Page 22 of 32 FirstFirst ... 122021222324 ... LastLast
Results 316 to 330 of 479

Thread: Best Wing Chun KO in MMA - Iron Wolves Fighter Chu Sau Lei Wing Chun

  1. #316
    Quote Originally Posted by KPM View Post
    Welcome to the forum jhexx! Thanks for the input. Sorry for the drama. Its not always like this here. I promise!
    Much appreciated!
    "Timing is achieved through practice."

  2. #317
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ
    Posts
    482
    Yep, from the point of view of any meaningful commentary, this thread should have ended about 20 pages ago. On the other hand, it is getting pretty funny lately. Sort of an "F-you!" "No F-you!!!!", "Yeah, well take your Tan-sau and shove it where the sun don't shine!!!!! conversation.

    Ok, I'm almost done laughing. Just a few chuckles left. ...There now. All done. Say guys, whatever happened to accepting that others are entitled to having a different point of view. Honestly, both groups have made some decent observations. But it's almost like there's a void left by Kevin's absence that someone has to fill. Same after Terrance left. Dang, now I'm laughing again. Excuse me for now.
    "No contaban con mi astucia!" --el Chapulin Colorado

    http://www.vingtsunaz.com/
    www.nationalvt.com/

  3. #318
    Quote Originally Posted by BPWT.. View Post
    Perfect. That's exactly what I was looking for. A description and how it would fit into their framework. Our BT approach is not quite the same, but it doesn't matter as, like I said, I've approached this saying I wanted to know the 'why's'.

    My only complaint is that this description of the CSL approach came from someone outside of their lineage, when one of their line's main guys has actually been posting here.

    Still, an answer is better than no answer. So thank you, LFJ.
    No answer??

    I post 3 videos addressing questions -

    On types of punching

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfYmNhg4f9c

    On Bridge control
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJsOf4p96Lk

    On Hidden skills
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AlwYt3Yo5k


    Other questions? The hand positioning you asked about - I didn't think that was a real question. If you have fight skills then you will know - You train your skill your way. The you need to apply it to the problem - thats the conceptual part of wing chun. You have someone swing at you - then you can't just have you hands in the middle. We are not robots we use our skills to deal with real problems.

  4. #319
    Quote Originally Posted by KPM View Post
    With all due respect....FXCK YOU DAVE! Go back and read this thread from the beginning. I made a simple comment about not seeing any obvious Wing Chun in the clips posted and end up being told I am "low level" and "stupid" and the "walking dead." You tell me what kind of "horsesh!t" that is!!! I simply asked if the biomechanics I was seeing in a sparring clip that looked amazingly like western boxing were typical of CSL Wing Chun and suddenly I'm "pushing an agenda"? Just what "agenda" might that be? I voiced my opinion and have gotten all kinds of criticism and flak for it.

    Now you are calling me a "douchebag"? I posted Alan's clips in the general forum to see what others would think. I did it because I might very well be wrong and people will accept that those clips represent good Wing Chun. I posted them with a very positive tone just as Alan himself would have. I didn't try and prejudice people towards them in any way. Alan and his guys have nothing to hide. Those are good clips. So just what problem do you see with people other than Wing Chun people viewing them????

    Again, just what "agenda" am I pushing down everyone's throats? And how has Hendrik been making things go downhill? He has been very forthcoming with information lately. You don't have to agree with his information, but at least he is providing what he knows and answering questions.
    Yes you posted your opinion and I told you our system was different too boxing and different to many other wing chun styles. But you continued to repeat the same - well done, but its still not wing chun. Can you not see that is disrespect to my fighters hard work, my hard work my teachers hard work. If your told it is our Wing Chun and you don't see it then 'fine. But don't keep telling me its not after I confirmed it was our wing chun. Its just Wing Chun you don't understand.

  5. #320
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    ᏌᏂᎭᎢ, ᏥᎾ
    Posts
    3,257
    Quote Originally Posted by KPM View Post
    I posted Alan's clips in the general forum to see what others would think. I did it because I might very well be wrong and people will accept that those clips represent good Wing Chun.
    You as a Wing Chun practitioner yourself can't see it, and you thought perhaps people on the general forum who would likely know much less about Wing Chun might? Sounds fishy...

    You'd really be admitting you have super low-level Wing Chun understanding then, if non-practitioners can see it and you can't (which seems to have been the actual outcome). If everyone there agreed with you that there was no Wing Chun in the fight you would have undoubtedly brought it back to this thread as points for your team. Instead it's another mark on the scoreboard for the Iron Wolves!

  6. #321
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    ᏌᏂᎭᎢ, ᏥᎾ
    Posts
    3,257
    Quote Originally Posted by Alan Orr View Post
    You have someone swing at you - then you can't just have you hands in the middle. We are not robots we use our skills to deal with real problems.
    There would be no question if people were doing live sparring and fighting like you guys. All the theory in the world won't keep your head on your shoulders.

