Application Based vs. Non-Application Based Wing Chun

[LFJ]

So does that mean you are just going to stand there and get hit???? Its not a hard question to answer!!!

If you're saying we're walking down the street, probably with our hands down at our sides, maybe carrying bags and not poised to defend a punch, and then suddenly see a punch ALREADY on it's way to our face before we even detect the presence of an attacker, then yeah, most likely scenario is we get sucker punched. Same for you. Same for everyone.

To think you will have time to throw up a taan-sau or something to block a sucker punch like that is fantasy. The punch would have to be coming in super slow-motion.

Whether or not we'll be able to effectively defend against a sudden attack, and what we'll do to defend, depends on many factors, such that it is fantasy to plan for the unforeseen with specific techniques. This is why we don't train technique applications, but principles of fighting behavior.

Absolutely people can disagree without resorting to getting nasty and personal about it. That's what I mean about some turning every discussion into an argument. I guess I tend to get sucked into it.

No, KPM. You do not get sucked into anything. Over at the MT forum I get along with everyone else just fine when you're not around. Even gpseymour has been playing nice with me. They ask questions, I share what I know. No one argues or gets personal.

That only happens when you're there. It's much more civil when you're banned, suggesting the problem is you!

It occurs to me that neither you nor LFJ will answer this question because you realize that the only way to answer it is to describe how you would react....which would be how you would "apply" your skills.....and this would be an actual "application."

That's exactly what we have told you! We don't do preplanned applications! Of course we will not play your application game. That would be asking us to misuse VT.

How do you have a martial art where you don't "apply" what you know?

No one has said that. We do apply what we know, but what we know is not endless technique applications.

So you have three empty-hand forms and a long dummy form. But there are no applications taught in any of those forms....only concepts? If this is true, it sure seems to me that your Wing Chun is either way over-complicated, or way inefficient in teaching. If it takes that many forms to teach someone how to use your concepts and yet still learn no applications of those concepts, then that doesn't seem like a good training paradigm to me. I would think you could learn the concepts and principles in a much more efficient fashion. After all, you have eliminated learning various applications from these movements in the forms compared to everyone else's Wing Chun, shouldn't your Wing Chun be more stream-lined and simple in comparison???

VT is very simple and efficient in its training method. You simply do not understand it.

If you want to learn the system first, then see how you can simplify it and make it more efficient while not sacrificing important stages of development or outcome quality, be our guest!

You are walking down the street and suddenly a wide loopy punch comes whipping in at your head. What do you do???? Dave had no problem answering that question. So what's your problem?

Again?? Geez...

Dave had no problem because he has no problem with 1:1 applications.

Our "problem" is with 1:1 applications, like you've been told repeatedly!