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Thread: Inside the Yik Kam Cho Gar vs Hendrik Santos CONTROVERSY

  1. #31
    Hendrik, you wrote this on another thread in reply to Zuti Car:
    it is your issue of either you back up your claim with your video or you will be look at as baseless claimer. Your choice.
    You had to go ahead and write that didn't you Hendrik??? Man you really are your own worst enemy!

    Can't you see how your own words apply to you?

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    Oh come on, It's only a little bit of fun!
    Last edited by Minghequan; 05-08-2014 at 09:15 PM.

    Ron Goninan
    China Fuzhou Zhenlan Crane Boxing Australia
    White Crane Research Institute Inc
    http://www.whitecranegongfu.info
    A seeker of the way

  2. #32

    Is Emei fit to wck ?

    Today, Grandmaster Ku is 75, and he always travel around Singapore, Malaysia, Hong Kong and China. Still very active to promote Ban Chung Wck.

    Accoding to what Hendrik said, 1980, he was 20., today he should be 54. However, he all the time work with his PC on internet seeking and teaching only, no travelling around.

    We know he was over 230 pounds in 2000 as he met Grandmaster Ku in Singapore. However, from his videos and pictures, he looks skinny, 150 pounds today. What's wrong ? Emei effect to make him having a snake body ! He had mentioned to maintain a snake body. Does he get sick in the last 14 years ?

    1. Hendrik claim he reach the 3rd level of 9 the emei qi gong.
    2. he claim he got the authentic ykwc from his sifu Cho Hung Choi.
    3. he claim his formulae 2014 is most advanced.
    4. he claim he know emei, mean only he knows the real wck
    5. he claim Cho's family no real ykwc, also no emei, not wck, only his from Cho Hung Choi is real.
    6. he claim his discovery on 7 bows.

    Hendrik should be very superior in his yk wck because he reach certain level of emie 9 level qi gong. He is younger and taller as compared with Grandmaster Ku. Both from ykwc, one from non-Cho family, and one from Cho family. A suggestion is good on their Kong Sau to see, American ykwc good or Cho's family Ban Chung ykwc good. Hendrik,please take a trip to Malaysia to see Grandmaster Ku again and see who is beter

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post

    Finally,

    l like to qoute the famous Wing chun kuen saying which Gm Ipman often says
    " Studying doesnt discriminate if one is junior or senior in age, the one who has master the art is the teacher."
    You quote this but you do not seem to know what it means.

  4. #34
    A beginner? So many thing wrong going on here no matter what lineage you are.
    No idea of application only some sort of health routine going on here.....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tAk...=youtube_gdata

  5. #35
    And this is from an inheritor of a system?
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNzA3MjUyNDI0.html

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guardian1000 View Post
    A beginner? So many thing wrong going on here no matter what lineage you are.
    No idea of application only some sort of health routine going on here.....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tAk...=youtube_gdata
    Quote Originally Posted by Guardian1000 View Post
    And this is from an inheritor of a system?
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNzA3MjUyNDI0.html
    Wow, those videos are, well.... no need to say anything, they say enough!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    Enough information for the Wck researchers, on Yik kam, Cho family, and Emei.

    Here I sign off this thread.
    LOL, Gets caught in his lies red handed by Ron so runs away. Priceless!
    Last edited by JPinAZ; 05-09-2014 at 07:58 AM.
    What chi sau is, or isn't, or is, or wait, what is it..: http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/foru...2&postcount=90

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Fong View Post
    From Hong Kong newspaper "Headlines daily",

    4月12日
    香港頭條日報

    勝負都是過眼雲煙
    2014/4/11 上午 10:43:10
    網誌分類: 生活
      
    最近我在內地跟幾位武術名家交流,他們都說:「你們的詠春拳,發展不錯!但這拳種,只在南方有人識,到了北 方,很多人聞所未聞!」我聽後內心有跟他辯論的衝動,但最後打消念頭。突然記起電影《一代宗師》裏,飾演葉 問的梁朝偉在戲裏說的一段話:「人家說,武學千年,勝負都是過眼雲煙。功夫可以分南北,國家又豈能分南北? 我們不在意是一招一式,你們在意是整個武林,而我就是整個世界!」我心想:「修文者為求明理不論古今,練武 者追尋實用不分南北。」於是我說:「我們詠春拳,雖在北方剛起步,但現今已傳遍世界!」

    詠春拳由葉問宗師南傳發展,短短數十年間,以驚人速度發展。在詠春拳派的支流裏,葉問系統的成績更是一枝獨 秀。

    在這趨勢下,確實有很多投機取巧的功夫騙子,搵個輩份高的師傅,先去交幾百元,學幾個月,然後過冷河,返屋 企睇YouTube學齊其他套路,就掛牌收學生!或跟十個、八個師傅學過後,話自己取各家之長 。

    練功夫是不能心存坑、蒙、拐、騙、偷,教學更不可以只顧自己「刮龍」,過到海就是神仙,誤人誤 己。

    沒恩怨,沒是非,就不是武林!最近我在YouTube看到有位外籍中國人話,要為詠春拳尋根解碼,在網上自 拍視頻說葉問的詠春功夫,是「半桶水不齊全」,是到香港先抄這個、學那個,才修成正果。我認為,他沒確實證 據。

    據我所知,這位外籍人士最早亦是葉問詠春拳的傳人,近年才拜另一支流門下。我有責任去調查,對自己對讀者有 個交代。

    我早年曾拜訪多條支流的詠春派前輩,我見過葉問佛山的最早期弟子郭富、倫佳師傅,亦拜訪過吳仲素祖師的後人 ,還聽了許多老前輩說有關葉、阮、姚三雄的故事。

    經分析後,關於問公的謠傳,便知是以訛傳訛。但不招人妒是庸才,前人已蓋棺定論又何需妄加評說,懂得欣賞別 人,才能顯出包容之量,覺得自己不足,才是成功的開始。
    Hi Daniel, thank you for sharing. I do not read Chinese but was curious what it say so my friend in NYC did some general translation nfor me.

    What sounds like is article is describing kung fu cheaters who acts like Sifu in community. Those types pay some hundreds or so dollars to learn a few thing here and there + watch youtube videos, then sell themselves to the public and claims to learn from many Sifu. Some stranger and foreign Chinese guy claims Yip Man Wing Chun not complete then goes to China to learn from other Sifus. is this about accurate or close?

    When my friend was translating to me it really remind me of two such posts of similar content:

    http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/...78#post1264578
    Some of them wearing a research robe trying to dig something out from some low profile families, and represent them bringing them out to the public. How much do they know why the lineage keeping low profile, not opening up ? Does it intrude the privacy of individual lineages ? Really, the term "Research", what really means ? In What ways ? Doing research means they can do whatever they like to explore IN ANY MEANS to get information IMPROPERLY? Will it hurt those lineages and destroying the individual lineage duties ? For what ? Then makes their own interpretation to show to the public. For their individual benefits or any other HIDDEN means ? It makes no difference like stealing in a improper way. Those people they are not the real researchers, what they behave just like what called MuLamLoShe( A mouse in Martial Arts Community).

    Can this type of behaviours exist on the today martial arts researchers ? What the information they get in improper ways, are they good to the martial arts community ?

    Finally, RCHS, what type of Chinese characters being used in the Ancient China? When the Simplied characters introduced today commonly used in China? Are there any SI units introduced in 19th century?
    Plus this:

    http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/...09#post1264609
    RCHS = Robert Chu? Hendrik Santo?

    "what they behave just like what called MuLamLoShe( A mouse in Martial Arts Community)."

    Obviously there are many misrepresentations and incorrect information of WC by Sifu Sergio on his internet channel. It's unfortunate that the public is being misguided about the history of WC.

    The dishonesty of these two people has made their SCWC/YKWC masters blood boil. Ironically both have been denounced by their own schools.

    Is Sifu Sergio the qualified to represent the WC community as a researcher? Why has much of the content of Sifu Sergio's research been proved incorrect. He is so quick to take anyone at their word for a story. He should do more research into his sources instead of writing stories from these wannabes. For the last few years, Sifu Sergio has discredited Yip Man WC as not a real source of WC. He also represented Chi Sim and Black Flag as the original WC which shortly thereafter was proved false. Now the information about SCWC/YKWC as presented by Robert Chu and Hendrik Santo is also being questioned by their SCWC/YKWC.
    And now same language also use by Sifu Lee Kong for third time during my reading:

    http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/...95#post1267695
    "Lee Kong said you are a mouse, who likes to take things from others and that you should be ignored completely"
    Why lots of different groups saying same thing about Hendrik and Robert Chu? Is all these coincidence, conspiracy, or these groups know what is up about him? Definietly could be more groups saying same thing in private too. My friends in NYC WC community pretty much say same as well “Mu Lam Lo She”. Are they RC + HS the “Stranger and foreign Chinese guy” possibley?

    Andy
    Last edited by VT Andy; 05-09-2014 at 10:44 AM.

  8. #38
    http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/...09#post1264609
    RCHS = Robert Chu? Hendrik Santo?

    "what they behave just like what called MuLamLoShe( A mouse in Martial Arts Community)."

    Obviously there are many misrepresentations and incorrect information of WC by Sifu Sergio on his internet channel. It's unfortunate that the public is being misguided about the history of WC.
    Is Sifu Sergio the qualified to represent the WC community as a researcher? Why has much of the content of Sifu Sergio's research been proved incorrect. He is so quick to take anyone at their word for a story. He should do more research into his sources instead of writing stories from these wannabes. For the last few years, Sifu Sergio has discredited Yip Man WC as not a real source of WC. He also represented Chi Sim and Black Flag as the original WC which shortly thereafter was proved false. Now the information about SCWC/YKWC as presented by Robert Chu and Hendrik Santo is also being questioned by their SCWC/YKWC.
    What do these two guy RC + HS have to do with Sergio? Is strange? Just casual friend they want to share their cheese with or deeper selfish agenda? Why go to him after trying to pull fast one against Sifu Yung? Was Sergio in on the scam crafting by Hendrik trying to twist Kuit and make to suit his personal theory and imagination to rewrite history and tear down others? is that also Sergio agenda too, or are these two mouse taking advantage of SErgio?

    I see that on that protecting real shaolin blog http://protectingrealshaolin.wordpress.com/ mentioning Sergio is one who expose frauds Andraes Hoffman and Kenneth Lin by going to source roots of those guys kung fu. I think though he gets fool by these frauds eventually he visiting their Sifu he gets the real story. Then he shows public what the truth is after getting fooled. He was fooled by poser Chi Sim Hoffman with anti Yip Man campaign and then fooled by Black Flag Kenneth Lin and Benny Meng with HKB fake Wing Chun scam. This now happen at least two times to him two strikes but will joining RC and HS become third strike for him to support this Emei fabrication or will he go to visits the elders of Cho Gar Pai for the real research?
    Last edited by VT Andy; 05-09-2014 at 10:43 AM.

  9. #39
    Most of what Hendrik is being accused of is speculation mixed with a heavy dose of ad hominem attacks. I have yet to read a technical and critical discussion of Hendrik's interpretations by the seniors of the lineages VTandy, Daniel Fong and others claim to represent. Nor have I seen such antagonized groups present their interpretations of the kuits. One thing that I do take away from such apparent hostility to Hendrik is that out of all he has said it is likely that he has let slip information and knowledge that they would prefer remained out of the public realm. This is not to say that everything Hendrik has said is right.

  10. #40
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    Thieving?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guardian1000 View Post
    And this is from an inheritor of a system?
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNzA3MjUyNDI0.html

    Someone has stolen my personal property and has now illegally posted this up without my permission. Please have the moderator delete this post. I will make sure that the proper authorities are notified regarding this crime, and we will find the illegal poster and punish them within the law.

    On the other hand, this private footage of mine from 1998 is actual proof that Wayne Yung's claims that I said to him in HK were not correct. Hendrik Santo knows all four sections of the Yik Kam Siu Lien Tao set and inherited the Kuen Kuit and understanding behind it, and needs no Snake Crane Wing Chun to complete a set he already is a master of.

  11. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by chusauli View Post
    Someone has stolen my personal property and has now illegally posted this up without my permission. Please have the moderator delete this post. I will make sure that the proper authorities are notified regarding this crime, and we will find the illegal poster and punish them within the law.

    On the other hand, this private footage of mine from 1998 is actual proof that Wayne Yung's claims that I said to him in HK were not correct. Hendrik Santo knows all four sections of the Yik Kam Siu Lien Tao set and inherited the Kuen Kuit and understanding behind it, and needs no Snake Crane Wing Chun to complete a set he already is a master of.
    Hello Robert. The account name under which that video was uploaded is similar to that used by Hendrik on his youtube channel. So, you are either threatening Hendrik or someone that is impersonating him on youku (unlikely).

    EDIT: Hendrik has posted stills of that video on this forum which are of a similar quality to the one linked in this thread.
    Last edited by Paddington; 05-10-2014 at 02:06 PM.

  12. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Paddington View Post
    Hello Robert. The account name under which that video was uploaded is similar to that used by Hendrik on his youtube channel. So, you are either threatening Hendrik or someone that is impersonating him on youku (unlikely).

    EDIT: Hendrik has posted stills of that video on this forum which are of a similar quality to the one linked in this thread.

    1.

    It has nothing to do with me.

    not my account name.

    i have never have post such video and do not have a youku account like that.


    2.

    everything i post in this forum on Robert has his approval.
    Last edited by Hendrik; 05-10-2014 at 02:28 PM.

  13. #43
    A form complete or incomplete doesn't mean on the form playing shown in the video only. the way how to play and individual technique applications are also the major concerned. RC, according to what you said above and HS email dated 17 Feb to you and sifu Yung, you and HS totally show your dishonesty to Sifu Yung, lying to him, just for SCWC stuff only.


    Quote from Facebook :

    [ Those claim themself researchers, actually they are collectors. They come to you for what, just for what they want. They can say a lot, just for what the information you have. Baisee, then what they claim sufficient enough, the quit. Then show what they gain to the public. two American Chineses (RCHS), they are really dishonest, and not respect to others. They are really making other real researchers difficult to study from other lineages. Very poor and bad guys. From above, you can see what a fake buddhist said, but is still very active in the public forum to promote his theories and his findings. It shows how a liar behaves on one side and does on the other side.]


    Quote from Kung Fu Magazine forum :

    http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/...43#post1264443

    [04-02-2014, 12:00 PM #260 VT Andy VT Andy is offline
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    [[Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Fong View Post
    Robert claimed himself reading SCWC secret document. Did his baisee just for the document ? If it is, really sick on him. Today, both these guys betrayed SCWC, and going to Sifu Sergio. There should be a big deal there!!!]]

    Hello again, and Chunner.

    I just catching up on reading. I think the betrayal is not so much regards to how there is intentional misinterpretation and abuse source material for their own supposed views of history which is the implied agenda, but the betrayal is once someone Baisee then loyalty and character must come first in order to earn deeper knowledge in the art. Someone mentioned that there is in door and in room category of Baisee with many regulations to follow. So Robert and Hendrik Baisee to Sifu Yung then must have lied to him about swearing loyalty which shows very bad character and as Sifu Yung said NO ethics and nonsense. Then by this betrayal is to mean no loyalty and no ethics.

    Then next I think Robert and Hendrik run to Sergio with whatever info they got without giving credit back to Sifu Yung. I can definitely see from Sifu Yung standpoint he feels very used and taken advantage by them at least on this point if not more things. If they swore their loyalty to him with baisee then turn around and done those things then I can see why he says betrayed. They did not respect the Baisee regulations of SCWCM is only conclusion.

    Hendril and Robert never really respect any Sifu ever do they? Since the days of lee Moy Shan and Moy yat rejecting Robert so he left with incomplete training. He trained a bit in HK and back to the states, eventually hooked up with Hawkins Cheung in LA in late 80ís but friends tell me he didnít learn the whole system so more incomplete training. Did he ever complete the system under a single sifu from beginning to end? I donít think so. He is more like a collector so he sticks around only enough to get what he thinks is work and bargains with people who know what he doesnít and trades to get what he wants. All while also attacking other Sifus and spreading rumors around causing politics and mess. How can anyone take this guy as serious when he demonstrates over and over no commitment? is he a history researcher and WC expert, or information collector with incomplete training? If I want advice and expertise on fixing my car or marriage or Ving Tsun I wonít go to someone with a similar history and education as him.

    This guy collects info because his WC has always ever been incomplete so he has to make up his own stuff, take from others. Just looking at this history I donít think it is far stretch to see he really has no loyalty only to himself. What does that mean? Look at this most recent event with him baisee to Sifu Yung SCWCM. His word will ALWAYS be suspect.

    Andy ]

    Quote

    [Hendrik.
    To MeRobert ChuJack Chang
    Feb 17
    Wayne,

    1. Be able to make Happy is a great thing Robert and I will do.

    2. Great that you met Sergio and have first hand understanding on him and the possibility for further program. My best wishes for you and him. I am sure there are alots of things you can teaches him on the history and culture of Wck. Also, you guys sure will come up with good videos for Wck history and SCWC to share with the world.

    3. I have made my decision to wash my hand on Wck and become a full time Buddhist since my mission in Wck is completed. That is what I like to do here on with lots of good memories in Wck.



    Best regards
    Hendrik

    Sent from my iPad ]

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Fong View Post

    Hendril and Robert never really respect any Sifu ever do they?
    Respect does not go automatically , it should be earned . Why would someone respect anybody just because he or she is a "sifu" . So your logic is , regardless of anything "sifu" should be respected , and that goes only one way , from student to a'sifu" , never anyone , especially "sifus" talk about their respect toward students and other responsibilities .If I pay for the lesson, I am a buyer , there is no need for respect only correct business relationship . In this case I am on Hendrik's side , he has the right to do anything he wants as long as he does not hurt others and he does not owe respect to anyone .
    Last edited by zuti car; 05-11-2014 at 02:41 AM.

  15. #45
    1.

    It has nothing to do with me.

    not my account name.

    i have never have post such video and do not have a youku account like that.


    2.

    everything i post in this forum on Robert has his approval.
    That's great Hendrik, good to see you back

    Two questions:

    1/. Did Robert approve your post quoting Lee Kong?

    2/. Did Lee Kong approve your post quoting him?

    Remember, Lee Kong said:

    "Lee Kong said you are a mouse, who likes to take things from others and that you should be ignored completely"

    Ron Goninan
    China Fuzhou Zhenlan Crane Boxing Australia
    White Crane Research Institute Inc
    http://www.whitecranegongfu.info
    A seeker of the way

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