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Thread: Xu Xiaodong Challenges to Kung Fu

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    Xu Xiaodong Challenges to Kung Fu

    Chinese MMA fighter Xu Yao Dong issued an open challenge, claming Chinese martial arts is full of phoneys, particularly Taiji. A guy from Chengdu, Lei Lei, founder of Lei Gong Taiji, took up the challenge..... the result is... well....


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbhFdjiPe6w

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    Aye Carumba. Thank you for sharing this. Thank God for sparring lessons, hands up in practical fighting stance, etc.

    The Tai Chi guy just tried to deflect with his arms. Won't work.

    I enjoyed watching some of Shifu Onassis Parungao's old fight videos a whole lot better. A more practical way to make the traditional style work.

    For instance... (I guess I am analyzing the fight video here) why didn't the Tai Chi guy try to deflect with a groin kick/ over-head smash? Those apps/techniques are in the Tai Chi forms. Instead the tai Chi guy acts like he is playing push hands games when he is squared up against an opponent in a fight. That seems like it is an amateur mistake. An important lesson I learned from my Longfist teachers was, that push hands does not equate to sparring. Push hands is a good skill to have, it can be employed in sparring if necessary, but it is like any other technique or skill.

    I think I have heard people say this here before: more assertive, less defensive. Strict Tai Chi guys with little to no sparring or fighting experience seem to be more defensive. Than they get knocked out and that golden opportunity never comes to land that golden technique that you know oh-so-well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shanghai-mantis View Post
    Lei Lei, founder of Lei Gong Taiji, took up the challenge....
    So, fake Taiji and delusions of grandeur?

    Even so, the MMA guy went 0 for 6 standing punches.

    Didn't land anything until the guy was run down and he was finally able to land some punches on the ground. Great.

  4. #4
    The biggest mistake I see from the get go is, the Tai Chi practitioner, who was moving back a lot while squaring off, never really engaged the MMA guy who was entering with a lot of forward pressure...which is what a good fighter or someone intent on hurting you will do. When the engagement took place Tai Chi was retreating with no "root" to stand on. Had Tai Chi rooted and entered close enough to suppress the legs then took care of MMA's hands, he could have struck and/or taken MMA down. Instead MMA just bulldozed Tai Chi to the ground like a rock slide.

    Ouch! That will leave a mark.
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    Quote Originally Posted by robertdreeben View Post
    The biggest mistake I see from the get go is, the Tai Chi practitioner, who was moving back a lot while squaring off, never really engaged the MMA guy who was entering with a lot of forward pressure...which is what a good fighter or someone intent on hurting you will do. When the engagement took place Tai Chi was retreating with no "root" to stand on. Had Tai Chi rooted and entered close enough to suppress the legs then took care of MMA's hands, he could have struck and/or taken MMA down. Instead MMA just bulldozed Tai Chi to the ground like a rock slide.

    Ouch! That will leave a mark.
    The mistake was thinking he could fight without any sparring practise, the big mistake was thinking forms and push hands practise equals being able to fight

  6. #6
    this has never happened in china before, traditional gongfu guys were never called out. nobody in china heard of the 90s ufc or cares. this is a shock because the two guys are big names in china. the sky might fall down on the traditional Chinese gongfu industry.
    Quote Originally Posted by LFJ View Post
    So, fake Taiji and delusions of grandeur?

    Even so, the MMA guy went 0 for 6 standing punches.

    Didn't land anything until the guy was run down and he was finally able to land some punches on the ground. Great.
    the guy is the fonder of Chinese mma. he brought mma to china in 2001. he is the shi deyang of mma. getting ko by him is a great honor.
    Last edited by bawang; 04-30-2017 at 09:24 AM.

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    If the Taiji guy can move in circle, if his opponent has to move in straight and turn, his opponent won't be able to develop linear momentum that fast. Does Taiji have footwork? I have not seen one yet.

    I like the footwork in the following clip. If you can force your opponent to move with you, at least you can control the distance and angle.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bl77...ature=youtu.be
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 04-30-2017 at 04:47 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    this has never happened in china before, traditional gongfu guys were never called out. nobody in china heard of the 90s ufc or cares. this is a shock because the two guys are big names in china. the sky might fall down on the traditional Chinese gongfu industry.


    the guy is the fonder of Chinese mma. he brought mma to china in 2001. he is the shi deyang of mma. getting ko by him is a great honor.
    hes also an actor too isnt he? ive got a feeling its him who starred alongside Yu Cheng Hui in Judge Archer

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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    this is a shock because the two guys are big names in china. the sky might fall down on the traditional Chinese gongfu industry.
    Really? Being a "big name" doesn't mean that guy's Tai Chi style was legit or representative of TCMA.

    I just read that Chen Village accepted the challenge, saying it only means something if the opponent is someone recommended by everyone.
    So, hopefully they give him someone good and we see something more interesting.

    the guy is the fonder of Chinese mma. he brought mma to china in 2001. he is the shi deyang of mma. getting ko by him is a great honor.
    Hmm... I haven't been able to find much about him on the Chinese internet.