  7. #322
    Quote Originally Posted by BPWT.. View Post
    Yes, I wouldn't argue that this isn't Wing Chun. And in close this is how things often look. So I don't have an issue with problem solving in this way. In that case, what fits with their system would also fit in mine. In Lat Sau this type of scenario is often found.

    But here's where I see what would lead me to ask a question. and yes, I'm aware that this will be met with derision from Chris.

    I would ask how this form of covering (if we call it that for convenience) would be a good Wing Chun strategy as a starting point? I understand that when a punch is thrown and you've moved in, this is a possible outcome. But why would you use this covering position before a strike is thrown?

    This is why I asked the question regarding the 'light sparring clip' from Alan. One of the fighters often held this position before facing an attack. Now I'm not saying it is wrong (for fear of all Hell's wrath coming down on me), and maybe for a boxer it might absolutely be right... but I am instead asking what is the CSL WC strategy for having, essentially, the arms compressed in this position before something has happened?

    Why, for example, have this position as opposed to using something that approximates more the Man and Wu 'structure' that gives better coverage (gates and centre line) and puts your weapons a little closer to the target?

    From the structure I'm talking about (and it can come in various shapes and sizes, if you like, I'm not necessarily talking about a text book Man Sau and Wu) it can still compress if the punch (say that whipping punch) comes in, and can still be used even if your timing happened to be a little bit late (which is often the case when sparring, IMO).
    Alan, regarding the hand position, LFJ posted this clip - one of yours: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yj9mTuia70A

    Above is what I said, and the questions I asked. No one is talking about 'just having hands in the middle'. I also said that of course they don't remain there. For example, I said this regarding the Man Sau Wu Sau guard:

    Quote Originally Posted by BPWT.. View Post
    I agree. It is only static until it acts (no one holds it out and doesn't change/react to what happens next). But as a starting point, it has some strong/positive attributes. IMO, more so than starting from a covering position. If your opinion is different, that's cool - but please explain why.

    The questions I make above were also asked by JPinAZ. It's about why you would assume a covering position before an attack.

    As always, you can do whatever you like - but I am asking why you do it that way, and above I explained why I am asking it.

    If you read what I posted, I think you can see that I'm asking genuine questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by LFJ View Post
    There would be no question if people were doing live sparring and fighting like you guys. All the theory in the world won't keep your head on your shoulders.
    I've already said that I do spar (light contact with no protection and also harder contact with gloves, box and gum shield), but I've also said that I don't fight in competitions. So I do spar and I do have questions for Alan, based on watching his sparring. So I'm not sure what you're getting at.
    Last edited by BPWT..; 04-25-2014 at 02:59 AM.

  8. #323
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    44
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by BPWT.. View Post
    Alan, regarding the hand position, LFJ posted this clip - one of yours: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yj9mTuia70A

    Above is what I said, and the questions I asked. No one is talking about 'just having hands in the middle'. I also said that of course they don't remain there. For example, I said this regarding the Man Sau Wu Sau guard:




    The questions I make above were also asked by JPinAZ. It's about why you would assume a covering position before an attack.

    As always, you can do whatever you like - but I am asking why you do it that way, and above I explained why I am asking it.

    If you read what I posted, I think you can see that I'm asking genuine questions.



    I've already said that I do spar (light contact with no protection and also harder contact with gloves, box and gum shield), but I've also said that I don't fight in competitions. So I do spar and I do have questions for Alan, based on watching his sparring. So I'm not sure what you're getting at.
    If you sparred with any degree of pressure you wouldn't continue to ask stupid questions about hand positions, did you read my explanation of hand positioning? You strike me as an eloquent and intelligent person and I think you understand perfectly what we've explained. Now your just making yourself look silly, move on.

  9. #324
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    ᏌᏂᎭᎢ, ᏥᎾ
    Posts
    3,257
    Quote Originally Posted by chris bougeard View Post
    If you sparred with any degree of pressure you wouldn't continue to ask stupid questions about hand positions,
    And against other than just likeminded individuals, like Alan and Sean are doing with their students.

  10. #325
    Quote Originally Posted by BPWT.. View Post
    Alan, regarding the hand position, LFJ posted this clip - one of yours: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yj9mTuia70A

    Above is what I said, and the questions I asked. No one is talking about 'just having hands in the middle'. I also said that of course they don't remain there. For example, I said this regarding the Man Sau Wu Sau guard:




    The questions I make above were also asked by JPinAZ. It's about why you would assume a covering position before an attack.

    As always, you can do whatever you like - but I am asking why you do it that way, and above I explained why I am asking it.

