John Painter

[Sam Wiley]

I got to thinking about something I read on his site. On one page, there's a bunch of pic's of him with weapons, and at the bottom there's one with him holding 2 daggers. The caption says that that form was a speciality of his master but since his knives don't exist any more Painter had some designed based on drawings and specs left to him, and the caption gives a description of the originals. The problem is that the knives in the picture are not of Chinese origin (they are Afridi knives from the Khyber Pass region, if I remember). That says nothing about whether or not his master liked to carry them, but they are not ones Painter had designed. If he had some knives designed, wouldn't he have posed with them?
The page from Painter's site

The same knife on Atlanta Cutlery's web site (Go to page 2, item no.13, of the section on Fix Blade and Tactical knives, it's labelled "Khyber Fighter.")

I have attached a jpeg of the Khyber knife I bought for my stepfather in December from Atlanta Cutlery, which is the same one as in the pic on Painter's site. If Painter had his custom made, he paid way too much for them. I only gave $12 for this one.

Also, I couldn't get the pic of the knife on Atlanta Cutlery's site to load for me, so it may be the wrong one, but the price and description fits the knife I bought in December.

What I don't get is why someone would,
a)have the knives designed and pose with completely different ones, or
b)lie about the knives themselves, as I have never heard of this kind of knife called a "dragon's" anything, or
c)make something like this up completely.

[Shin]

good catch on the knives Sam.

Didn't Kevin Wikse used to study with Painter? What happened to him anyways?

And how long do you think it will be before these pictures disappear forever? You can't save them from the site, so if this gets too hot to handle, they could just "disappear". Don't worry though, I've secretly sent copies to a safe deposit box in switzerland.


BT, the style was called daoqiquan.

There are a few other inconsistencies on the site too. Most of the ages are correct, but it claims the teacher died at the age of 100, in 1980, but he was born in 1890.

Also, the picture of the li family mauser say's it's a .45. The statement about Li says he was a crack shot with his 9mm mauser.

I'd really love to hear an explanation for this. I don't have anything against him, and I'd never heard of his lineage before, but I do think he should have a chance to say his piece as well. It's easy to convict a man who can't speak in his own defence.

[Guandi]

>You can't save them from the site, so if this gets too hot to
>handle, they could just "disappear".

actually it's very easy to save the pics. All you have to do (with MS Internet Explorer) is grap a picture and drop it eg on you desktop. That's all.

Guandi

[red_fists]

Another method is as follows:

A lot of sites prevent you from doing a right-click.

Not a problem save the URL in Notepad.

View the Page source and look for the picture link. Some idiots but the WHOLE Web-adress in that case you don't need the URL.
Use the Page URL and the Link together to form a NEW URL that links directly to the Image.

Enter URL and the Image ALONE will appear right click and safe.

If you want more than one Picture., save the Page source and remove all the stuff except for the picture links.

Most People also save their Images in a seperate sub-directory, but don't protect the Directory with an "index.html" file.

In which case you enter the URL up to the sub-directory and it should pop up looking like a FTP screen.
Right click on each entry and to "save as ..."

Viola.

P.S.: This won't work for sites like mine where the links are in an external javascript file.

[Guandi]

I think it is necessary to distinct between his self promotion and his skill. That he has strange pictures on his site and is doing sometimes also some strange selfpromotional things does not mean that he is a fraud in the sense that he has not the skill he claims to have.

Lets say, although I have never met Mike Patterson, he is widely recognised as a good fighter and coach. If you go to his web-site and there to his teacher directory, you can see that he is saying that he has met Dr Painter personally and that he "can recommend these individuals [Dr Painter] with complete confidence".

Guandi

[tnglng]

Really? If Mike Paterson recommends him, that would be a pretty decent referral. I trained briefly with Mario Mancini when he was living here in NJ (one of Paterson's students) and he was a real fighter who could use bagua and xingyi well.

Count: Thank you for your condolence. no, not for 17 years. Only the last two years, unfortunately. I spent more time with him than anyone else in his family. Best 2 yrs of my life. We had so many plans, more to learn, oh well. It's very hard to find a teacher like that, you are fortunate. I know exactly what you mean about the language thing--I could understand it too, somehow.

