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Thread: 摔跤諺語 Shuai Chiao Old Saying

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    摔跤諺語 Shuai Chiao Old Saying

    Someone sent me this through E-mail. It's a good way to understand what "Shuai Chiao" is.

    All discussions are all welcome.

    摔跤諺語精解:::

    要想摔人先學挨摔:摔跤運動是兩人全力以赴,舉手不讓的對抗性運動,在比賽互有輸贏,摔跤也是一項容易受傷 的運動,碰破、擦傷甚至骨折、腦震盪等在所難免,這些傷害事故多在倒地時發生。因此,學習摔跤者應先學會“ 挨摔”——主要指倒地的方法,以避免或減輕損傷。倒地時無論向前倒、向後倒還是向側倒,總的原則是:手掌先 著地,十指向內,屈肘彎臂,緩衝下落,全身保持緊張狀態,屏住呼吸,滾動圓滑。可通過前後翻滾、虎撲等徒手 練習學會各種倒地的自我保護方法。

    Before you learn how to throw people first you learn how to be thrown. Holding your breath, keep your body tense when you fall.

    手是兩扇門,全憑腿贏人:在摔跤中,手是門戶,起著攻前的準備和防守的作用,如抓、握、推、撕、抹、撐.. ..無不用手,可謂 “蛟撩一把手”。然而,在摔跤動作中多以腿使絆子,以腿作為攻擊手段,如勾、挑、撩、撮、爬....無不用 腿,手法進逼快速,運用靈活,而腿則力量大,攻擊性強。摔跤技術原本是手、腳配合,全身協調用力的技巧。因 此,雜訓練過程中,應注意上下——手腳的配合練習,而不應將動作的系列人為的分割開來。 Z

    Hands are like 2 doors, it all depends on the legs to win the fight. All SC throwing use leg but still need to be combine with your hands move.

    寧輸跤,不輸把: “把”是指摔跤中的把位和搶把,把上功夫好壞在某種程度上反映跤手的整體水平。 ”行家一出手,便知有沒有”,因此,搶把在中國式摔跤中佔有重要地位。搶把貴在快、準、固,搶住自己得力的 把位,便可控制對手取得進攻與防守的主動權,也就意味著贏了一半。相反,便輸定了。中國跤術的把位很講究, 每個絆子都有相應的抓搶部位,如正襟、偏門、小袖、大袖、大領、前後中心舉。練把不但要練搶把,同時也要練 開把,即解脫。否則便陷於被動。練好一把手並非容易事,需常年苦練,勤練不輟。 zM.co

    It's OK to be thrown but it's not OK to lose your gribs (lose gribs means your opponent has 2 grips on you but you only has 1 grip on him, or your opponent has 1 grip on you but you have no grip on him). If you win on the grip then you have already win 1/2 of the battle because you have put your opponent in defense mode and you can attack him whenever you want to but he can't. Every throwing requires a precise grip. Not only you need to know how to grab, you also need to know how to break a grab.

    站如熊、臥如虎:對“跤架”的形容。 “跤架”即摔跤的架式,是維持身體重心、保持身體平衡的前提,“手是兩扇門,全憑腿贏人,重心掌握穩,四兩 搏千斤”是對摔跤總的要求;自己重心失掉,其他便無從談起,可見跤架的重要。摔跤的架式有若干種,諸如左架 、右架、小車架、自然架等,其形態表現為站架和臥架。無論採用那種架式,都要求自然有力,剛柔相濟,穩若泰 山。如同熊一樣穩固,虎一樣精神。即使沒有“虎背熊腰”之軀,也需表現“熊風虎威”之勢,也就叫做“失跤不 失態”“失手不失勢”。 Z?L)w1

    SC frame is the body structure that give you the best balance. There are many different frames, such as left side forward, right side forward, high frame, low frame, ... Even if you are not as strong as bear or tiger, you still need to act like bear and tiger. Never lose your aggressive attitude (try to eat your opponent alive).

    走對了步贏跤:摔跤中的步法是維持和調整身體重心的手段,也是攻守動作的前提,在摔跤過程中,雙方大腳步在 不停地運動,“腳步亂,章法亂”,腳步一亂,最易讓對方抓破綻。摔跤常用的步法有蓋步、滑步、跨步、衝步、 跟步、進步、退步、跳步、平行步、車輪步等,在不同情況下不同地運用,但無論運用那種步法,都要講究“步動 重心移”,即重心隨步的變化而移動,否則便失去重心。在摔跤中切忌走“併步(兩腳並立)和“一線步”(兩腳 在一條線上)。

    If your footwork is good, you have better chance to win. Footwork shifts your body weight. SC has cover step, stealing step, skip step, follow step, retreat step, side way step, ... You should never close both feet together or put both feet on one straight line.

    抓把要準,使絆要狠:“抓把要準”是指出手快,搶抓對方的部位準確無誤,只要做到“準”才能節省時間,用絆 及時。要“準”就必須練習把上的功夫,吃透人體移動時把位的變化規律。 “使絆要狠”是說用絆時不要猶豫,要果斷,要全力以赴,不遺餘力。 “狠”不但可以增力,亦可增威,從心理上給對方以威脅。 SX

    When you grab, you should be fast, precise, and mean. You need to understand where and how to grab when your opponent's body is moving. The attitude of "mean" can scare your opponent and put mental pressure on him.

    取勝在變臉:變臉是摔跤技術中的一個關鍵性動作,即在使絆子的同時,將臉向自身的左右或左後、右後快速而有 力地甩動。摔跤的每一個動作都要求身體各個部位的協調配合。比如大別子,我用左腿別摔對方,必須在左腿別的 同時上體右轉,頭下潛,臉向右下方扭轉。在許多動作中,要求頭在先,腰要變在先,以變臉、轉頭帶動上體的運 轉;沒有變臉就談不上提轉,在系列動作中變臉是關鍵性的一環。在解脫、撕把、假動作的運用中,也常常要發揮 變臉的作用。在聯繫基本功時應注意變臉的配合,如抖皮條、擰大棒、推花磚等聯繫,要將步、腰、臉溶成一體, 反复練習便可“習以為常”,“變臉”自然而出。 ir

    The "face changing" is the key for winning. When you throw your opponent to your left, you need to twist your face to your left along with your body spinning. Without "facing changing", there is no full body spinning.

    頭是一把手: “摔跤三隻手,頭是一把手”。頭在摔跤中可以起到以下作用:1。頂:頂住對方的左(右)胸部,限制其進攻; 2。擋:有意擋住對方的視線,破壞對方的視力,限制對方的視野。 3。枕:如使用抱大腿翻及靠、擠等動作時均有頭參與,用頭枕之,以加力量;4。假動作:以頭的晃動作為假動 作來迷惑對方等等。要提高頭的戰術意識。 8LcP

    SC guys all have 3 hands. Your head is the 3rd hand. You can use your head to push on your opponent's chest to prevent him from moving toward you. You can use your head to block your opponent's vision so he can't see what your are doing with your hands and legs. You can use your head to apply pressure on your opponent to help your throw. You can move your head in such a pattern to confuse your opponent so he won't know your intention.

    順人之勢,借人之力:摔跤講究“借勁使勁”,“以化勁”,跤諺有云:”順力破之為巧,逆力破之為拙”。意思 都是說,在摔跤中力量的運用主要依靠巧勁。兩人對摔時均在不停地運動,應善於掌握人的運動規律,從而把握對 方。例如:對方用右手搶抓我的左偏門,其上體勢必向我左後方運動,我便可藉其力的走向採用克敵招術,將其力 化解。 “順勢”“借力”貴在“快”與“巧”。 “快”指以迅雷不及掩耳之勢讓對手防不勝防;“巧”指借力用力的方向、角度、力度要恰到好處。做到這些,首 先應懂得人在摔跤中用力的規律和各種摔跤動作的技術特點。 ^l")

    Follow your opponent's force is called Wha Jin (borrow force). Against your opponent's force is called brute force (force against force). You should have speed just like the thunder that your opponent has no time to cover his ear.

    一力降十會:力量是一切競技運動的基礎,摔跤更是如此。具體而言,摔跤是力與巧的技藝,在雙方技術勢均力敵 的情況下,力量便是取勝的決定因素;倘你力大與彼,對方的技法便難以施展。人的力分為兩種:一是先天自然之 力,即“本力”;二是後天得來之力,即通過鍛煉所得。因此,除自身的“本力”外,且不可忽視力的專門訓練。 爆發力——在最短的時間內發揮肌肉最大的力量,運用在摔跤中尤為重要,在訓練中應著意義、訓練 爆發力。 1I;o_h

    Your strength can beat your opponent's 10 best techniques. When you and your opponent's skill are on the same level, whoever is stronger will win. Explosive powe is a force that generated by your body in the shortest amount of time. It's extream important in SC.