    The only other video of him on Youtube is him shamelessly beating up some weak guy in his gym who's obviously no match for him.

    Kicks him in the face after he's already down on his hands and knees...
    But how many punches did that take and the guy didn't even hit the floor...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXyTDCvVOQU

    Just seems like a loudmouth pr!ck trying to make some money/fame challenging what he perceives to be the weakest styles (Tai Chi).
    But now he's got more real martial artists stepping up, and he's getting scared. What if he loses??

    The only video of him actually facing a real opponent is from back in '03 against a Jiu-Jitsu guy, and he spends most of the match stuck under side mount, then gets caught in an arm bar and loses.

    http://www.tudou.com/listplay/p58S0h...CClAvwjac.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by LFJ View Post
    So, fake Taiji and delusions of grandeur?

    Even so, the MMA guy went 0 for 6 standing punches.

    Didn't land anything until the guy was run down and he was finally able to land some punches on the ground. Great.
    Off you go, offer to show the mma guy what real life fun can do...

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    Another faulty experiment

    The issue here is is terrain. In an open field, a longer weapon will be a shorter weapon. But in rugged terrain, especially forested like where the Dadaodui battles allegedly took place, a longer weapon might be disadvantageous.

    So it's akin to saying that Lei Lei represented Tai Chi/Kung Fu, when he clearly wasn't even skilled enough to know he was outgunned.


    WHO WOULD WIN: CHINESE BROADSWORD VS JAPANESE BAYONET? POLICE ACADEMY HAS THE ANSWER
    After a victory for mixed martial arts over tai chi, This Week in Asia settles another long-running combat rivalry
    BY CHOW CHUNG-YAN
    6 MAY 2017


    Police officers armed with Japanese bayonets and Chinese broadswords square off. Photo: Handout

    The martial arts world was recently set abuzz when MMA fighter Xu Xiaodong defeated tai chi master Wei Lei in a one-sided, 10-second bout in Chengdu, China. Some believe the victory proves Xu’s claim that traditional martial arts are outdated; others question whether Wei was fit to represent his sport. Either way, with a host of martial arts experts now lining up to fight Xu, the debate over the merits of various fighting styles looks set to rage on. Here, Chow Chung-yan weighs up another long-running combat rivalry - this one with its roots in the second world war

    It is common for a country at war to hype up a certain weapon to motivate its people. In China during the second world war, the weapon that most captured the public’s imagination was the Chinese dadao (broadsword).

    The war was brutally one-sided. Against Japanese imperial troops armed with bombers and tanks, most Chinese soldiers had only a simple rifle. Not only were the Japanese much better equipped, their soldiers were professionally trained. All Japanese soldiers had to go through intense training in jukendo – fighting with a bayonet.

    Jukendo was a combat technique borrowed from the West and combined with traditional Japanese spear fighting moves. In battles, the Japanese applied it with deadly effect.


    Chinese troops armed with dadao, or broadswords, during the second world war. Photo: Handout

    While the Chinese enjoyed a numerical advantage, their soldiers were mostly peasants who had little martial training. Not only were Chinese soldiers outgunned by the Japanese, they were often outfought in melees as well.

    In March 1933, a Chinese squad armed with the traditional broadsword carried out a daring sortie under the cover of night against Japanese troops occupying a section of the Great Wall. They won the close-quarter battle, but it was costly. The news greatly cheered the Chinese public.

    The war propaganda singled out the dadao for praise, billing it as the killer weapon against Japanese jukendo.

    The story was told and retold in the Chinese press and the legend grew with each telling. The dadao soon became the de facto symbol of Chinese resistance.

    According to the legend, a group of martial arts masters studied Japanese jukendo and developed a special move to counter it. The story helped to revive Chinese morale and boosted soldiers’ confidence in engaging Japanese at close quarters.


    Chinese police officers test the dadao against the bayonet in Zhejiang. Photo: Handout

    The legend continues to this day. Today, in Chinese war dramas, you often see Chinese soldiers charging towards Japanese invaders with their broadswords raised, killing enemies with ease.

    But is the Chinese dadao really effective against Japanese jukendo?

    Gone in 10 seconds – Chinese MMA fighter wipes floor with ‘thunder-style’ tai chi master

    Three years ago, the academy of armed police in Zhejiang ( 浙江 ) carried out an experiment. Forty armed police officers were organised into two teams. One received jukendo training and the other studied the dadao moves said to be devised by the masters. They then carried out three bouts of simulated fighting.


    The team armed with bayonets won the competition against the broadswords with overwhelming results. Photo: Handout

    The team armed with bayonets won the competition with overwhelming results. In one fight, within one minute, the dadao team were “wiped out” while the jukendo team suffered only three casualties.

    It was why despite propaganda overdrive on the virtues of the traditional broadsword, Chinese troops throughout the war focused their training on bayonet practice. They eventually reached parity with their Japanese enemies.


