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Thread: Hung Sing Choy Lee Fut IS a Hung "(洪)" Family fighting method

  1. #1
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    Hung Sing Choy Lee Fut IS a Hung "(洪)" Family fighting method

    Hung Gar (洪家) gung fu is one of the more famous styles of Chinese Martial Arts to come from Southern China. "Hung" (洪) means Vast, Flood, and is a surname, while Gar (家) means family. This style was founded by Hung Hei Gung and further popularized by people like Wong Fei Hung. The martial arts its members practiced came to be called "Hung Gar" and "Hung Kuen" deep low stances, powerful hand techniques, and their trademarked Hung Gar bridge hand. They also have a strong connection with the Chinese secret society known as the Hung Mun 洪門 (Hung Gate). In fact, the majority of southern styles of gung fu were deeply intertwined with the secret society.
    The Fut San Hung Sing Kwoon (佛山洪勝/鴻勝舘) as founded by Jeung Hung Sing and his Hung Sing Choy Lee Fut (鴻勝蔡李佛) system is one of those styles categorized within the realm of "Hung Gar Kuen" or Hung Family Fist. Let me explain, I'm not saying we are part of the Hung Gar Kung Fu system, you won't see us doing their identifiable Kiu Sow. However, what I am saying is that the fighting method of Hung Sing Choy Lee fut created by Jeung Hung Sing is indeed an art with deep roots to the Hung Mun aka Hung Family. Contrary to popular belief, Hung Sing Choy Lee Fut wasn't established for Chan Heung in order to spread and promote the "Choy Lee Fut" style. It was exclusively created and developed to become a fighting art of the Hung Mun aka Hung Society and utilized in warfare right away.

    Jeung Yim never completed Chan Heung's Choy Lee Fut system and therefore could not have been representing Choy Lee Fut between the years of 1841-1867 for a few reasons. In 1841 Chan Heung was forced to ask Jeung Hung Sing to leave the Chan village in King Mui and instructed him to go to the Baat Pai Mountain which is found in the LouDing Province near the border of Guangxi. Jeung Yim was to locate a monk who went by the name of Ching Cho (Green Grass) to see if he would be able to complete his gung fu training. After he found the monk his training took 8 years to finish learning the Shaolin Fut Gar system. Then the Green Grass monk gives him a new name and instructions that would change Jeung Yim's life forever.

    In the time that Jeung Yim was away learning a new style under Monk Ching Cho, Chan Heung continued to develop his Choy Lee Fut system. It's entirely safe to state that Jeung Yim didn't get a chance to update his Choy Lee Fut training under Chan Heung during those years because of his absence. In fact, there's no mention of Chan Heung in Jeung Hung Sing's life between 1841-1867 and two and half plus decades is a long time to not be in Choy Lee Fut's picture. Imagine how far Choy Lee Fut advanced by that time and Jeung Yim wasn't there to pick any of that up. Still, he had whatever he learned from Chan Heung for those first 5 years.
    Another thing contrary to popular belief was Jeung Ah Yim wasn't sent to Fut San to establish a Choy Lee Fut school for Chan Heung. As a matter of fact, it was Monk Ching Cho who sent him there for a purpose. In those days the Chinese secret society preferred to communicate their messages in the forms of ****nyms, metaphors and ambiguous poetry or slogans. First he changed Jeung Yim's name to Hung Sing (洪勝 - Hung Victory) which was an abridged version of the Hung Mun's "Mission Statement" about overthrowing the Qing Empire. The secret behind the name is that it means "the Hung Mun will be Victorious in overthrowing the Qing Dynasty".

    The next thing that Monk Ching Cho did was instruct the newly named Jeung Hung Sing to travel to Fut San in order to make contact with the triad leaders there. Then he was to set up a school to train the freedom fighters for the up and coming Tai Ping Rebellion. At the time the Sam Hop Wui had its headquarters in the city of Fut San. Its believed that Jeung Hung Sing was also a member of this section of the Hung Mun. Interestingly enough, the Sam Hop Wui was founded by the Green Grass Monk.

    Jeung Hung Sing and his direct disciples fought in every major uprising in southern China between 1851 and the time of his death in 1893. In all of Fut San Jeung Yim's "Hung Sing Kwoon" virtually encompassed the entire city. Eventually it grew into the "Hung Sing Wui" or Hung Sing Society. Although Jeung Hung Sing passed away, the connection to the Hung Society continued on through his students and grand students. Following in the same manner as their founder and Grand Master thousands of Hung Sing students rose up in revolution after revolution against homegrown and foreign aggression.

    In the eyes of those who were afraid to lose their position of power, Hung Sing students were rebels who associated themselves with "gangsters" and outlaws. In the eyes of the people, and later in the eyes of their government, Hung Sing students were heroes. Additionally, students of Chan Heung's legacy were also hero's because of their own part in the revolution. In fact, a couple of Chan Heung's grand students Cheng Si Leung, Chan Siu Bak were partners with Dr Sun Yat Sen in his mission to overthrow the Manchurians. Students like Yuen Hai and Chan Ngau Sing in addition to grand Students of Jeung Hung Sing like Chin Wai Fong, LiangGuihua, Li Guanghai, and Wu Qin played very crucial roles in events like the Xinhai Revolution of 1911 and the Japanese invasion.

