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Thread: The dialectic of yiquan

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  1. #1
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    The dialectic of yiquan

    Marxist cultural theorist Frederic Jameson once said of 'post modernism' that it is something that needs to be defined after our discussion of it, not before. This is because it has no essential meaning, and a process of roundabout consideration of multiple factors is required to see what the idea is really getting at. One cannot, therefore, give a simple, clear definition as a starting point of the discussion. 'Yiquan', which is based on Marxist historical and dialectical materialism, is a very similar phenomenon. I read a post on Facebook recently, from someone I have no respect for, who is a student of someone I have no respect for, claiming that 'Yiquan contains everything that is in wing chun, but wing chun does not contain everything that is in yiquan'. This is such a stupid thing to say, and so obnoxious and childish. 'Yiquan' is a dialectical phenomenon, meaning that it has no essential meaning, no essential content, and certainly no essential 'level' or level of ability. Yiquan's primary dialectic is between theory and praxis - such that each individual who practices yiquan is a unique product, with a unique expression and level of the art. 'Praxis', which means 'practical as opposed to theoretical skill', includes training methods - and training methods too are dialectically conditioned by historcial, cultural and technical variables, such that the yiquan of the MMA age should look very different to the yiquan of the 1930s. There is no 'one' yiquan, therefore - as each person, and each historical situation in which it is practiced, is very different.

    One of the most interesting things about yiquan, however, is just how many totally - I mean totally - obnoxious frauds it produces. By which I don't mean people who are low level - there's no shame in being a hobby level practitioner. I mean people who have actually totally ignored 'praxis', and parasitised yiquan theory to pretend to have the kinds of skills, and to do the kinds of things, that Wang Xiang Zhai spent his life fighting (literally) against. This is the other side of the dialectical method - the danger of the total over-emphasis of one part of the dialectic over the other. Or rather, the danger of the most obnoxious frauds parasitising the phraseology of the method, turning 'yiquan' in to an open sore of corrupt practice, such that yiquan is if not now actually totally far worse, then at least quite as bad, as the practices that Wang despised. The ideology of this corruption is 'Those who know, know' - i.e. the corrupt nod and a wink of the hoaxer, whose entire basis for claiming knowledge is arcane theoretical nonsense. Fortunately, what they are is its own reward.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48CPY7hWnW8

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    It may not be far from the truth (despite being obviously absurd) but New Qigong went through this Marxist re-assessment phase and many teachers of some renown had to publicly mask their systems in Marxist dialectical BS crap theory just to praise and be praised on they approach to qigong. That was a gold standard to be accepted into the party. Some even went as far to combine Marxist theory and Nationalist jargon to push forward the Falun Gong movement. It end up as "Who is using who? and "For what purpose?

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    the dialectics of yiquan includes photosynthesis, plankton filtration, and reverse osmosis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    the dialectics of yiquan includes photosynthesis, plankton filtration, and reverse osmosis.
    The elements of sewer system TCMA regenerative effluent!

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    ‘Dialectic method’ does not mean ‘balance’ or a combination of opposites; it means an active relationship in which the halves of the dialectic have an ongoing ‘conditioning’ or ‘grooming’ effect on one another, leading to a synthesis.

    The idea is complex, hence the scramble-in-the-dirt arguments about ‘what is yiquan?’ which consistently flare up on various forums, usually from people without the slightest understanding of yiquan. There are two common mistakes about ‘what yiquan is’ which I see. It is, unfortunately, difficult to challenge these mistakes because one of yiquan’s key dialectics – that between science and tradition – has been smothered, so that no criticism is allowed, and Wang’s vision of a scientific community in which people engage in honest critique has been overwhelmed by sclerotic and egotistical defence of position. Fortunately, I don’t need the money from teaching, nor any connection with any sclerotic lineage, so I am free to follow Wang’s original advice.

    However, one mistake is signally represented by Andrzej Kalisz, who argues that he only wants to pass on, as precisely as possible, what he has been taught. This is itself a corruption of the principles of yiquan – a corruption which is then passed on in a ‘the medium is the message’ kind of mistake, as his students adopt his mistaken approach. (This is, of course, the sclerotic position of most Chinese martial arts – the false belief that keeping an art as identical as possible to previous generations is somehow a positive. Usually, this only seems correct because most arts actually degenerate as hoaxers parasitise them for egotistical gain.)

    The problem is that yiquan is a dialectic interaction between current state of yiquan and you, as an individual. Yiquan cannot be taught or passed on – the idea is to unfold via intuition your own native ability, multiplied by your own desire to practice, guided via a training framework. No one, in that case, can pass on what they have learned. Each expression of yiquan is individual. It should also be noted that the dialectic of theory and practice means that no one really understands further than their own highest point of practical level – despite the very common practice of martial arts teachers pointing to their abilities to coach beyond their level. Those arguments don’t apply to yiquan in the way that they do to basketball and weightlifting, because they are not dialectic methods; no one can supply the yiquan dialectic of another with a theoretical level which is not in itself originally conditioned by their own level of theoretical understanding, which in turn is conditioned by their own practical ability.