    以巧破千斤:其意思指在兩人對摔中不要用“死勁”“蠻勁”,要善於用“巧勁”,善於借對方的勁使勁,即根據 對手的用力大小、方向、角度,來運用自己的力量,使對方的力量化解甚至變為“負力”。其表現形式如“斜勁化 直勁”“橫刀破直力”“順手牽羊”。 。 。。做到“以巧破千斤”,必須熟悉各種摔跤動作的技法運用,並具備高超的戰術意識、豐富的實戰經驗和手疾眼 快的應變能力。 f

    If you are good at borrowing force then you can defeat 1000 pound of force. You need to analysis your opponent's Jin, his Fajin ability, Jin direction, Jin angle, you then use your Jin to deal with his Jin in order to make his Jin to be a negative Jin (his own Jin against himself).

    吃一不二:“吃一不二”說的是一招取勝後再用此招就不靈了。此條諺語是針對高水平的跤手而言,與“不怕千招 會,就怕一招絕”頗具相對性和辯證性。一個摔跤運動員必須技術全面,戰術多變,經驗豐富,對近攻者而言,則 要求“一專多能”,善於應變,是對手難摸規律,迎接不暇EB

    Don't try to use the same move to beat your opponent twice in a row. This saying assume your opponent has high level skill. This may contradict to the saying, "You are not afraid anyone who know everything. You do afriad someone who has mastered a single move." In general for your defense ability, you still need to know everything.

    解放後的中國跤的規則有了很大的規範。在此基礎上,強調技術性和競技性,把一些危險的技術刪除了。隨著6運 會中國跤退出國家比賽以後,中國跤開始走下坡。蒙古的搏克同外蒙的搏克本來同源,但因為外蒙一直學習蘇聯, 現在外蒙的搏克已經同國際式摔角很相似。如果放棄對中國跤的扶持,用不了多長,中國跤也沒準同國外的摔交同 化了。 -TI©功夫天下--功夫天下,匯集天下功夫Npi

    Th Mongoloan SC got so much Russian wrestling influence and has lose the original flavor. If we don't support SC today, it may be influenced by the foreign grappling art (such as BJJ) and there won't be any SC left.

    摔跤是中國武術中實戰性很強的技術,原中央國術館少林門門長王子平亦高度評價摔跤,將之比喻為「風絞雪」, 形容它像寒冬臘月,北風呼嘯,再加上捲起陣陣夾帶冰雹的雪浪,迎面劈來,以示其凶猛險惡。

    Shaolin master Wang Zi-Ping once said, "SC is just like the north wind blow in the cold winter and carry heavy snow and sleet toward you. It's extream viscious.
    http://johnswang.com

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  2. #2
    Amen to the seizing fiercely comment. I remember the day I realized that still, my grip became useful in one moment. Throws people off, and really doesn't require great strength so much as intent(and some precision).

  3. #3
    Some of the idioms also apply to striking arts.

    Mostly are tactics common to all fighting scenarios.

    Most baffling one for me is that tiger back and bear waist.

    Hu Bei Xiong Yao.

    This posture is stressed in Ba Ji and Mantis.

    There are many interpretations on how to reach that.

    Great post.


  4. #4
    Greetings,

    YKW,

    Re: "The arms are like two doors.." I know this saying is often used for Tan Tui. With Shuai Chiao, wouldn't it be something like "The Legs are like Two Doors" ?

    Just a question,


    mickey

  5. #5
    "The two hands are like doors.

    We depending on legs to win."

    It is to stress the importance of position/step/postures.

    If we only focus on hand positions/postures,

    we lose the big picture. etc.


  6. #6
    I always assumed it meant you have to open those doors, but once there, it's the legs that finish it. For a throw, having the grip secured, you need to legs to produce torque or to cut off their footwork, something like that. I could be wrong.

  7. #7
    Greetings,

    SPJ,

    So then, with what you have described, the legs really are the doors.


    mickey

  8. #8
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    there is a good saying that kung fu guys should know and understand.

    in soft regions are born soft men. - herotodus

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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by mickey View Post
    Re: "The arms are like two doors.." I know this saying is often used for Tan Tui. With Shuai Chiao, wouldn't it be something like "The Legs are like Two Doors" ?
    In Chinese wrestling, you use your arms to achieve "clinch", you then take your opponent down by your "leg skill". So to obtain the "clinch" and then finish with a throw is like to open the door and enter.