    If you read what I posted, I think you can see that I'm asking genuine questions.



    I've already said that I do spar (light contact with no protection and also harder contact with gloves, box and gum shield), but I've also said that I don't fight in competitions. So I do spar and I do have questions for Alan, based on watching his sparring. So I'm not sure what you're getting at.


    Now it's hard to answer this question without implying that you are either a beginners level in the martial arts or just a day dreamer. But you are pushing the point again. So let's make it clear for you. Whoever you are.

    It you spar or fight with good level guys then you will get hit. If will not always be able to apply you drilled application in real time. I know it sucks but in the real world you have to have back up plans. So bridging controlling and taking out you opponent in 3 seconds is great. But when your opponent is tough and not playing you have to be able to take the rough with the smooth.

    The defence block I showed as a few levels to it, so I only showed the basic idea. Of course most people can work out that I'm showing a clip of 3-5 mins to open peoples mind to CSL wing Chun and to share some helpful ideas - as my guys have a lot if real pressure experience many people find it helpful that we share our hard earned knowledge.

    If the guy throw a fast punch and your too late to control it then you need to block that's the bottom line

    If anyone can tell him they can spar or fight one of my guys or me and not need to cover up at some point then please say now as I like to hear about it. I have never sparred and not had to cover. In chi sao I do better as it's a focused alive drill which I have a higher that most skill. On the street it's not a sport or a game so lots of rules change, that's another story.

    So please grow up and understand wing chun is not a computer game or a black and white result

  11. #326
    Quote Originally Posted by chris bougeard View Post
    If you sparred with any degree of pressure you wouldn't continue to ask stupid questions about hand positions...
    It's because I spar that I am asking these questions


    Quote Originally Posted by chris bougeard View Post
    ...did you read my explanation of hand positioning?
    I did, but you didn't address what I was talking about - as far as I could tell. In a nutshell, what is your system's logic behind assuming a covering position before receiving punches, as opposed to having a guard that, from a starting point, offers you the chance to monitor the gates and ranges, plus puts your weapons closer to the target?

    I'm trying to understand how this idea fits into your CSL system. JPinAZ asked essentially the same question. You haven't replied since then, so I don't see where you answered. If you don't want to answer, just say so.

    I agreed with you that during a barrage of attacks this covering can and will happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by LFJ View Post
    And against other than just likeminded individuals, like Alan and Sean are doing with their students.
    Again, I'm not sure what you mean. I only spar regularly with a few WT guys (due to how and where I train these days), but I also train with people from other arts (some with a MT background, some a Karate background and boxing background). I admit that none of these people are professional fighters. Is that what you mean when you say 'likeminded individuals'.

    If yes, then okay... I admit that I am not sparring with pro fighters who make a living from getting in the ring. But I am training with people who are looking to punch and kick me hard. Not sure how that invalidates my opinion, or makes my experience not worth considering.

    If you're critiquing the fact that my sparring is stand up only, then guilty as charged - I don't train any ground fighting system.

  12. #327
    Alan, what the hell! I am not disagreeing with what you just wrote... you just explained why you need to cover. I am in agreement. I even explained why this problem solving is needed and will happen.

    If you read (and understood what I actually wrote), I am talking about why in the 'light sparring clip' your guys are covering BEFORE THERE ARE ANY PUNCHES THROWN.

    I have no problem with your instructional clip.

    I think I've been really clear. Are you simply reading fast and not understanding? Because you are not getting what I, and also JPinAZ was saying.

  13. #328
    Quote Originally Posted by Alan Orr View Post
    So please grow up and understand wing chun is not a computer game or a black and white result
    Please stop with the silly insults and try to read what I am actually writing. For God's sake, I am even putting emphasis (highlights or italics) on words like before and during, so that there can't be any confusion.

  14. #329
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    ᏌᏂᎭᎢ, ᏥᎾ
    Posts
    3,257
    @BPWT - I think PB is in Budapest right now. http://www.vingtsun.hu/

  15. #330
    Quote Originally Posted by BPWT.. View Post
    Alan, what the hell! I am not disagreeing with what you just wrote... you just explained why you need to cover. I am in agreement. I even explained why this problem solving is needed and will happen.

    If you read (and understood what I actually wrote), I am talking about why in the 'light sparring clip' your guys are covering BEFORE THERE ARE ANY PUNCHES THROWN.

    I have no problem with your instructional clip.

    I think I've been really clear. Are you simply reading fast and not understanding? Because you are not getting what I, and also JPinAZ was saying.
    He has explained but you are not hearing what he is saying. Let me ask you in your wing chun sparring do you try to cut off or jeet or preempt what your opponent is trying to do or are you solely reactive and responding only after he does something?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •