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Thread: Inside the Yik Kam Cho Gar vs Hendrik Santos CONTROVERSY

  1. #46
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
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    Rockville, MD
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    2,662
    This is really getting quite silly Daniel. Still beating a dead horse. But Ok. I'll answer a few points myself on what little I know. Robert is a big boy and can take up for himself. But he doesn't come here often anymore.


    A form complete or incomplete doesn't mean on the form playing shown in the video only. the way how to play and individual technique applications are also the major concerned.

    This is true. I guess that's why you have to bring up the "insider info" approach. That way no one will know whether Hendrik is using the super secret knowledge or not, even though it is obvious he knows the whole form. Hard to argue against that one. Hard to know whether it is true or not as well.



    RC, according to what you said above and HS email dated 17 Feb to you and sifu Yung, you and HS totally show your dishonesty to Sifu Yung, lying to him, just for SCWC stuff only.


    I didn't see a lie in anything you posted. Is it the Hendrik being the "inheritor" of YKWCK part? Did they tell Sifu Yung Hendrik wasn't the "inheritor"? Does "inheritor" have to mean he was the guy put in charge or made "grandmaster" of YKWCK? Or does it just mean he learned the whole system and was authorized to teach it?



    Robert claimed himself reading SCWC secret document. Did his baisee just for the document ? If it is, really sick on him. Today, both these guys betrayed SCWC, and going to Sifu Sergio. There should be a big deal there!!!]]


    This is the whole problem, isn't??? Sergio posts a video and mentions info from a super secret document and gives credit back to HS and RC but not Sifu Yung. So Sifu Yung is p!ssed and starts this whole smear campaign. That's it, isn't it????


    Baisee with many regulations to follow. So Robert and Hendrik Baisee to Sifu Yung then must have lied to him about swearing loyalty which shows very bad character and as Sifu Yung said NO ethics and nonsense. Then by this betrayal is to mean no loyalty and no ethics.

    So just what are these "Baisee regulations of SCWCM"? Do they say that one must never mention information from the super secret document or share that information with others???


    hooked up with Hawkins Cheung in LA in late 80’s but friends tell me he didn’t learn the whole system so more incomplete training.

    So you are going by hearsy from your "friends" without even knowing Robert? As far as I know, Hawkins Cheung has had an on-line presence to some extent until recently. He even has a website for his school. He has students that have an on-line presence as well. So if he didn't like what Robert has said or claimed on-line through the years I think he would have spoken up. Robert credits a lot of his knowledge and training to Hawkins Cheung on a regular basis. He will point out to anyone that asks that it was Hawkins Cheung that taught him about "body structure" and actually coined the term. So now you guys are trying to smear Robert's reputation just like you tried to smear Hendrik's by saying he hadn't even completed the YKWCK SLT form, even though that was clearly untrue? And you expect people to believe you now? AS far as completing training....Robert learned both the Yuen Kay Shan and Gu Lao 40 point systems in their entirety as well as Yip Man WCK.



    Did he ever complete the system under a single sifu from beginning to end? I don’t think so.

    Think whatever you like. But you would be wrong!


    All while also attacking other Sifus and spreading rumors around causing politics and mess.

    Hold on now! From what I have seen recently, it is you "insider" guys that have been attacking other Sifus (Robert and Hendrik) and spreading rumors (that neither of them had completed any training). Isn't your ENTIRE reason for multiple posts on this forum to "spread rumors around causing politics and mess"????? Because I don't recall having ever seen you guys posting here prior to this.


    How can anyone take this guy as serious when he demonstrates over and over no commitment? is he a history researcher and WC expert, or information collector with incomplete training? If I want advice and expertise on fixing my car or marriage or Ving Tsun I won’t go to someone with a similar history and education as him.

    How can anyone take YOU "insiders" serious when you repeat the same thing over and over based entirely on facebook posts? How can anyone take YOU serious when your only purpose for posting in our forum seems to be to "spread rumors around causing politics and mess"????





    3. I have made my decision to wash my hand on Wck and become a full time Buddhist since my mission in Wck is completed. That is what I like to do here on with lots of good memories in Wck.


    Everyone makes hasty comments that they regret later, or decide to change later. Hendrik spoke up a little prematurely about "washing his hands of WCK" and changed his mind. So what? Its not like he signed a contract or anything!
    Last edited by KPM; 05-11-2014 at 04:50 AM.

  2. #47
    KPM and all wcners,


    My last post on this issue.


    1.
    This is the whole problem, isn't??? Sergio posts a video and mentions info from a super secret document and gives credit back to HS and RC but not Sifu Yung. So Sifu Yung is p!ssed and starts this whole smear campaign. That's it, isn't it????



    I have only share with Sergio , The 2013 Italy New hero Magazine article which co author by Wayne Yung and myself, a public printed information, Nothing else.

    As for how Sergio wants to give credits, that is Sergio decision .



    2.
    Baisee with many regulations to follow. So Robert and Hendrik Baisee to Sifu Yung then must have lied to him about swearing loyalty which shows very bad character and as Sifu Yung said NO ethics and nonsense. Then by this betrayal is to mean no loyalty and no ethics.



    I have never Baisee to any Sifu Yung. That never happen in reality .

    I had publicly announced in this and other Wck forums ,

    I clearly isolate myself from ANY SCWC document or any Secret which is not public known or public domain information.





    3.

    What I have shared with Wcners are:

    A, my inheritance of YKWCK with the hand writing letter of encouragement to share to the western world from my late sifu, Gm Cho Hung Choy himself .

    And.

    B, My own finding from my research.


    Anyone can go to all my posts and verify them




    4. The mother art of my YK WCK is Emei 12 zhuang and Fujian white crane.

    My body and mind is condition and develop based on these two mother arts. Anyone can take my Wck videos and Wck posts out there , a huge collection since decade ago, to examine the DNA or my art and see for themselves.
    Last edited by Hendrik; 05-11-2014 at 07:55 AM.

  3. #48
    [QUOTE=Hendrik;1267792]KPM and all wcners,


    My last post on this issue.


    1.
    This is the whole problem, isn't??? Sergio posts a video and mentions info from a super secret document and gives credit back to HS and RC but not Sifu Yung. So Sifu Yung is p!ssed and starts this whole smear campaign. That's it, isn't it????



    I have only share with Sergio , The 2013 Italy New hero Magazine article which co author by Wayne Yung and myself, a public printed information, Nothing else.

    As for how Sergio wants to give credits, that is Sergio decision .
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    A possible source of the problem:

    Normally a coauthored article involves equal rights for authors on reproducing the material or content in print.


    I have no connection with Hendrik's art or Yung's art.

  4. #49
    [QUOTE=Vajramusti;1267797]
    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    KPM and all wcners,


    My last post on this issue.


    1.
    This is the whole problem, isn't??? Sergio posts a video and mentions info from a super secret document and gives credit back to HS and RC but not Sifu Yung. So Sifu Yung is p!ssed and starts this whole smear campaign. That's it, isn't it????



    I have only share with Sergio , The 2013 Italy New hero Magazine article which co author by Wayne Yung and myself, a public printed information, Nothing else.

    As for how Sergio wants to give credits, that is Sergio decision .
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    A possible source of the problem:

    Normally a coauthored article involves equal rights for authors on reproducing the material or content in print.


    I have no connection with Hendrik's art or Yung's art.


    It is a months old public release magazine article, which I direct Sergio.

    Similar to many times, I direct those who is interested in this forum to that article in my precious posts in here.
    I thread Everyone equally.

    As for who wants to give or not giving credits after the reader read the article . It is not my concern.
    Last edited by Hendrik; 05-11-2014 at 10:28 AM.

  5. #50
    12:26 AM Hendrik:


    KPM and all wcners,


    My last post on this issue.
    Great!

    03:25 AM

    It is a months old public release magazine article, which I direct Sergio.

    Similar to many times, I direct those who is interested in this forum to that article in my precious posts in here.
    I thread Everyone equally.

    As for who wants to give or not giving credits after the reader read the article . It is not my concern.
    ??? WTF?

    Hendrik, you cannot even be true to yourself and your own word!

    You said quite clearly that this would be your "last post on this issue"

    Only to post ........... yet again!

    Ron Goninan
    China Fuzhou Zhenlan Crane Boxing Australia
    White Crane Research Institute Inc
    http://www.whitecranegongfu.info
    A seeker of the way

  6. #51
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    far east, north america
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    109
    Quote Originally Posted by Minghequan View Post
    That's great Hendrik, good to see you back

    Two questions:

    1/. Did Robert approve your post quoting Lee Kong?

    2/. Did Lee Kong approve your post quoting him?

    Remember, Lee Kong said:

    "Lee Kong said you are a mouse, who likes to take things from others and that you should be ignored completely"
    As you know there are many people on this earth with the same name. Is this the same person Lee Kong that you mentioned in this link?
    專訪福建永春白鶴拳 李剛師傅(545)
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywjBKtNtxfQ

  7. #52
    Yes it is. He is also referred to as Gang Li

    Ron Goninan
    China Fuzhou Zhenlan Crane Boxing Australia
    White Crane Research Institute Inc
    http://www.whitecranegongfu.info
    A seeker of the way

  8. #53
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    1,355
    For the record, I never did Baisi to Wayne Yung, but did so to Law Chiu Wing, head of the Law Family Snake Crane Wing Chun Mun.

  9. #54
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    1,355
    For the record, I never did Baisi to Wayne Yung, but did so to Law Chiu Wing, head of the Law Family Snake Crane Wing Chun Mun.

  10. #55
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Rockville, MD
    Posts
    2,662
    So let me get this straight. Sifu Yung's supporters have posted multiple times saying:

    1. Hendrik Baisi'd to Sifu Yung, which Hendrik says is not true.

    2. Robert Chu Baisi'd to Sifu Yung, which Robert says is not true.

    3. Hendrik did not learn the entire YKWCK SLT, which is not true. We have seen footage of Hendrik performing the entire form so we know this is not true.

    4. Robert never completed any WCK system, which is not true. Robert has produced students that know the entire WCK system, so he obviously knows it himself!

    5. Hendrik and Robert shared information from a super secret insider document to Sergio, which is not true as Hendrik points out that all the information came from a magazine article published in the public domain and co-authored by Sifu Yung.

    So, to me, the one coming out looking bad here is.....Sifu Wayne Yung. So maybe you guys should call off your smear campaign, because it isn't going too well!

  11. #56
    Hey Keith, Here's a novel thought for you ... Follow your own advice and "Just let it go!"

    Can you do that?
    Last edited by Minghequan; 05-12-2014 at 06:51 PM.

    Ron Goninan
    China Fuzhou Zhenlan Crane Boxing Australia
    White Crane Research Institute Inc
    http://www.whitecranegongfu.info
    A seeker of the way

  12. #57
    Facebook posting from Sifu Wayne Yung:

    Please note that Mr. Law Chiu Wing had published a public announcement in the newspapers for 3 days in Hong Kong at the end of 2008. He got fully retired and anything related to SCWC stuff has no longer related to him after those announcments. Then the SCWC Mun was formally reopen to the public in the beginning in 2009.

    Baisee is very serious to a kung fu practitioner. Individual famillies have its own baisee culture. Robert Chu claimed he baisee to Mr. Law Chiu Wing.

    1. How does Robert Chu know Mr. Law Chiu Wing ?
    2. How many times he meet with Mr. Law Chiu Wing ?
    3. How much Robert Chu knowing Mr. Law Chiu Wing and how much Mr. Law Chiu Wing knowing Robert Chu?

