Free sparring on kung fu

[Jimbo]

a good historical link to classical martial art forms I think would be Muslim Kung Fu in Asia..I remember reading in Kung Fu Magazine Tan Tui was popular with Muslims in China a few hundred years ago.

Tan Tui/Cha Quan (Cha Chuan), as well as XInyi/Liuhe Quan, are examples of kung fu systems that are well-known to be popular among Chinese Muslims. IIRC, the founder of Cha Quan was a Chinese Muslim named ''Chamir'. These systems were still being practiced among the Hui (Muslims) up to modern times, and probably still are in some areas.

[MightyB]

Russia has had conflicts with the South years before the Boxer Rebellion so I wonder if like Imperial Russian Fight Manuals from the Tzar's army Pre-Soviet mention martial art solo form routines.

What about 1920's Soviet Union did they have fight contests?

David Ross used to post about this topic. Here’s a link to a rebuttal of one of his posts, it’s pretty interesting. https://zhongguowuxue.wordpress.com/...o-controversy/

I tend to think he’s mostly correct on this subject; the rebuttal provides more historical insight.

[MightyB]

武藝圖譜通志 (Muye Dobo Tongji) is a comprehensive illustrated Korean martial arts manual, commissioned by the Korean King Jeongjo in 1790. There are a total of 4 volumes in this manual, documenting 24 arts of the Korean military.

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During the Japanese invasion of Korea in 1592 to 1598, the Ming Dynasty Chinese army lent their support to the Koreans and were able to push the Japanese back.

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As the Ming Dynasty Chinese shared their fighting and military knowledge with the Koreans, it is no surprise that Muye Dobo Tongji is written based on Chinese martial arts manuals of that time, such as:

紀效新書 (Ji Xiao Xin Shu) by General Qi Ji-guang

武備志 (Wu Bei Zhi) by Mao Yuan-Yi

少林棍法闡宗 Shaolin Staff manual by Cheng Zong You.

https://www.chineselongsword.com/korean

Below is a documentary about the Muye Dobo Tongji that's interspersed with clips of martial artist training.
Notice how the forms are practiced like military line-drills.

[diego]

David Ross used to post about this topic. Here’s a link to a rebuttal of one of his posts, it’s pretty interesting. https://zhongguowuxue.wordpress.com/...o-controversy/

I tend to think he’s mostly correct on this subject; the rebuttal provides more historical insight.

Thanks looking into this now, and Jimbo I forgot about Cha Quan lost this book in a flood years ago lucky we have youtube now, lol.

[diego]

David Ross used to post about this topic. Here’s a link to a rebuttal of one of his posts, it’s pretty interesting. https://zhongguowuxue.wordpress.com/...o-controversy/

I tend to think he’s mostly correct on this subject; the rebuttal provides more historical insight.

I think Pre-WW1 trader links is the best bet for martial art history like by 1920 any one with access to a theater house could watch Jack Dempsey fight reels and try to move like the champ. Why have I never seen a movie about 15th century Ninja hanging out with Captain Blackbeard training Shaolin to raid the seas.


French had Native tribes fighting British who had Native tribes fighting Spain in the 1600's.. in the popular port pubs there must have been stories of fighting styles from random Ronin.

[Subitai]

I'm pretty sure I heard that the history of Savate (French Foot / kickboxing) skills came from old shipping sailors. This dude, I forgot the dudes name?.... Said that the French learned at least some of their kicks from Chinese / Asian sailors aboard their vessels long ago.

Wait it was "Salem Asslis" right ???

If true...that means at least someone or somebody was sparring on ships way back. Enough for them to take interest in it.

[diego]

I'm pretty sure I heard that the history of Savate (French Foot / kickboxing) skills came from old shipping sailors. This dude, I forgot the dudes name?.... Said that the French learned at least some of their kicks from Chinese / Asian sailors aboard their vessels long ago.

Wait it was "Salem Asslis" right ???

If true...that means at least someone or somebody was sparring on ships way back. Enough for them to take interest in it.

I wonder if Boxing was developed from the Northmen`s sword and axe and French Shoe fighting was influenced by the warmer Mediterranean
climate like Romans fought in long t-shirts and breastplate armor the Viking would be using more upper body technique wearing 40 pounds of wet furs fighting on snow hills.

[ChungQuanMan]

I know Sifu Wong Kiew Kit may not have the best rep in the MA world - but this is one of the better summaries on this question/issue I've seen (not that it is directly from Sifu Wong)

https://www.shaolin-wahnam.ch/index....g-with-kung-fu

[Ninjaforever]

well, except that you say "most schools" do this. That is not true so much in my experience and most certainly is not the meat and potatoes of it these days where we are finally at the put up or shut up stage of things.

The first thing people do coming in my door is glove up and lets see what you got.

The reason for this is to get understanding immediately of what needs work. (Hint, often people are leg weak, oddly)

Anyway, one or two three minute rounds and it's not hard to assess where a person really needs to work in their martial skills.

I find that this is an effective means to assess and understand where a person is at and how to point them in the right direction to attaining the skills they would like to attain.

If someone wants fully full on wushu for performance and grading, I am not their guy and I will make it clear. I'm a traditional Kung Fu guy that takes only private adult students willing to work on themselves.

Glove em up first thing and you learn a lot. That is for sure. There is no room for arrogance when that is happening. Learn learn learn and keep learning.

Yes ok! How free sparring in kung fu look like? How can you apply the stance Gon bu, Putu etc. etc,on free sparring match? What are the difference beetween kung fu, and kickboxing? Is there some video who you can show me?