    You can use your hands to open your opponent's door in many different ways:

    1. separate both of his arms upward, and enter his front door.
    2. separate both of his arms downward, and enter his front door.
    3. move his right arm upward, his left arm downward, and enter his front door.
    4. move his right arm downward, his left arm upward, and enter his front door.
    5. Move his leading arm to jam his back arm, and enter his side door.
    6. Use arm dragging, to enter his back door.

    Since you will need to use your both hands to open your opponent's front door, side door, or back door, that's why Chinese would call both hands as 2 doors.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 01-16-2014 at 12:28 PM.
    http://johnswang.com

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    No opinion -> no argument

  10. #10
    ah, for this, I will be back in a little while....
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

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    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
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    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
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    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by mickey View Post
    Greetings,

    SPJ,

    So then, with what you have described, the legs really are the doors.


    mickey


    The arms are really the doors because the arms prevent you from getting close enough to your opponent to do a throw.

    When you step in toward your opponent, they can 'post' on you (especially with jacket work) and keep you at a distance.

    For ME, it's easier to circumvent a person's legs than their arms.


    The particular method of getting around someone's ARMS determines the type of throw that I can do.
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RD'S Alias - 1A

    I have easily beaten every one I have ever fought.....

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    取勝在變臉:變臉是摔跤技術中的一個關鍵性動作,即在使絆子的同時,將臉向自身的左右或左後、右後快速而有 力地甩動。摔跤的每一個動作都要求身體各個部位的協調配合。比如大別子,我用左腿別摔對方,必須在左腿別的 同時上體右轉,頭下潛,臉向右下方扭轉。在許多動作中,要求頭在先,腰要變在先,以變臉、轉頭帶動上體的運 轉;沒有變臉就談不上提轉,在系列動作中變臉是關鍵性的一環。在解脫、撕把、假動作的運用中,也常常要發揮 變臉的作用。在聯繫基本功時應注意變臉的配合,如抖皮條、擰大棒、推花磚等聯繫,要將步、腰、臉溶成一體, 反复練習便可“習以為常”,“變臉”自然而出。 ir

    The "face changing" is the key for winning. When you throw your opponent to your left, you need to twist your face to your left along with your body spinning. Without "facing changing", there is no full body spinning.
    One student I trained had a really hard time getting this.

    He had previously trained kung fu and mma, had fought with mixed results, but was very attached to his image as a martial artist who fought.

    Very macho view of things, so he always, always, always had to be pressuring forward on his opponent, which for some things worked fine, but he resisted the idea of face changing on throws, so his throws were always a mess.

    For about a month, I had him working one throw that involves a turn, and for a month he would do it, it would sort of work, I'd explain what he needed to do, and show how it was not supposed to be such a struggle. Never seen anyone fight an idea so hard.

    At the end of the month, I explained, "You think facing where the opponent stands now means being dominant. It doesn't. Dominance doesn't matter, knowing the fight does. Sometimes you have to take a risk and change things dramatically. This is that sort of thing, you have to change your facing, if you have good timing when you do it, you'll have momentary dominance, but it's about being daring sometimes, not worrying about dominance. If you're daring at the right time, no one can stop you." The next time he did it, he did it right.

    Drove me crazy. I told him to turn fully the whole month, only when I made it clear it didn't necessarily make him weaker in the fight did he actually try it as I taught it. As soon as I did it, he said, "Hey, that's a lot easier."

    He was a funny student. Took lots of patience on my part, anything he couldn't immediately apply, he would fight training it. I never expected he would have to do what I do, but while I was teaching him, I was clear that I would teach what I felt needed to be taught. He would fight learning one thing, then see its worth, then fight learning the next. After about eight months, he finally would at least try things the way I showed them, and come to understand them. He was talented, but young, and too focused on ideas of what kung fu is, what mma is, and what being someone who does them means for you, instead of just doing the original goal before the bs that we all pick up along the way, training to be able to use and enjoying the process.

  13. #13
    Comment on Russian wrestling and BJJ or JJJ influences on SC.

    Integration of all techniques is all good.


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