"Hendrik is on to": Deleted? (Zhaoyang Hand)

[Paddington]

[...] That is an advertisement illustration for an excellent 1/6 scale action figure based on the character from the movie.

You are kidding right?

I take your point KPM and I am just trying to take a balanced position, one that I think you and I share.

[FongSung]

B). Photo of Master Su YingHan of the YongChun YiYun Wushu Society ( A friend and guide of Mine)

C). Photo off a poster for a Movie about Wing Chun depicting and "Actor" ... That is your reference? Good God!

Erect/Standing palm....
meaning the wrist is straight, palm follows the alignment of the foreman. ie not flexing the wrist so the hand is parallel to the floor.

bent elbow ....
Speaks for its self

Yang Palm / palm facing the sun......
Generally means exactly that ... palm facing up to the sky in the yang position as opposed to the ying position facing the floor.

This action is completely different in idea and energy than that of Mun Sao depicted in the photo's, imho.
But everyone is free to interpret how they want. For us this action combined with the "flying flowers" is a pattern used throughout all our forms of Ban Chung Wing Chun.

Carlos

[FongSung]

Pictures of similar hand positions makes me realize another reason why you deleted that thread, Hendrik! You took all the pictures with it when you got cornered, you sneaky b@stard. You can't delete it this time though.

You didn't like the fact that your "Buddha counsel hands" posture you claim proves your Wing Chun's connection to Emei is also found in other unrelated TCMA, which discounts your absurd claim.

This shows you doing your Emei "signature move" side-by-side with the identical posture used in Songshan Shaolin from centuries earlier. It's also a salute and has application.

If you want to research any one style, you can't be ignorant of other TCMAs. Common hand shapes and actions are found in almost every system of TCMA. It's beyond absurd to look at similar postures and claim direct connections without answering the essential historical questions of who taught what to whom, when and where!

Yes of course every action in SLT has an application... for this pattern can be direct or a start for a concept.

Carlos

[KPM]

You are kidding right?

I kid you not!

http://www.unbox.ph/play/donnie-yen-...e-by-enterbay/

I would love to have one of these. But they are pretty expensive!


I take your point KPM and I am just trying to take a balanced position, one that I think you and I share.

Hendrik leaves a lot of things to draw criticism about. I just thought that the fact he used a movie character to illustrate a common hand position in Wing Chun was a relatively minor one!

[PalmStriker]

No one knows everything.
No one get everything 100% right .
However, from multiple source and evidence what is very likely always has a trace.



Strange that people complain on what has evidence and more likely, and ok with
Shaolin and general Qi book
Which are totally off.

Your Yik Kam lineage records obviously examine and substantiate the Snake QiGong Internal system, that you have proven. As far as the 5 Elders story is concerned, including YKS system there was the Emei connection. To actually insist that there was no Emei connection we would have to negate the role of rhe Shaolin Nun Ng Mui also.

[Vajramusti]

Your Yik Kam lineage records obviously examine and substantiate the Snake QiGong Internal system, that you have proven. As far as the 5 Elders story is concerned, including YKS system there was the Emei connection. To actually insist that there was no Emei connection we would have to negate the role of rhe Shaolin Nun Ng Mui also.

----------------------------------------------------------------
A yik kam lineage story is just that- a yik kam lineage story.

[kentchang]

Your Yik Kam lineage records obviously examine and substantiate the Snake QiGong Internal system, that you have proven. As far as the 5 Elders story is concerned, including YKS system there was the Emei connection. To actually insist that there was no Emei connection we would have to negate the role of rhe Shaolin Nun Ng Mui also.

Hendrik Santo has been twisting Yik Kam lineage with Ermei 12 Zhuang and modifying some of the SCWC kuit without the blessing of Sifu Wayne Yung. Out of nowhere Hendrik also used some terminlogy from somebody's secret book to claim his connection to the origin of the real WCK. Is this BS really that difficult to see through? Only Serigo Iadarola would fall for this, or just like Robert Chu said, he just wanted to use Sergio for publicity, but this is definelty not real WC research on any scale.

In the following post I think Chun Ki has summed up Hendriks' agenda pretty good.
http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/...ROVERSY/page11

Originally Posted by Chun Ki View Post
Hendrik Santos VS. Kenneth Xiang Fuk Lin

HS: Southeast Asia - Malyasia
KL: South east Asia - Indonesia

HS: associate with same unqualified researcher Sergio Iadarola
KL: associate with same unqualified researcher Sergio Iadarola

HS: Claims to be successor
KL: Claims to be successor

HS: says Emie is Wing Chun
KL: says HKB is Wing Chun

HS: Forgery of documentation (Zuti car’s document refrence, written by non-chinese person and not 19th century writing, written in 21st century modern simplified Chinese characters.) HS so called historical document does not match historical era.
KL: Forgery of Vikoga Wing Chun material, forgery of Hun Mun, forgery of 18 Lohan, 5 Ancestors, ect.

