Obasse & Kevin Gledhill chi sau

[dcrjradmonish]

What a challenge should look like just short of hard sparring or a real fight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qR3B...re=c4-overview

And how the aftermath should sound
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd3gw...gccC313SdYSNxg

[Phil Redmond]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AWxxd5ZIDfA

That's footage from when Shawn came by my NYC class. He was doing Chi Sao with my student Sifu Rahsun Herkul who now lives in L.A.

[LFJ]

I said it early in the thread, but if two people argue online and then they meet up to test each other... what was Kevin thinking they'd do? Compare SNT?

It really depends on what exactly they argued about. Do you even know?

You can question Obassi's ability all you want, but he consistently was able to strike Kevin and Kevin could do nothing about it.

I think we saw different videos. I didn't really see anything get through that I would call a strike. Maybe I wasn't watching closely enough?

[slick69]

It really depends on what exactly they argued about. Do you even know?



I think we saw different videos. I didn't really see anything get through that I would call a strike. Maybe I wasn't watching closely enough?

Kevin was being critical of others and Obassi asked him to back it up, Kev did his usual I can take on anyone approach.

I don't think you were watching closely enough. There are clear strikes to the face...

[thedreamer7]

That and the fact that people seem to feel the need to keep apologizing for him or explaining away his poor performance. This thread should have died when the point was made pages ago. But LJF and others seem to keep it chugging along. Of course it seems to be a slow time in the forum. Nothing else much to talk about.

The thread should really be a discussion on how to chi sau correctly against people more physically stronger than ourselves...

[KPM]

I think we saw different videos. I didn't really see anything get through that I would call a strike. Maybe I wasn't watching closely enough?

Yeah, you really need to go back and watch it again. Knee strike at 19 sec, a couple of palm strikes at 24, another knee at 25, a couple of Biu's to the neck at 30..... Now, I'm sure you'll argue that none of these had any power and weren't significant strikes. But by your own description, neither Obasi or Kevin were trying to kill each other. It should be clear to anyone watching (except maybe you) that Obasi could have dialed the intensity up another notch and any one of those would have been damaging. So rather than trying to continue to explain away Kevin's performance, how about we let this thread die a natural death?

[Frost]

Is this thread still going?
Its not that hard to understand what went on, and whats going on here, Shaun has plenty of clips of himself chisaoing with others to know what you are going to get from him, Kevin simply wasn’t able to handle it
Obassi seems to have two modes when chi saoing, going hard when he feels he can because he is not scared of the other guy, and being complaint and nice with teachers he is respectful of and probably a little fearful of (like Emin).
With Kevin he seems to go a little harder than most, cant wonder why this is….. I mean its not like Kevin has a habit of getting people annoyed with all his talk of superior methods and the real VT…oh wait my bad….
And why is this thread so long? because a lot of people hitched themselves to the whole PB/WSL is superior and only got the real wing chun bandwagon kevin championed, so now they have two choices: either keep quiet and leave the thread alone or defend him (and thus by extension themselves and their views) to the hilt anyway they can.

[LFJ]

Yeah, you really need to go back and watch it again. Knee strike at 19 sec, a couple of palm strikes at 24, another knee at 25, a couple of Biu's to the neck at 30..... Now, I'm sure you'll argue that none of these had any power and weren't significant strikes. But by your own description, neither Obasi or Kevin were trying to kill each other. It should be clear to anyone watching (except maybe you) that Obasi could have dialed the intensity up another notch and any one of those would have been damaging. So rather than trying to continue to explain away Kevin's performance, how about we let this thread die a natural death?

Well, I'll give him the knees although they weren't clean- rather awkward, and I don't know if those biu's, if that's what you call them, landed. But as for the "palm" at :24, just before that Kevin did a waang-jeung with clean full-body structure, although he pulled it. This made Obasi jerk his head back as he answered with an overreaching "slap" to the face with his head pulling back, arching his spine.

Comparing these two "palms" (if you want to include Obasi's slap in that definition), if the intensity were turned up, which one do you think would have been more damaging?

It might be argued that Obasi wouldn't strike the same way if the intensity were turned up, but chi-sau should use proper structure and not be a game of "tag" at any level of intensity. That tag nonsense really serves no practical purpose.

Throughout the clip Obasi was overextended and off balance, never really in a position to deliver a significant strike. The significance of any of his strikes would have been adversely affected by his chaotic postures. Kevin on the other hand was balanced and in position to deliver good strikes. He was just holding on and at the mercy of Obasi's chaotic movements. What he should have done is disengaged and started striking more, like than palm, but continually and while driving forward. That would have started to show some PBVT.

[KPM]

Well, I'll give him the knees although they weren't clean- rather awkward, and I don't know if those biu's, if that's what you call them, landed. But as for the "palm" at :24, just before that Kevin did a waang-jeung with clean full-body structure, although he pulled it. This made Obasi jerk his head back as he answered with an overreaching "slap" to the face with his head pulling back, arching his spine.

Comparing these two "palms" (if you want to include Obasi's slap in that definition), if the intensity were turned up, which one do you think would have been more damaging?

It might be argued that Obasi wouldn't strike the same way if the intensity were turned up, but chi-sau should use proper structure and not be a game of "tag" at any level of intensity. That tag nonsense really serves no practical purpose.

Throughout the clip Obasi was overextended and off balance, never really in a position to deliver a significant strike. The significance of any of his strikes would have been adversely affected by his chaotic postures. Kevin on the other hand was balanced and in position to deliver good strikes. He was just holding on and at the mercy of Obasi's chaotic movements. What he should have done is disengaged and started striking more, like than palm, but continually and while driving forward. That would have started to show some PBVT.

Whatever dude! I agree with what Frost wrote above, and your opinion seems to be in a minority here. Either way, I think everyone has said their piece and this thing can end. If someone wants to start a thread on a specific Chi Sao topic related to what has been said, then I'm for it.

[sanjuro_ronin]

I think the issue is, when it came to chi sao:
Is it a cooperative drill?
If so HOW cooperative?
Is it a drill that, as you get better, becomes less and less cooperative?

Things like that.

I think that if subject A views Chi sao as a cooperative drill with limited strikes and subject B views it as basically a semi-freestyle drill where anything goes with control, then you have two very different worlds colliding when they meet.

[wtxs]

I think everyone has said their piece and this thing can end.

I 2nd, 3rd and 4th that motion. Can't keep up with making tons of popcorn and running out of beer ... following this thread had ruined my diet!

[Ali. R]

The thread should really be a discussion on how to chi sau correctly against people more physically stronger than ourselves...

I started looking around after reading your post and came up with this. It was actually posted the same day of this thread.


Take care,

[Wayfaring]

Comparing these two "palms" (if you want to include Obasi's slap in that definition), if the intensity were turned up, which one do you think would have been more damaging?

Why is this thread still going? Because seeing two people ACTUALLY SPARRING LIVE in any fashion in WCK is such a rarity that it has caused such a disruption in the "force" that it has people predicting alternate future parallel universes.

[YouKnowWho]

He made a good point in that clip. If you allow your opponent's arms to move however that he wants to, it's your mistake. So in WC sticky hands, since your are relax and allow your opponent to move his arms freely, you may just give too much freedom to your opponent's arms.

[Ali. R]

He made a good point in that clip. If you allow your opponent's arms to move however that he wants to, it's your mistake. So in WC sticky hands, since your are relax and allow your opponent to move his arms freely, you may just give too much freedom to your opponent's arms.

How to handle a big guy…….


Take care,