YAU KUNG MUN,DRAGON,BAK MEI, MANTIS & BFP similarities

[lungyuil]

as stated above, i am curious to hear from our other southern brothers on the similarities between our systems. mine being yau kung mun.

at what stage do you learn to develop ging?

what are the traditional conditioning methods used?

body postures, stances. are they long , short, protective of the groin area etc?

what level do you learn the pheonix fist?

what training do you have to develop the ging for weapons?

lets try and have a serious discussion without badgering. other threads are getting out of hand. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

[David]

Hi! This subject has come up a few times in the past and it's quite interesting. Just last week, for the first time, I saw some White Eyebrow on the ALMA website. The form was linear, the guy going forwards, turning round and coming back, turning round and going forwards again etc. and the techniques resembled the southern mantis I study.

What's Yau Kung Mun in English?

In southern mantis, ging training starts in lesson #1 but it won't come out for a long time.

Conditioning methods vary between teachers. My class trains conditioning by hitting each other. We hit fingers, hands, feet, arms, legs, backs, sides, ribs/abdomen and throat. I enjoy most of it...

Most of the time the stances are relatively high bow stance with some longer lower bow stances. Training is done face straight on and fighting more at an angle.
Shoulders and ribs are dropped and the shoulders often pushed forwards for extra reach.

Pheonix-eye fist is taught from Lesson #1 followed by ginger fist ("gurn a choi") soon after.

I don't know about the weapons training. :-(

The powers of Kung Fu never fail!
-- Hong Kong Phooey

bat ding bart but
sau chong som fut

my pak mei is very similiar to southern mantis, plenty of ging. hammers and pheonix being taught from 1 st class.
conditioning and sensitivity drills. the top 2 sentances are a basic stance and punch see if you can work it out!

we might just have a decent topic...

peace [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

[Lau]

Hi ,

Looking at the first forms of these styles you can clearly see a lot of simularities. It's all about the float/sink & swallow/spit. They must come from the same origin.

I tried to look at the ALMA form. But it seems I need to have a credit card to gain acces. What a pity. Is there any other way I can see it? Is it possible for someone to mail it to me?

Ps, in my opinion it is these 'first forms' that are the most important forms of the systems.
Regards, Lau

[J]

Lau,

What do you consider the first forms for each system?

cheers,
J

[Fubokuen]

Well, they aren't all exactly the same, but the similariries are very intriguing. There many odd variations within lineages too. The 3 steps up and 3 steps back principle seems fairly common to each. FT, David and Lau are right about the posture and stance.

[lungyuil]

yau kung mun basically means hard/soft style,
the original YKM consists of only 3 internal forms. it used to be known as the "style with no name".
the 3 original forms are, as told to us about our history, the original dragon forms. many people might disagree, but each to their own.
our external hand forms are a combination of bak mei/dragon.

from what i've seen, we all have the basic jik bo kuen, whatever the name. our power generation is similar yet different. we tend to use the waist alot more.

are your stances linniar, as in full step front stance, ours is circular. the purpose is to off balance. we do have front linnier, but that serves a different purpose(depends on the attack or defence)

[LIN Q]

Different styles obviously branching out to develope different ways of exspressing the same powers will have completely different looking forms and techniques but with the same style having versions of the same naming and looking forms is a result of what? Besides teacher's interpritations of the forms I suppose versions were taught to students within the same school.Even though theorietical the true system is passed to a selected few what happens to the overall image of a system when these versions are taught. Relating to what is now the discussion of whether or not clc's pakmei is the original and only(not to mention he too taught different versions).

[MoQ]

Is this the Queens English?

Actually the CLC Topic is long gone you just want to dig it up cuz you're new... or...?

You seem to think that YKM is the oldest of these arts when in fact it's the youngest.

[lungyuil]

guys, can we forget about CLC's bak mei,
moq, you are correct about YKM being younger than bak mei(external forms only), the internal forms as stated earlier are old, they are said to be the original dragon as stated in my earlier post.

[David]

This is the first time I've heard of YKM. Where is it taught, where did it come from etc?

What exactly is a circular stance..? Is it toes inward or feet on the circumference or...?

The powers of Kung Fu never fail!
-- Hong Kong Phooey

[lungyuil]

david,
YKM comes from southern shaolin temple.
our great grandmaster Ha Hon Hung brought the system out of the temple.
he originally trained under CLC & LYK, he left them to train with Tit Yan a shaolin monk, who taught our GGM the internal forms (3 only) of YKM. OUR GGM added the external hand forms from a combination of bak mei/dragon and whatever he learnt form Tit Yan.

our stance has the front leg facing 45deg. with toes gripping the floor, knee is bent to protect the groin area. balance is 50/50.

circular step means from a front stance, you bring your rear leg up in a semi-circular motion, so your feet are in together then out in front in line with your shoulder.

[This message was edited by lungyuil on 10-16-00 at 02:49 PM.]

[David]

I train my steps in a circular manner but also with lift as if you were stepping round and over an obstacle...

Is there any chance a compilation video could be made of these styles early forms etc? Who wouldn't want that??

The powers of Kung Fu never fail!
-- Hong Kong Phooey

[Bastet]

David -
My Sifu is currently working on making a series of videos on YKM (internal & external). These will include some of the forms. There is also a web-site under construction - ill let you know when its up. in the mean time there is an american ykm web-site at ykmusa.com

Just to clarify - YKM is known as a southern style but it actually came from the NORTHERN shaolin temple. The monk Tit Yun travelled south & found 1 lay-person (HHH) to become his disciple (originally just the 3 internal forms + irom palm, meditation, herbs, push-hands etc). Yes he did learn Bak Mei prior to learning YKM - our external forms are those that Ha Hong Hung integrated from Bak Mei.

and it's "the original Dragon forms are internal YKM" not "the internal YKM are the original Dragon forms" (does that make sense?). I dunno if i believe that though - thats just off one web-site that is apparently questionable. My Sifu has never mentioned anything about this.

My Sifu & one of his Sihings have actually just had the Australian launch for a book & video on the system. They may be signing a deal with a publisher in the States very soon to do a whole series.

Anyway, if you want anymore info on the system you can email us on yaukungmun@hotmail.com

blessed be,
a.

[sing fu]

Bastet,

I wonder if you might be able to give some insight into the form names/structure of the physical training in Yau Kung Mun?

Thank you in advance!