. It took the fight right out of them.

    TCMA is equally dangerous for teens and adults. Any person of any age can die from a choke hold gone wrong, even if properly applied. It is the risk one takes. So, the teacher and the individual student has to decide if they feel it is worth the risk.
    Last edited by mooyingmantis; 01-11-2014 at 06:46 AM.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooyingmantis View Post
    I don't teach children. My school is only open to teenagers and adults. I don't believe children should be trusted with the responsibility that comes with learning TCMA.
    There's a benefit for learning at an early age.



    TCMA is highly selective about who is accepted(and allowed to continue) as a student, whether child or adult.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooyingmantis View Post
    Agreed!


    TCMA is equally dangerous for teens and adults. Any person of any age can die from a choke hold gone wrong, even if properly applied. It is the risk one takes. So, the teacher and the individual student has to decide if they feel it is worth the risk.

    Actually, you have no moral right whatsover to decide that it's ok to endanger someone's life, child or adult. Justifying it by saying that they shouldn't be there if they can't take it is just an obnoxious justification for bullying or very poor coaching practice.
    Last edited by Miqi; 01-11-2014 at 07:35 AM.

  12. #27
    Well... there's a line there. I'm not sure where it is though. You can find danger in anything. As human beings we take risk for gains, and that's just how it is. Is it immoral to teach kids how to do air flairs? Cause there is a high level of danger there if done recklessly and if done properly, you bring that down to light to moderate. How about gymnastics? These little kids are being encouraged to do crazy shit and yes, some die. I have had far more injuries from dancing and gymnastics than from MA's. Should we not teach those to kids? Do we leave the decision to the parents? What if the parents are morons? This, like any other issue worthy of debating, is a tough balance.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syn7 View Post
    Well... there's a line there. I'm not sure where it is though. You can find danger in anything. As human beings we take risk for gains, and that's just how it is. Is it immoral to teach kids how to do air flairs? Cause there is a high level of danger there if done recklessly and if done properly, you bring that down to light to moderate. How about gymnastics? These little kids are being encouraged to do crazy shit and yes, some die. I have had far more injuries from dancing and gymnastics than from MA's. Should we not teach those to kids? Do we leave the decision to the parents? What if the parents are morons? This, like any other issue worthy of debating, is a tough balance.
    Well that's true, but in the case of gymnastics, although abuse can and does sometimes occur, we're not talking about peope justifying carrying out acts of simulated, or real, violence under the pretence of being 'instructors' in some kind of so-called martial art. Skateboarding and gymnastics are dangerous, but they don't provide an opportunity for some charlatan to play out their fantasy of being martial arts expert by attacking other people in a quasi-cut environment. But yes, your point is taken and accepted.

  14. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Miqi View Post
    Well that's true, but in the case of gymnastics, although abuse can and does sometimes occur, we're not talking about peope justifying carrying out acts of simulated, or real, violence under the pretence of being 'instructors' in some kind of so-called martial art. Skateboarding and gymnastics are dangerous, but they don't provide an opportunity for some charlatan to play out their fantasy of being martial arts expert by attacking other people in a quasi-cut environment. But yes, your point is taken and accepted.
    Fair enough. I was talking more about the inherent dangers of physical activity and the morality behind where that line should be. I would put the gymnastics instructor who abuses the kids(I don't mean sexually, that's another matter) in the same category as the sadistic MA instructor.

    It is an interesting debate when you get into how far one should take training with people of any age, let alone kids. We don't want them to be pussies, but we don't wanna abuse them either. The problem is, to not be a pussy, you have to take a certain amount of abuse. And of course you have to factor in a ton of things like predisposition and all that. But generally, I think you know what I mean. Again, it's a tough balance and we will never have a full consensus on something like this.

    So in a way I'm kind of defending anyone who thinks "they shouldn't be there if they can't take it". So... I wouldn't go that far, I think it's totally valid to want your kid to punch air and prance around in jammies when learning to fight is not the goal. But for those who are tougher and have the ability to take more pain and work harder in that way, it's kind of unfair to make them wait till they are an adult. Of course we have to factor in real health concerns and we shouldn't have 7 year old beating the hell out of eachother, but some will be able to start earlier than others and some will never get there at all. It's just not so black and white.

    I think that in all sports the concerns are more legal than moral. Nobody wants to get sued when some freak accident happens or when some kids being put through the ringer inevitably gets hurt. In any physical activity I ever did getting hurt was just a fact of life for me. I did my best to minimize the risk and mitigate the damages, but I was always aware that if I wanted to push my boundaries and come anywhere near my potential, I had to take risks.
    Last edited by Syn7; 01-11-2014 at 12:00 PM.

  15. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

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