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Thread: Common Problems in 2 Man Forms

  1. #16
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    The same issue arises in boxing/kickboxing. I once visited a gym that insisted beginners learn sequences of mitt combos that went up to 20 counts. These are great for stamina but not much else.

    Two person forms as presented in CMA (unless its the sort of quality drill work that bawang presented) are a waste of time. If you have a partner around, you can do partner drills, short sequences of counters, sparring, etc.
    "I'm a highly ranked officer of his tong. HE is the Dragon Head. our BOSS. our LEADER. the Mountain Lord." - hskwarrior

  2. #17
    In boxing they have a similar drill. Jab- catch is but one. There are probably hundreds of variations. Working attacking and countering, etc. All to train you to respond ideally without thought. Same as I suspect 2 man drills on other arts . We did 1 and 3 step in TKD. In Kempo it was all really 2 man drills . Only free flowed during sparring.

    Some things I was exposed to were likely to never going to happen but it was all fun and made you think about possibilities.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by pazman View Post
    Two person forms as presented in CMA (unless its the sort of quality drill work that bawang presented) are a waste of time. If you have a partner around, you can do partner drills, short sequences of counters, sparring, etc.

    Yep, I agree. And I do not mind posting it again. Two Man Form is unnecessary. We should train sparring skill with life partner using 2 to 3 moves combo. These are moves we select moves from solo hand set. But not doing a whole routine with 100 moves in it.



    Regards,

    KC
    Hong Kong

  4. #19
    Seems someone on youtube decided to respond to the video. lol


  5. #20
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    Attachment 9293

    These aren't spearmen, they are pikemen.
    these fellas were used to keep cavalry from getting at the archers mostly.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    Attachment 9293

    These aren't spearmen, they are pikemen.
    these fellas were used to keep cavalry from getting at the archers mostly.
    90% of real chinese spear is pike

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  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    Attachment 9293

    These aren't spearmen, they are pikemen.
    these fellas were used to keep cavalry from getting at the archers mostly.
    What those pikemen are holding are closer to Chinese spears than what 98% of CMA schools use when they "train" spears.

    My original point stands.
    "I'm a highly ranked officer of his tong. HE is the Dragon Head. our BOSS. our LEADER. the Mountain Lord." - hskwarrior

  8. #23
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    There are no subtitles, but none are needed to enjoy all the different kinds of practice in traditional weapons practice shown in this video. I'll have more to discuss about this video but it is my bedtime.
    "I'm a highly ranked officer of his tong. HE is the Dragon Head. our BOSS. our LEADER. the Mountain Lord." - hskwarrior

  9. #24
    Many moves are end moves.

    In order to make them continue to flow, we have to modify them.

    Over time, it may become bad habits.

    It is always better to drill a few moves rather than many and many moves in one big routine.


  10. #25
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    So, in the video I posted before, you'll notice the different kinds of practices: solo line drills, partner line drills, live sparring, formal 2 person kata, and a long 2 person form. In most CMA schools, the partner line drills, formal 2 person techniques, and the sparring are all absent. The 2 person forms in TCMA are almost always performed with an amazing lack of precision, power, or even the faintest sense of distance. This video is labeled as "Advanced" on youtube:



    A few years ago I took a set of eight techniques from Yinshougun, turned them into a set of formal 2 person techniques, developed some associated drills, and defined a sparring rule set. I chose Yinshougun because several of my sanda classmates also knew the set. My sanda coaches was impressed, but the traditional wushu guys at the sports school were not. It really says a lot about CMA when the "modern" guys are actually more traditional than the "traditional" guys.
    "I'm a highly ranked officer of his tong. HE is the Dragon Head. our BOSS. our LEADER. the Mountain Lord." - hskwarrior

  11. #26
    2 man forms can be taken apart.

    We practice partner A. We then practice partner B.

    After a while, we may have a partner to practice either as A or B.

    In shuai jiao, you practice only a few moves and end with a throw or being thrown.

    The long forms are not needed except for show and tell.


  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPJ View Post
    2 man forms can be taken apart.

    The long forms are not needed except for show and tell.


    Now that I agree to.





    Regards,

    KC
    Hong Kong

  13. #28
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    Kendo lightsabers


  14. #29
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    Xingyi's Ahn she n Pao form is a two man form and the only two man sparring form in the style consisting of five moves in repetition between partners. I must say that until I practiced it I had no real grasp of how to effectively fight my teacher and the combination of attacking and continuous footwork were brought together. It is really a genius form in that it really "programs" you to move, strike, block, and evade. After practicing it at full speed for a time I was able to more effectively free spar (which was basically non sequenced execution of the form) with him and also with other people not in my style. When I first met my teacher and sparred with him he made a mockery of my efforts to engage him. After much practice in the two man form it became much easier but still required practice in free sparring to fully realize. I don't think without the 2 man form I would have ever grasped it though.

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