    While Wu Qin became one of Dr. Sun Yat Sen's bodyguards for swimming out and planted a bomb on and sunk a Japanese war Ship, others were hired to teach combat at the Wampo Military Academy. Then over in the United States, the connection to the Hung Mun continued through Professor's Lau Bun and Jew Leong, Grand Master Dino Salvatera and Sifu Frank McCarthy. While there are no more revolutions taking place, the American Hung Sing Kwoon's involvement was always out of loyalty and tradition. As a student of Hung Sing and a member of the Hung Society I am very proud to be a part of this legacy that has been running through the veins of the Hung Sing Kwoon for more than 163 years now.

    As I sit back and reflect on the extensive relationship between Choy Lee Fut, Hung Sing Choy Lee Fut and the Hung Mun i see more clearly now that while Hung Sing Choy Lee Fut has its connection to Chan Heung's Choy Lee Fut, our lineage wasn't developed to benefit Chan Heung. It was undoubtedly created, designed, and utilized for the Hung Mun. It would be incorrect to say Chan Heung gave birth to Jeung Hung Sing's lineage. If indeed this was the case, you would find more than a few forms created and passed down by Chan Heung,but, the fact of the matter is that Fut San Hung Sing Kwoon doesn't possess one single form passed down within the King Mui, Jiangmen, Kong Chow, or any schools closely related to Chan Heung. Therefore, when comparing Choy Lee Fut and Hung Mun, all fingers point to us being a school of the Hung family.
    Hung for life.
    Last edited by hskwarrior; 06-30-2014 at 10:23 AM.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  2. #2
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    Good work, hsk. Very interesting info.

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    thank you sir
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  4. #4
    Good post Frank, thanks for sharing your history.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  5. #5
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    thanks for reading it.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  6. #6
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    Amazing.

    A thread that contains interesting information about kung fu that everyone can enjoy.

    Thank you Mountian Lard.
    "I'm a highly ranked officer of his tong. HE is the Dragon Head. our BOSS. our LEADER. the Mountain Lord." - hskwarrior

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    you're welcome your heathen peasant scumminess.
    Last edited by hskwarrior; 06-30-2014 at 09:21 PM.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  8. #8
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    chinese jesus hong xiuquan lived in guangdong and guangxi. he promised his hometown people to rebel and loot northern cities to get rich. all of the "hong" boxing south of the yangzi river is named after him. any kung fu calle "flood" boxing is named after him. even the ones from shaolin temple.

    choy lee fut even has 4 forms named after heavenly kingdom. these forms were created to perform and please the 4 heavenly kings. the footwork from 4 forms draws the c4 haracters "tai ping tin gok" on the ground.

    the rebellion was a huge disaster and kung fu people were ashamed of him, so both northern hongquan and southern hung kuen often deny connection.
    Last edited by bawang; 07-01-2014 at 07:58 AM.

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  9. #9
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    you need to do some deeper research bawang.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  10. #10
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    the most important events happened during the taiping rebellion where the chan heun forged and tempered his character and dreams and his created his style

    your lineage history is not wrong, but it is petty politics. chan heun's refusal to create a new style and instead calling it choy+lee+style styles was a sign of his humility, lack of factionalism, and refusal to betray his teachers and steal their fame. lineage talk and promotion runs counter to that.

    chinatown cantonese are very far away from mainland and it does not concern them, so they are more concerned with links that show them to be more legitimate so they can make more money teaching kung fu. but the passion and fire of clf was born in the taiping rebellion.

    chan heun created the 4 heavenly kingdoms forms dedicating clf to the southern heavenly king. the kingdom promised economic social and gender equality.

    the northern "hong" quan of my hometown was renamed to honor the heavenly kingdom. they participated in the siege and looting of nanjing. there was also a northern hong men in the yangzi area that was wiped out after communism.
    Last edited by bawang; 07-01-2014 at 09:05 AM.

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  11. #11
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    oh, wow. ok. I KNOW there are 8 forms of HUNG SING CLF related to the Tai Ping Rebellion, but if you want to believe it was four forms......you're entitled to that.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  12. #12
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    there are tons of misc forms but the four forms write out the name of heavenly kingdom on the ground and the four forms are the most well known in guangdong and guangxi mainland.

    and my point is if you do research about the origin of these forms and the inspiration behind them its way more interesting than politics.
    Last edited by bawang; 07-01-2014 at 02:42 PM.

    Honorary African American
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  13. #13
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    what makes you think i don't know about the 8 forms?.....you're only half way there.

    and there is a reason why they were well known in guangdong and guangxi. its because of a certain green individual
    Last edited by hskwarrior; 07-01-2014 at 03:01 PM.
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

  14. #14
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    ttt.......
    Hung Sing Boyz, we gottit on lock down
    when he's around quick to ground and pound a clown
    Bruh we thought you knew better
    when it comes to head huntin, ain't no one can do it better

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