About Wah Lum Kung Fu

[SoCo KungFu]

Way way back in time I took one of their two week full time training courses at their head courters in florida. They sparred hard [or at least gave me their best guys when I attended their sparring classes] didn’t see much in the form of traditional applications though] you would be surprised in china they don’t do much of teaching applications for fighting either. It seems quite common to be show once or twice what the moves mean ,but never pairing up and practicing them. My advice would be either find a school that does teach and practice the moves from the forms with partners, or constantly ask what the movements mean for fighting and get a partner of your own and practice them, explore how they can be used in different situations

Right, so way back in the day you took a whopping 2 weeks and one free sparring class. And this makes you a qualified judge of the norm how?

Edit: Oh I'm sorry, two whole free sparring sessions.....

[SoCo KungFu]

I studied at Wah Lum for 4 years.
To answer your question...

- Do they teach practical self-defense? Yes. Absolutely.

- Will you be able to fight at the level of an MMA fighter or a professional
Muay Thai fighter? Probably not because that's a different realm. Wah Lum does not teach you to be a professional fighter. Remember, you said you were not looking for this level of fighting.

- Will you be able to defend yourself from a random thug on the street? Yes, absolutely. Again, you said this was all you were looking for.

- Fancy acrobatic movements at Wah Lum? Compared to most traditional kung fu styles, yes. Compared to contemporary Wushu, Wah Lum is still very traditional.

- Focus on physical fitness? Yes, absolutely.

- Focus on forms? The majority of your training at Wah Lum will be on practicing forms. There's just so many empty hand and weapons forms at Wah Lum, you'll never get bored.

- Focus on sparring? There is quite a bit of sparring practice but not quite so much as form practice. The majority of their sparring practice is typical point sparring limited to fists and kicks but every now and then they'll practice grappling sparring. Not simply just controlled takedown practice routines but actual grappling sparring.

- I have studied TCMA and modern Wushu at many schools in the US and in China. To this day, Wah Lum is one of the most disciplined TCMA schools I have ever attended. They don't let you half ass your techniques like many schools do.

- is Wah Lum a perfect system? Absolutely not.

- Is any style or system perfect? Absolutely not.

- Will it be perfect for you? Possibly, but only you can know.

Your post is contradictory. If the focus is on forms, then they are not doing adequate preparation for actual fighting. If the focus is on forms, then by definition, there is not "quite a bit" of sparring.

FYI, With the possible exception of big mantis (only because its modified beng bu), nothing is traditional about wah lum material. I'll say it again. The only reason no one lumps wah lum in with shaolin-do is because chan poi had at least some tracing of a legit lineage. Disregarding that he only trained in that lineage a handful of years and then went on to poach from half a dozen southern styles to make up for what he doesn't know of the original WL material.

[Wuxia007]

Your post is contradictory. If the focus is on forms, then they are not doing adequate preparation for actual fighting. If the focus is on forms, then by definition, there is not "quite a bit" of sparring.

FYI, With the possible exception of big mantis (only because its modified beng bu), nothing is traditional about wah lum material. I'll say it again. The only reason no one lumps wah lum in with shaolin-do is because chan poi had at least some tracing of a legit lineage. Disregarding that he only trained in that lineage a handful of years and then went on to poach from half a dozen southern styles to make up for what he doesn't know of the original WL material.

I respectfully disagree.
I do not see a contradiction. For example, in a total population of 100, if group A is 51% of that 100 and group B is 49% of that same 100. Then it is safe to say that while group A is the majority, there is still many of group B.

Are you confusing "traditional" with "original"?

[SoCo KungFu]

I respectfully disagree.
I do not see a contradiction. For example, in a total population of 100, if group A is 51% of that 100 and group B is 49% of that same 100. Then it is safe to say that while group A is the majority, there is still many of group B.

If your intent is to be a functional martial artist with your kung fu, forms should make up less than 10-15% of your training. You should be sparring every class, at least half of the class. And that is probably being conservative. Forms are for teachers to remember the moves/concepts, not for students to train with.

That I have to explain this to you, tells me all I need to know of how things are still done down in Orlando.

Are you confusing "traditional" with "original"?

No

[wiz cool c]

Right, so way back in the day you took a whopping 2 weeks and one free sparring class. And this makes you a qualified judge of the norm how?

Edit: Oh I'm sorry, two whole free sparring sessions.....

yeah they had an ongoing sparring class and sparred pretty hard, complicated hun. Also I had two rough matches with them, almost like challenge matches, and you are behind your nice safe screen running your mouth, so obviously I have more experience in this matter than you.

And about my documentary, yeah I know there are lots of jealous people these days but I am quite proud of my accomplishments I have done about 30 commercials, written 6 articles for this great magazine, my coach Yao Honggang[his brother is in the ufc now] will be making a movie soon will be in that. Had the Sweden government invest 30 thousand rmb in telling my life story, that was the first investment seconds coming soon.Have a book coming out soon[already got publishers waiting on it] So I have given back a lot to the martial arts, you are just another angry guy on the internet.

A new member to the loser list Ignore List "for those without a life"


bawang
LFJ
SoCo KungFu
Syn7

[Wuxia007]

And about my documentary, yeah I know there are lots of jealous people these days but I am quite proud of my accomplishments I have done about 30 commercials, written 6 articles for this great magazine, my coach Yao Honggang[his brother is in the ufc now] will be making a movie soon will be in that. Had the Sweden government invest 30 thousand rmb in telling my life story, that was the first investment seconds coming soon.Have a book coming out soon[already got publishers waiting on it] So I have given back a lot to the martial arts..."