HS: says he has the true Wing Chun.
KL: says he has the true Wing Chun.

HS: Steals SCWC 1890 material then twists and changes it to 1894 kuit. More Forgery.
KL: Steal years of internet, books, video material to make many websites, names. Ongoing twisting, worming and stretching his HKB his-story.

HS: baise to Master Yung but Master Yung publicly denouncement HS. HS’s Cho family publicly denounce HS.
KL: KL’s previously claimed successor and inheritor of HKB, GM Tio makes a public denouncement of KL. KL’s Sihings publicly denounce KL.

HS: Claims baise to Yung then disrespects him later.
KL: Claims baise to Tio and 7 hole oath then disrespects him later.

HS: Wants to become a big part of Wing Chun history
KL: Wants to become a big part of Wing Chun history

HS: Uses non-Wing Chun people to endorse emie as Wing Chun orginal.
KL: Uses non-Wing Chun old HKB men to endorse HKB is orginal Wing Chun.

HS: Emie master saw HS paper and highlights a few words then jumps to conclusion that Emie is Wing Chun orgin but Emie master does not know Wing Chun. HS uses non-Wing Chun people to validate Wing Chun.
KL: VTM makes fake report to jump to conclusion that HKB is orginal Wing Chun. KL uses VTM’s material and resells it to VTM to get non-Wing Chun students to validate HKB is Wing Chun. Just see there huge youtube video testimony propaganda.

HS: uses Emie master to sign paper that Emie is Wing Chun orgin.
KL: uses Master Tio to sign that HKB is 5-flags Wing Chun and orginal Wing Chun.

HS: uses Cho family kuit and changes it to match Emie kuit.
KL: uses HKB, changes history and stories to make up 5-flags Wing Chun. HKB = 18 lohan, 5 ancetor, Vikoga Wing Chun, ect

HS: No Emie in Cho Gar Wing Chun or Cho Hung Choi Wing Chun or Yik Kam Wing Chun.
KL: No Wing Chun in HKB. Old men cant perform SLT, CK, BJ.

HS: Rename/re-branding things that already exist
KL: Rename/re-branding things that already exist

HS: word play
KL: word play

HS: Emie false stories
KL: 5 flags Wing Chun false stories

HS: Fake buddist
KL: Fake buddist

HS: Fraud, liar
KL: Fraud, liar

HS: Mouse
KL: Rat

[Daniel Fong]

Hendrik creates a thread, but he finds a lot of people against him, leaving some bad information for the future historian and wck researchers to get those information. The only way he can do is going to delete them.

Today, we can see why he likes to start a lot of his threads because he can control them, Like the "Sifu Sergio report on White Crane", there are a lot of evidence shown Hendrik telling lies. The thread is not good on him, then he deleted it because he wouldn't like the future historians and wck researchers to find his lies there.

They like to make use of each other to achieve their benefits. Hendirk and Sergio, Sifu Wayne Yung asked you to read, and see how you make use of Sergio to promote, and how Sergio being used to gain the mutual benefit below.

"佢行為己超越我的底線很多，離晒譜，簡直不知所謂，無中生有。跟佢的，盡段，佢黐線的", dated 2014-1-28, this show Hendrik you had done very very bad on Sifu Wayne Yung without any reason early this year, and Sifu Wayne Yung claimed that you are really a crazy man.

KentChang, more about how they make use of Sergio. Hendrik and Sergio should read it. The following was posted yesterday and it was totally removed in the thread "Inside The Snake Crane Wing Chun Controversy", and the thread was created by Jim Roselando yesterday, and now is locked.

Originally Posted by ccwayne View Post
1月28日

2014-1-28 10:36
Robert Chu
Why not meet with Sergio? Clear up things. Get the credit you deserve. I believe in you.
I think you're doing a great job for our family.
Again, I think its just a misunderstanding. Brothers sometimes fight and learn more about each other.

2014-1-28 10:45
Wayne Yung
佢行為己超越我的底線很多，離晒譜，簡直不知所謂，無中生有。跟佢的，盡段，佢黐線的

2014-1-28 10:47
Wayne Yung
http://www.kungfumagazine.com/forum/...c-announcement
A public announcement
www.kungfumagazine.com
A public announcement. The Wck information I present to the Wck world is based on the yik kam lineage and my own research and attainment for decades . I do not present any art of snake crane lineage because I have never study it and not in the position to present. As always, I recommended to wcners…

2014-1-28 10:47
Robert Chu
OK, but that doesn't mean you cannot do for yourself.

2014-1-28 10:47
Wayne Yung
所做的只被人取笑

2014-1-28 10:48
Robert Chu
Again, I only think that's just his way of saying he does not steal Snake Crane WCK

2014-1-28 10:48
Wayne Yung
Robert, I need to stop all related to him.
That is what you think.