    The dadao team is wiped out. Photo: Handout

    Chow Chung-yan
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
    Support our forum by getting your gear at MartialArtSmart

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    Xu Yaodong vs. Yi Long

    Hopefully Yi Long won't rely on his iron head technique.

    At least he's closer to Xu Yaodong's physique.

    Shaolin Monk Hopes to Claim $2-Million Bounty on MMA Fighter’s Head
    By Atilano Diaz - May 8, 2017



    Virally popular Chinese amateur MMA fighter Xu Xiaodong is a man with a huge target on his back, following a 10-second beatdown he gave to Tai Chi master Wei Lei in Chengdu last month. In a video that spread like wildfire, Xu is seen relentlessly attacking Wei with punching combinations. And then following him to the mat for some ground-and-pound when Lei crumpled from a right hand.

    Now it seems Xu has angered the “traditional” martial arts community as a few have come up issuing challenges. There are a handful of “traditional martial artists” who have expressed interest in facing Xu. However, one incentive could really push things over the edge.

    A video of Chinese MMA Fighter Xu Xiaodong’s beatdown of a Tai Chi master went viral



    Chinese amateur MMA fighter Xu Xiaodong recently destroyed Tai Chi master Wei Lei. beating down the old man within 10-seconds in a viral clip that has taken social media. Now many ‘masters’ are after him and want revenge.

    Chinese multi-millionaire Mr. Chen Sheng has recently offered over 10-million Chinese yuan (nearly $2-million dollars) to any traditional martial artist who can defeat Xu. Mr. Chen, who is known as the founder of the wildly popular non-alcoholic beverage “Tiandi”, said he wanted to “defend the dignity” of martial artists.

    Xu’s one-sided beatdown of Wei Lei sparked intense debates over the effectiveness of traditional martial arts versus modern day fighting.



    Check out the original footage of the fight here…

    Up until a certain point, traditional martial arts such as Kung Fu or Karate, or even Tai Chi, have been thought of to be lethal forms of fighting. However, MMA in the modern day, popularized by Bruce Lee, incorporated the best aspects of each style into one. Nowadays, MMA is seen as the ultimate and purest form of combat.

    This apparently did not sit well with the traditional Chinese martial arts community. As soon as word spread of Xu’s destruction of Wei, various traditional martial artists have issued challenges.

    Two more Tai Chi masters, Lu Xing and Wang Zhanhai have issued challenges. Lu has already invited Xu for a public duel and vowed to “teach him a lesson”.



    A Shaolin Monk named Yi Long will be first to challenge Xu

    Guangzhou native and Chinese boxing specialist Shangxian who practices Shaolin Meihua Zhuang also expressed interest. Yi Long, a Chinese monk known for his martial arts skill has also made his intentions known and seems to be the first in line to challenge Xu.

    Now it seems their efforts will not go to waste and up to $2-million in purse is up for grabs. Mr. Chen explains that the prize pool will be split up over five matches. The winner of each fight gets $300,000 while the loser takes home $100,000.

    Pretty sweet deal for Xu either way as he stands to take home at least $500,000 even if he loses each bout. However Chen remained adamant that he wanted Xu to learn some sort of lesson.

    “I want him (Xu) to understand, he used this kind of extreme method to provoke Chinese traditional culture, and will need to pay the price.”
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
    Support our forum by getting your gear at MartialArtSmart

  13. #13
    Adding insult to injury, Gene?
    The Kendo guy in Isshu Jiai (Kendo vs. Naginatado) is far from doomed, although arguably at a disadvantage.

    The MMA vs Thunder Style incident is about two guys. Nothing more. Stuff like that can be seen on every school yard around the globe. And of course about a MA community that has such an inferiority complex it will blow it completely out of proportion.

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    haaaaa

    Quote Originally Posted by Cataphract View Post
    Adding insult to injury, Gene?
    Who me? No never.

    I'm just delighted to see a topic that everyone seems to enjoy chatting about. It's been a while since we've had a discussion we can all sink our teeth into here.
    Gene Ching
    Publisher www.KungFuMagazine.com
    Author of Shaolin Trips
    Support our forum by getting your gear at MartialArtSmart

  15. #15
    This is good because it's getting a lot of exposure. Both Cung Le and Yi Long offered to fight the guy and it's very doubtful he would fight either of them...and of course this is where everyone says "those guys are MMA/Sanda not Kung Fu!" But both those guys have identified themselves as traditional martial artists and kung fu guys. Obviously both are sport fighters, but if they don't see a necessary distinction why should we?

    You can be a traditional martial artist AND train to fight, even if that means, gasp, putting on gloves and stepping into a ring/cage/lei tai. Let him beat up the phonies, plenty of guys are calling him out, if he's going to duck the legit guys people are going to see through it. If he doesn't duck them, he's going to get his butt kicked.

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    Last edited by Kellen Bassette; 05-08-2017 at 04:35 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

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