Congratulations on your achievements. The filmmaking and writing lifestyle isn't easy.
I, myself, am a freelance filmmaker. If you're willing, I would love to see your work.

[wiz cool c]

Congratulations on your achievements. The filmmaking and writing lifestyle isn't easy.
I, myself, am a freelance filmmaker. If you're willing, I would love to see your work.

thank you Wuxia007. you can add me on facebook, i will send you a private message

[rett2]

Forms are for teachers to remember the moves/concepts, not for students to train with.

Is this necessarily the case? Forms are a predictable, low-injury environment for practising and learning footwork, techniques and a style’s approach to whole-body coordination. This could be a useful step before going into the more unpredictable environment of sparring. Certainly a lot of traditional teaching, based around lifelong sustainability of training, sees it this way.

However I might agree if a school goes on teaching form after form after form to students at the expense of applications and freeform playfighting. Having a huge number of forms seems more like something for a teacher, a repository of knowledge. Of course it depends on students’ goals. If they like forms, and feel an affinity for the training, then great.

[BBarbieri]

Hello!

Please, correct if I am wrong:

Considering the statements that I have read in this thread, it seems that forms are not related to fight?
They are just movements to improve your strength, flexibility and health in general? They are not supposed to be used in real situations?
Is it?

Thanks for your time in advance!

[ShaolinDan]

Hello!

Please, correct if I am wrong:

Considering the statements that I have read in this thread, it seems that forms are not related to fight?
They are just movements to improve your strength, flexibility and health in general? They are not supposed to be used in real situations?
Is it?

Thanks for your time in advance!

Forms (in general) are related to fighting. The individual movements or short sequences of movements in forms are supposed to be used in real situations. However, none of these movements is likely to work well without pulling them out of the forms and drilling them with a partner under increasingly "live" circumstances. Many traditional MA schools do very little of this essential progression.
Forms are not necessary to combat training, but can be helpful. Progressive pressured practice of techniques is more or less mandatory.

However, everyone finds their own balance. Most of us want more than just combat effectiveness from our MA training.

I'm finding that what we want changes over time.
My advice: Don't spend too much time deliberating over where to train. Just start training somewhere. You have to start training before you can really know what you want.

[wiz cool c]

Hello!

Please, correct if I am wrong:

Considering the statements that I have read in this thread, it seems that forms are not related to fight?
They are just movements to improve your strength, flexibility and health in general? They are not supposed to be used in real situations?
Is it?

Thanks for your time in advance!

Alone they won’t make you a fighter. If you sincerely practice forms , with other body condition partner work and freestyle training they with help your fighting skills a lot. They also will teach you how to generate proper power within your system, the moves may have to be modified a bit to fit into practical self defense though. My teacher teaches the movement in the form to be used in fighting with a shorter tighter version of the movements, and stating from a hands up fighting stance

[SoCo KungFu]

yeah they had an ongoing sparring class and sparred pretty hard, complicated hun. Also I had two rough matches with them, almost like challenge matches, and you are behind your nice safe screen running your mouth, so obviously I have more experience in this matter than you.

Considering I grew up in the FL kung fu scene and trained with a number of individuals that had affiliation with the temple, no, you don't. I also think you have no **** clue what hard sparring, let alone a challenge match, would actually be.

And about my documentary, yeah I know there are lots of jealous people these days but I am quite proud of my accomplishments I have done about 30 commercials, written 6 articles for this great magazine, my coach Yao Honggang[his brother is in the ufc now] will be making a movie soon will be in that. Had the Sweden government invest 30 thousand rmb in telling my life story, that was the first investment seconds coming soon.Have a book coming out soon[already got publishers waiting on it] So I have given back a lot to the martial arts, you are just another angry guy on the internet.

I traveled the world, obtained a highly advanced education, worked on research to treat cancer, summited mountains...and have done this all before reaching mid 30's. I really could not give less ****s about anything to do with your life, this is a topic about Wah Lum. Go masturbate to your personal victories elsewhere.

A new member to the loser list Ignore List "for those without a life"

Bye Felicia

bawang
LFJ
SoCo KungFu
Syn7

Seems I keep good company...

[SoCo KungFu]

Is this necessarily the case? Forms are a predictable, low-injury environment for practising and learning footwork, techniques and a style’s approach to whole-body coordination. This could be a useful step before going into the more unpredictable environment of sparring. Certainly a lot of traditional teaching, based around lifelong sustainability of training, sees it this way.

Except they're not. Forms are a reference sheet. Little more. As a reference, they can provide insight into strategy. But that's about it, and the references are hardly all-inclusive. They do not teach anything about proper footwork, positioning, power generation or structure. Why? Because you need to be working with another person (preferably resisting you) to development those things. In fact, by relying too much on forms, you can create more incorrect mechanics than you would otherwise and could increase your risk of injury. This especially with kicking or grappling techniques.

[SoCo KungFu]

They also will teach you how to generate proper power within your system

NO! You cannot learn to properly hit something by not hitting things. Air provides zero feedback. Structure developed through forms practice is meaningless when you transition to actually hitting moving, solid objects.

[hskwarrior]

I might be an ass,

no, you're definitely an ass. hands down.