2014-1-28 10:49
Robert Chu
OK. Just cool down, brother. When the emotions are normal, you can sort out better.

2014-1-28 10:50
Wayne Yung
He can clean up with me. Actually, just a personal matter only. In the beginning with me only, later, with my scwc. Facebook not sufficient and need to post to kfo. hahah..
Of course, I understand that. I was quiet last week, because I want to let time rinse it off. However, I didn't realize he posted to kfo. What means. Do all the people there knowing his relationship with scwc? Why put scwc in a bad position openly.

2014-1-28 10:52
Robert Chu
Be at peace, brother.
I don't think people don't think much of it. Maybe you think too much of it?
He's just stating he has no SCWC documents in his possession.

2014-1-28 10:53
Wayne Yung
I cannot stand for such behaviour. Will I bring out all his stuff to the public and saying I have no relation with him any more. IT is not the public matter. He should think who he is.

2014-1-28 10:54
Robert Chu
Yes, I see your side. And I see his side.

2014-1-28 10:54
Wayne Yung
Yes, your are right, people jut gossipping around then will forget. My point is that it shouldn't be occurred any way.
Did I openly say anything even I am not happy with his actions ?

2014-1-28 10:55
Robert Chu
People don't know details and generally don't think so deeply.
Most people just look at things superficially.

2014-1-28 10:55
Wayne Yung
I have my way to do scwc, and no need his help.

2014-1-28 10:56
Robert Chu
Of course. I just state for my opinion that you simply use Sergio for your own benefit, not let him use you, but you use him.

2014-1-28 10:57
Wayne Yung
Honest speaking, I never go to him, and just he came to me, try to make friendship, build up trust and take my things only.

2014-1-28 10:57
Robert Chu
HS?

2014-1-28 10:58
Wayne Yung
I don't understand what you mean above. I use Sergio ?
Yes, it is HS. I don't know Sergio, and never to him before, just last night messaging only, is my first time message him.

2014-1-28 10:59
Robert Chu
I'm saying you take the opportunity to use him for publicity. That is all.
Honestly, you and HS mutally benefited.

2014-1-28 11:02
Wayne Yung
Robert, did I do anything open to public ? He is 無中生有，似是如非 in our llast Saturday conversation only. Then he started the war.
OK, if you took me in this way, I have nothing to say any more. For publicity, hahaha... Any actions on publicity I have done, but HS only.
Hahha... simple thing become more complex, now I make use of this for publicity. Remember all we still in the chatting room and via email to express my unhappiness on him. I still keep my mouth shut. I am not happy with him why bring those stuff on the table openly.
I have no intention on publicity.

2014-1-28 11:05
Robert Chu
Wayne, you will be Jeung Mun Yan, and HS is Jeung Mun Yan of YK WCK. We all know each other, we're all close to the same age. We will all be around for the next generation... we should get along.
I still do not think your ratings have suffered at all.

2014-1-28 11:06
Wayne Yung
Any way, I have nothing more to say. Please see any benefit I can gain if I make use of this as publicity.

2014-1-28 11:06
Robert Chu
You are still a great star in HK!
I am not saying the HS incident. That's already passed.
I am talking to expose more about our SCWC family.
Nothing to do with HS.

2014-1-28 11:07
Wayne Yung
hahaha... I am sorry I don't know I am a star in HK, provide that HS post more on me openly.

2014-1-28 11:07
Robert Chu
Sihing, you can be stubborn, too.

2014-1-28 11:08
Wayne Yung
OK, Robert, I know what I should do. anyway.

2014-1-28 11:08
Robert Chu
I think a lot of this is overthinking.l
What?

2014-1-28 11:08
Wayne Yung
Let see whether I make use Sergio or not, that is what you think.

2014-1-28 11:08
Robert Chu
Yes.
Its just publicity for SCWC.
IN the west, you're hardly known.
It will be tremendous benefit, overall. Many will invite you for seminars to teach.

2014-1-28 11:10
Wayne Yung
robert, I never contact Sergio before, never never, He just whatapps me before he depart for Europe last week, and last night is my first time to say to him after his sifu Sunny So calling me yersterday.
OK! any way, you seems to bring another burning point up. No more to say. bye.

2014-1-28 11:11
Robert Chu
You're not angry with me, are you?

2014-1-28 11:12
Wayne Yung
You talk about me making use of others. hahah.... OK! I will never see Servio in my life. OK. Sure not to do. How come you think about me in this way.
Honest speaking, HS is making use of him ,just like making use of me.
I don't know him and no reason I need to contact him. hahahah...

2014-1-28 11:13
Robert Chu
I just say for publicity. Please don't misunderstand.
I think you're sensitive now.
I only wish the best for you Wayne.
Please don't misunderstand me.
I think maybe I don't quite say it right. If so, I apologize, Si Hing.

