Where did the "humble martial artist" myth came from??

[Zui Quan]

I mean,i guess we all have enough experience to know that some martial arts practioners are anything BUT humble. And,if you look at history and martial arts legends and tales,its not something recent. So,when did people started to associate martial artists with "higher moral and spiritual values" considering that,more often than not,that was not the case?

[Cataphract]

In the west it is about a chivalric ideal. I suspect that overlayed the perception of eastern martial folklore.
I mean, the bandits of the water margin were all sorts of types. Mostly just that, bandits. Some of them cannibals. It's really confusing what qualifies them as heroes. There were however martial scholars and gentlemen (as in gentry) with refined manners among them. It's complicated.

In all cultures and times martial arts attract the nerds. Kids who obsess about technicalities and tend to be bullied. Those kids grow up and sometimes train hard and become decent fighters. Et voila, your humble martial artist type.

[Jimbo]

There were periods (in certain places) where it wouldn't have been wise (for certain citizens) to flaunt the fact that they were MAists.

I've been training MAs for more than 40 years, and have met/interacted with a lot of different practitioners and teachers during that time. I can honestly estimate the number of truly 'humble', yet capable MAists I've actually met in person at less than 5 or 6. Keep in mind, 'humble' does not necessarily imply passive or weak, but confident in themselves and their abilities without having to be snooty or boastful, or even just very outspoken about it. I'm not saying that all those who weren't humble were bad people; they just weren't humble or modest about themselves, their methods/systems/lineages, and their abilities (or in some cases, 'alleged' abilities).

I certainly wasn't humble when I was younger, but time and maturity have changed me. Another reason is I really don't care what people think anymore, so I don't care if anyone thinks that I'm great or thinks I suck, or thinks nothing of me at all. I know myself. I rarely even discuss this stuff anymore, especially in person. However, MANY MAists never outgrow their need to feel validated, no matter how old they get.

[bawang]

compare russian prison to american prison. humbleness changes with time and environment

[Kellen Bassette]

All of the martial virtue stuff is to balance the practitioner out.
Real training is desensitizing. In times when it was associated with real warfare it was even worse.
You promote and pedestalize those ideals so you don't create psychopaths.

It's not much different in fight gyms today where they talk about only fighting in the ring, getting kids off the street, wanting to be seen as a productive part of the community...

[RenDaHai]

As above, for balance.

Going back to texts 2000 years old people are talking about studying WenWu, Culture and Martial Arts. The two must always go together as Yin and Yang.

Martial artists should be cultured for sure as stated above to avoid losing inhibition to violence. But what is more important and often understated is that those who first value culture should in turn come to value martial strength.

Culture is far greater than any individual or any generation could create alone, so it relies on being inherited. But it is also very delicate. If you are not strong enough to defend your culture then it will merely be usurped. It will not last until the next generation and you will have failed all of your ancestors who maintained it until you. So culture and strength must develop together. To have just Wu (Martial) and no Wen (Culture) one would have the ability to act but no purpose to act for and become a monster. If one had all Wen and no Wu one would have the purpose but not the strength to carry it through. Potency and Act require each other.

Strength and strife ground us in reality, they remind us of our material nature. Imagine a nation where the cultured forgot how to be strong? Where they thought virtue was just being nice to each other and not hurting anyones feelings. Where their politics, ungrounded by reality, would rely on the idea of a utopia of infinite resources like the foolish imaginings of a child. Why if such a thing happened the world would turn upside down, people would value what a person says more than the actual things they have done, criminals would have their rights considered before victims and students would rebel against their teachers. News would be replaced with propaganda, good people would turn against one another and genuine art would be overtaken by perversity. It would become a crime to have a 'problematic' opinion but violence and riot would go unpunished, even be encouraged. Sounds hellish.

Prudence, Temperance, JUSTICE, FORTITUDE