[blacktaoist]

Guandi) I think it is necessary to distinct between his self promotion and his skill. That he has strange pictures on his site


BT) There is nothing strange about John Painter pictures on his web site. They are fakes" thats just the bottom line. Why would a person want to do self promotion with false pictures advertising that these photos are his teacher. Come on Guandi open your eyes man".

Here is some thing for you to think about Guandi?Why have Mr. John painter not have someone from his Style teach. $hit I know he is not the only person his teacher pass down his family style too. There should be some one alive from his teacher family.

As for Mr. Painter skills I can careless what people have to say about him now. The truth of the matter is the pictures on his web site is false. nothing strange about that in any form.

Yes the man may have some skill, but the pictures of him and his techer are fase. So that means his statements about him and his teacher are misleading and untrue.

You just can't justify lying. Don't be a follower of Bull$hit.

There is a old saying: No matter how hard you try to hide a lie in the dark. Sooner or later the truth will come out in the light".

Peace

[maoshan]

Sam,
I didn't mean that I have the original pictures. I mean that they are in old articles with the oictures attached. Like inside kung fu,
Or Internal arts mag.

It's sad man
Dam

[Sam Wiley]

Even worse than having the actual photos in hand...they were published and seen all around the world!

As well known as Painter is, I still want to give him the benefit of the doubt. I would like to find sometime down the road that I am wrong in my new opinion of him. However, faked pictures and the stuff I realized myself about that one, point to something being seriously wrong here. Is it possible that his webmaster did this without his input, editing pic's and putting wrong info or info with typos in it up on the site?

[Sam Wiley]

As a side note here, what's the deal with his titles? One minute he's a Doctor, another he's a Captain...anybody know?

[illusionfist]

Besides the obvious weird stuff going on with the head and painter not having a shadow. have you noticed how clear the characters look on the scroll? That also seems to have been cut and pasted on.

Peace

[illusionfist]

As far as titles Sam, i remember when Painter just went by Biff Painter, hehe. If you can get some old IKF"s, he had some articles with that name.

Peace

[redfist]

painter is trying for mass appeal,

sifu; for the "martial artist" angle,

doctor; the "healer" angle,

captain; the "law enforcement" angle,

i would have never said anything,but when i saw those photos
enough is enough,

there are two phases to the con,
1.the set up,gain there confidence slowly over a period of time.
in painters mind he hedges his bet on two fronts,
a. if everybodys doing it it can`t be wrong,and he`s been doing it for a while.
b. he knows that the chinese commmunity won`t spill the beans
even though he`s a laughing stock among them,why?he`s good for business.
the second phase of a con is,
2.extortion,his defense would be to intimidate any detractors if,
he where even to acknowledge any of these posts.
how do i know this? one look at those pictures shows his comfort level,
why intimadation? he has nothing of substance to back up the claims he`s made,

all of my posts have been made out of compassion for my younger
brothers and sisters in the martial arts who read on this sight,
i have nothing against j.painter,
and i`m not into slinging mud,for the sake of my own entertainment,
try to remain objective and you will not be so easy to get caught in the game,after all,
it`s all a game and you got to know how to play it.

ask painter,he plays it very well.

[Sam Wiley]

Hmmm...Biff "I hate manure!" Painter....

[Chris McKinley]

Even giving him the benefit of the doubt (he's been very gracious and generous in my communications with him), I would still hold him accountable for at least an explanation of the photos in question. Even if he didn't Photoshop them himself, or even greenlight the idea, they're on HIS website. The site's been up for a while now, and it's not so large that he couldn't have looked over each page of his own site to make sure he's happy with it.

If Dr. Painter happens to be reading these posts, I would suggest that, uncomfortable as it may be, he would do well to provide an explanation of this. Otherwise, this is the kind of thing that gathers momentum, and could end up stripping even the most legitimate guy of any and all credibility. He's put many years into his practice and teaching of his arts. Legitimacy questions aside, it would be a shame for him to allow something as silly as these pics to bring it all down. It'd be one thing if this were being discussed by generic joe-schmo martial artists, but there are some legitimate players yakking it up on this thread whose word-of-mouth could provide significant help or hindrance to someone's reputation.

Further, if by whatever chance, he had absolutely nothing to do with the creation or doctoring of those pics, providing a public statement might help to not only exonerate him, but perhaps even to show some class and earn some respect from his detractors. Either way, I just don't see how remaining silent on this thing at this point could be productive for him. The pics are just too questionable, and I'm saying this after having just defended the man on this very thread.