2014-1-28 11:17
Wayne Yung
OK lah! I need to work. Robert, I have my job, my family, my students, my classes, my scwc works, .... I am not a superman. I cannot accept that HS everyday, make so many utubes and bringing our a lot of what he think theory to educate people and ME TOO. I am really tired on his works. He has just his wck only. nothing else.

2014-1-28 11:17
Wayne Yung
Everyday, he send me utubes, telling a lot on his wck works.

2014-1-28 11:22
Wayne Yung
He has his dream in his mind. However, whether is is realistic or not, he cannot make clear of himself. He is really sick on wck. In OCt, we had discusssed about his daily posting. You had mentioned you didn't response his posting because you respect him. Me too. Actually, I have a lot of objection on his utube explaination. eg 7 bows : if the 7th bow use as what he said, the whole body will become unstable and falling forward, Why the ancestors not discovered that, because they tried and found out. You can see a lot tcma, never raised it up. Maybe White Crane.

2014-1-28 11:25
Wayne Yung
I can explaqin the YJKYM more detail than what he said. Richard and John enjoyed my analysis on how to bring the direct pushing force to the ground and how the ground force reacts. Hahah.. He just think he is superior than others, but never think we respect and not to object him only. Yes, he know how to use the right term name, but doesn't mean his explaination truely right.

2014-1-28 11:26
Wayne Yung
Honest specaking, on our relastionship, it is his intention to gain something from scwc only. I never approach him.

2014-1-28 11:31
Wayne Yung
MoMore, I never ask him any about Yik Kam, but he make use a lot scwc to re-assemble his ykwc. I also never ask his kuen kuit, but he a lot he is interesting ours. I don't mind to share with him even he is not scwc because I trust him before his public announcemtn. However, what he reacted.... hhahaha.... He also said my Jealous of Sergio. hahah... Robert, how come I make use of Sergio for publicity. Please tell me. Do I plan to do this? Or Do we plan to do ? hahah.... Now, no Sergio, nothing more related to him and you will see that.

2014-1-28 11:33
Wayne Yung
Time will show me any deal with Sergio. hahaha...
無中生有，似是如非

[PalmStriker]

I was just reading that Snake style Kungfu was one of the earliest of styles to be associated with internal development. Hendrik did produce some old Yik Kam lineage document pages to show that their SLT set was Qigong base more-so than the general SLT develoment practices of most other lineages, even those who incorporate snake boxing San Sik into their systems. Believability, somewhat. Emei connection obsession, yes. All I personally see in WingChun as a style is snake and crane fusion that was later given a name other than Southern SnakeCrane Boxing. In fact, I'm not even going to refer to this style as "Wing Chun" at all. http://chinesemartialstudies.com/201...artial-arts-2/

[Daniel Fong]

In the past on Facebook, Hendrik always makes yik kam wck analogy to 「笑敖江湖」story by 金庸




He said :「葵花寶典」 = Ermei 12 Zhaung ,



He said :「辟邢劍譜」 = ykwc kuit.



However, 練「葵花寶典」或「辟邢劍譜」，必須「欲練神功 必先自宮」。



No more any sexual life!!!
\

[Paddington]

[...]

Hendrik leaves a lot of things to draw criticism about. I just thought that the fact he used a movie character to illustrate a common hand position in Wing Chun was a relatively minor one!

Agreed, perhaps I was being too harsh here. One day I'll find a happy medium, I promise!

*goes back to twiddling beads, muttering 'right mind, right speech'*

[Paddington]

[...]http://chinesemartialstudies.com/201...artial-arts-2/

Thanks for the link PalmStriker. I felt like I was reading my own posts! I really like that blog, some great stuff on it.

[Minghequan]

Similarities do not mean any White Crane DNA is present. -The term 昭陽 does not be exclusively used in White Crane, it is a common term in Fujian 五祖拳 (Wuzu) too. Also, many similarities can also be found in Fujian 五祖拳.

[LFJ]

Similarities do not mean any White Crane DNA is present. -The term 昭陽 does not be exclusively used in White Crane, it is a common term in Fujian 五祖拳 (Wuzu) too. Also, many similarities can also be found in Fujian 五祖拳.

Not to mention the entire system bearing this name, Zhaoyangquan, found in Henan.

The stupidest excuse ever is to suggest that someone went to Fujian 300 years ago and copied only the one term to use as a name for their unrelated style back in Henan Province. You'd think they'd copy something more worthwhile after that trek...

That's even stupider than saying his Wing Chun contains White Crane DNA because it has this word in its kyut.

[Minghequan]

What in the Blue Hell is "White Crane DNA" anyhow???

Good God .. can he not just say "techniques or concepts, principles"???

And one hand form? hardly some sort of "Smoking Gun" of proof!