    4. Which day Robert Chu did baisee ?
    5. Did Robert Chu submit a yellow letter and red letter, swear the Mun rules in front of all SiHingDais ?
    6. Did Robert Chu make a bow to the Mun ancestors wood ?
    7. How many SCWC Mun people knowing Robert Chu baisee Mr. Law Chiu Wing ?
    8. How many minutes(not hours) Robert Chu spend with Mr. Law Chiu Wing after baisee?

    A mouse is a mouse. How much Robert Chu knows SCWC after he claimed baisee. His baisee is for what ? Why his name not listed in the transmission chart because Mr. Law Chiu Wing no more relationship to the SCWC after his public announcements. All the names listed there are before Mr. Law Chiu Wing getting retired in 2008. The name card of Mr. Law Chiu Wing is never mentioning any SCWC there, just Wing Chun Kuen only.


    A claim on the incorrect information had been provided by Robert Chu that I never said he baisee to me. Also, Mr. Law Chiu Wing is not the head of Law Family Snake Crane Wing Chun Mun since 2009.

    { For the record, I never did Baisi to Wayne Yung, but did so to Law Chiu Wing, head of the Law Family Snake Crane Wing Chun Mun.
    Robert Chu, PhD, L.Ac., QME
    chusauli@gmail.com }

  13. #58
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Tainan ,Taiwan
    Posts
    388
    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Fong View Post
    Facebook posting from Sifu Wayne Yung:

    Please note that Mr. Law Chiu Wing had published a public announcement in the newspapers for 3 days in Hong Kong at the end of 2008. He got fully retired and anything related to SCWC stuff has no longer related to him after those announcments. Then the SCWC Mun was formally reopen to the public in the beginning in 2009.

    Baisee is very serious to a kung fu practitioner. Individual famillies have its own baisee culture. Robert Chu claimed he baisee to Mr. Law Chiu Wing.

    1. How does Robert Chu know Mr. Law Chiu Wing ?
    2. How many times he meet with Mr. Law Chiu Wing ?
    3. How much Robert Chu knowing Mr. Law Chiu Wing and how much Mr. Law Chiu Wing knowing Robert Chu?

    4. Which day Robert Chu did baisee ?
    5. Did Robert Chu submit a yellow letter and red letter, swear the Mun rules in front of all SiHingDais ?
    6. Did Robert Chu make a bow to the Mun ancestors wood ?
    7. How many SCWC Mun people knowing Robert Chu baisee Mr. Law Chiu Wing ?
    8. How many minutes(not hours) Robert Chu spend with Mr. Law Chiu Wing after baisee?

    A mouse is a mouse. How much Robert Chu knows SCWC after he claimed baisee. His baisee is for what ? Why his name not listed in the transmission chart because Mr. Law Chiu Wing no more relationship to the SCWC after his public announcements. All the names listed there are before Mr. Law Chiu Wing getting retired in 2008. The name card of Mr. Law Chiu Wing is never mentioning any SCWC there, just Wing Chun Kuen only.


    A claim on the incorrect information had been provided by Robert Chu that I never said he baisee to me. Also, Mr. Law Chiu Wing is not the head of Law Family Snake Crane Wing Chun Mun since 2009.

    { For the record, I never did Baisi to Wayne Yung, but did so to Law Chiu Wing, head of the Law Family Snake Crane Wing Chun Mun.
    Robert Chu, PhD, L.Ac., QME
    chusauli@gmail.com }
    I have never heard about yellow envelope , what is that for ? I know what are red and white envelope for , but yellow , this first I hear about that .

  14. #59
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Rockville, MD
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    2,662
    Quote Originally Posted by Minghequan View Post
    Hey Keith, Here's a novel thought for you ... Follow your own advice and "Just let it go!"

    Can you do that?
    Yeah, I can do that. Robert seems to have been checking in here. So he can take up for himself.

  15. #60
    KPM, before you go .... can I ask what if any is your connection to Robert, Jim & Hendrik???

    Ron Goninan
    China Fuzhou Zhenlan Crane Boxing Australia
    White Crane Research Institute Inc
    http://www.whitecranegongfu.info
    A seeker of the way

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