    The second mistake is the argument over whether yiquan is a set of techniques or a general method. This mistake comes from failure to understand the dialectic method. JKD provides a useful contrast here - and I should also say, even though I believe that yiquan's method is ultimately far superipr to JKD's, I've seen scores of JKD practioners with really high level, and only one or two skilled yiquan practioners. Nevertheless... JKD is a set of techniques, taught in a non-dialectical manner. JKD’s theory does not have a dialectic relationship with the techniques; the core ‘theory’ is to establish and learn the simplest set of techniques with the broadest self-defence application. This is often covered by an ideology of ‘liberation’ – as if ‘liberation’ means simply freeing up the rest of your time to do something else, or freeing your ‘ego’ from its insertion into ‘styles’ – as if JKD wasn’t just another style. Yiquan’s dialectical method, by contrast, has no core techniques, and yet, it requires a structured curriculum to encourage the development of intuitive skill. There is, in yiquan, ultimately no technique which ‘is’ yiquan – yiquan is a product; the product of a human being who has gone through a dialectic interaction with a method in order to draw out intuitive skill. Multiple factors will affect that final outcome. However, the ability to issue force with whole body power is the key aim – although, the phrase ‘whole body power’ generally causes people to ‘appoint’ an expectation of something that is much more than it really is. And that is how parasites manage to con the gullible and lazy, by pretending to be able to issue magical levels of force.
    Last edited by Miqi; 12-16-2013 at 03:17 AM.

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    Here is an interesting channel that I have found, where the entire corruption of the Han line of so-called yiquan is documented:

    From the ridiculous frauds:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTfn36wnR1s

    To the silly fraudulence of old Han himself:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCeyIkUjrBI#t=12

    It was always intersting to me why the Han line, or at least, those of it who post on forums, were so obsessed with their 'lineage', and so intent on talking about the toughness of their training, and the seriousness of their great teacher. (Who is that guy on Rum Soaked Fist who is forever talking about the blood curdling Han yiquan training he did, lol). One never sees Yao Zong Xun training with students who 'float off' like this - although, Cui Rui Bin has publicly claimed that he had supernatural powers, lol: http://wulinmingshi.wordpress.com/20...ngxun-part-iv/ .

    I would like to think that the old Han man is just too polite to tell the young training partner to stop being so silly, but the whole line is corrupt with this nonsense, and that, sadly, comes from the source, which is old Han himself. The talk of hard training was, as ever, just humbug - hence the famous video of Han yiquan in action: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4s8l1JyU7NU

    A good example of a corrupted dialectic, and the sclerotic death of a whole branch of yiquan.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miqi View Post
    ‘Dialectic method’ does not mean ‘balance’ or a combination of opposites; it means an active relationship in which the halves of the dialectic have an ongoing ‘conditioning’ or ‘grooming’ effect on one another, leading to a synthesis.

    The idea is complex, hence the scramble-in-the-dirt arguments about ‘what is yiquan?’ which consistently flare up on various forums, usually from people without the slightest understanding of yiquan. There are two common mistakes about ‘what yiquan is’ which I see. It is, unfortunately, difficult to challenge these mistakes because one of yiquan’s key dialectics – that between science and tradition – has been smothered, so that no criticism is allowed, and Wang’s vision of a scientific community in which people engage in honest critique has been overwhelmed by sclerotic and egotistical defence of position. Fortunately, I don’t need the money from teaching, nor any connection with any sclerotic lineage, so I am free to follow Wang’s original advice.

    However, one mistake is signally represented by Andrzej Kalisz, who argues that he only wants to pass on, as precisely as possible, what he has been taught. This is itself a corruption of the principles of yiquan – a corruption which is then passed on in a ‘the medium is the message’ kind of mistake, as his students adopt his mistaken approach. (This is, of course, the sclerotic position of most Chinese martial arts – the false belief that keeping an art as identical as possible to previous generations is somehow a positive. Usually, this only seems correct because most arts actually degenerate as hoaxers parasitise them for egotistical gain.)

    The problem is that yiquan is a dialectic interaction between current state of yiquan and you, as an individual. Yiquan cannot be taught or passed on – the idea is to unfold via intuition your own native ability, multiplied by your own desire to practice, guided via a training framework. No one, in that case, can pass on what they have learned. Each expression of yiquan is individual. It should also be noted that the dialectic of theory and practice means that no one really understands further than their own highest point of practical level – despite the very common practice of martial arts teachers pointing to their abilities to coach beyond their level. Those arguments don’t apply to yiquan in the way that they do to basketball and weightlifting, because they are not dialectic methods; no one can supply the yiquan dialectic of another with a theoretical level which is not in itself originally conditioned by their own level of theoretical understanding, which in turn is conditioned by their own practical ability.

    The second mistake is the argument over whether yiquan is a set of techniques or a general method. This mistake comes from failure to understand the dialectic method. JKD provides a useful contrast here - and I should also say, even though I believe that yiquan's method is ultimately far superipr to JKD's, I've seen scores of JKD practioners with really high level, and only one or two skilled yiquan practioners. Nevertheless... JKD is a set of techniques, taught in a non-dialectical manner. JKD’s theory does not have a dialectic relationship with the techniques; the core ‘theory’ is to establish and learn the simplest set of techniques with the broadest self-defence application. This is often covered by an ideology of ‘liberation’ – as if ‘liberation’ means simply freeing up the rest of your time to do something else, or freeing your ‘ego’ from its insertion into ‘styles’ – as if JKD wasn’t just another style. Yiquan’s dialectical method, by contrast, has no core techniques, and yet, it requires a structured curriculum to encourage the development of intuitive skill. There is, in yiquan, ultimately no technique which ‘is’ yiquan – yiquan is a product; the product of a human being who has gone through a dialectic interaction with a method in order to draw out intuitive skill. Multiple factors will affect that final outcome. However, the ability to issue force with whole body power is the key aim – although, the phrase ‘whole body power’ generally causes people to ‘appoint’ an expectation of something that is much more than it really is. And that is how parasites manage to con the gullible and lazy, by pretending to be able to issue magical levels of force.
    Based on the above and using the language of dialectics then the Wudang abc fits the bill perfectly. It is one thing to have Wudang taijiquan, but then to have Wudang Yang style, Wudang Sun style, etc is pushing the envelope of ridiculousness. Of course, freedom to do so is great for business!

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