A word to the WCK family

[Hendrik]

How have I answered my own question? I don't understand what you mean.
I was looking for a simple yes or no to my original question-
is the SLT in the video similar in energy or movements to the slt you were taught?

Here is my view, see if it suit you.


As you said,

I already stated it wasn't the 4 section Siu Lien Tao, but the siu lin tao taught to beginners.

and,

it is a fact according to the kuen kuit that the 4 section SLT is not for beginner, beginner doesnt handle the type of details in power generation or energy or movement : such as sink Qi, and flow with medirians... force vectors....short inch jin...etc.


Is this answer your questions?




If you like to know more,
perhaps it is better to ask the person who evolve or create this set to explain his motivation behind it, what he expects one could learn from this set, and what is the different between this set compare with the 4 section SLT.



BTW:

Would you kindly share your name, your lineage, how long you have train, and who is your sifu? So we know who you are and your level depth needed in this discussion.

[Hendrik]

don't worry, nobody here does; you'll get used to it...(and now he's going to send me some love, I can just feel it...);

You are right, I am sending you more love with a message

"It you learn to shut up on things you are clueless. others will take you to be more wiser. I hope you are smart enough to not make youself look like an idiot fool for your own good."

[punchdrunk]

the best way to show the truth is to do just that.. show it. Otherwise it's a war of words. Take Yip Man vids for example, hard to argue with them as a record of a specific place and time.

[hunt1]

Hendrik In your stance do you sink to the dan tein or do you sink to earth?

[Hendrik]

Hendrik In your stance do you sink to the dan tein or do you sink to earth?

all needs to know about dan tien is here, take it extremely serious because lots of people mis understood, and doing mis practice on dan tien stuffs. that cause problem.

and I post it a while ago.

http://kungfumagazine.com/forum/show...&postcount=160

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKASk...eature=related

also, to be real real honest, the sink to earth concept is just a very superficial concept for begineer. dont ever expect this concept can carry one more then junior level.


Examine it, who in this world has training the " sink to the earth concept " and capable to Fa jin/ issue force or Hua Jin/ dissove force?

in general such sinking concept might be able to do some static gimmic but can do anything in dynamic situation.


Real life is about Balancing in a dynamic state, it is not about sinking because sinking is just one out of six vector force components in a 3D space.


IMHO,
The Yik Kam's SLT technology is a mind, body, force vectors dynamic flow balancing practice. when one is in a balance state one is actually feeling like "levitate" or effortless. that is the pre-requisite for flow. Comes accept goes return right?

it is certainly certainly NOT the upper body looks soft and the bottom is rigid and sinking to ground. That is actually DEAD and stuck.


Using the surfing as an analogy, if one can surf one could surf with big wave, otherwise one got sweep away. and a rigid and sinking to ground is hopeless facing a big wave. eventhough it might looks good while practicing in a bar tub and taking picture.

[hunt1]

Hendrik perhaps we are not talking about the same thing. Yes it may be beginner level but with out the proper basics nothing else will ever work correctly. This leads to so many different methods trying to mimic or get close to what they have heard or seen as correct but never able to duplicate it. If you can't stand you can't fight ,train proper energy , learn the horizontal or vertical circles use spirals etc.

You have been talking about the engine for power generation. How one stands will determine what one can use and what one will use. So to talk the engine that powers the system one must start at the basic stance and that stance will then present its own set of possible methods of power generation.

I am not a TCM expert and I never spent much time on traditional terms so this is how I answer the question I asked you in very basic manner. Sinking to the dan tein results in legs that are tight,firm in some cases tense. Sinking to earth the legs and supple and loose . You need supple loose legs to react in a dynamic fashion. Sink to earth does not = grounding or rooting. Sink to earth results in being able to surf. Not rigid at all sink to dan tein results in rigid locked body type of structure. Most WC I have observed is using a form of sink to dan tein.

[Hendrik]

Hendrik perhaps we are not talking about the same thing.

Yes it may be beginner level but with out the proper basics nothing else will ever work correctly.

This leads to so many different methods trying to mimic or get close to what they have heard or seen as correct but never able to duplicate it. If you can't stand you can't fight ,train proper energy , learn the horizontal or vertical circles use spirals etc.

You have been talking about the engine for power generation. How one stands will determine what one can use and what one will use. So to talk the engine that powers the system one must start at the basic stance and that stance will then present its own set of possible methods of power generation.

I am not a TCM expert so this is how I answer the question i asked you.

IMHO,


You see, one doesnt have to be a TCM expert.

Read my post carefully outside your thinking box. then you will see the rainbow I show you.



looking at the

Aircraft Dynamics, Abbreviated, Part 2, Calculating Forces and Torques of the following site
http://www.berkeleyscience.com/airplane.htm

one can see, "sink" itself is not edequate to describe or model a reality in the 3D space. even when one stand statically, not to mention when one got to move and everything move dynamically. "sinking" is simply in adequate because there are others force vectors needs to be balance.

analogy to the simplified air plane picture above, one needs to deal with the drag, trust, and lift be it when one is standing. So, the six directional force vectors and all the posts and the youtube I post up there is to address the basic of those stuffs. nothing so mysterious or difficult.

One cannot and must not throw out the other components and only talk about sinking. That is because sinking or downward direction force vector is just a piece of the story, there are 5 others pieces needs to be handle and balance.

Certainly, I can give you a B$ answer as ya, sink to Dan Die, sink to K1..... but those are B$ which is misleading. I choose not to go that way because I want to be honest with you.


The bottom line is, one needs to handle the six directional forces to be in a balance be it in static or dynamic state. and the general so called Sinking/rooting concept doesnt work to model the reality and create problem. so, dont go that way.

In WCK, in SLT we are suppose to master the small details. So as soon as we can handle the six directional force vectors, it doesnt matter what is other's baijong or kiu sau or posture or sinking..... Peng jing....etc all could be anylize with the six directional force vectors and handle them.

So, just learn the six directional force vectors, and master it and use the tools to solve any in coming issues. keep it simple. that is how to get to advance Kung fu. knowing the keys and master the keys.

[kung fu fighter]

Real life is about Balancing in a dynamic state, it is not about sinking because sinking is just one out of six vector force components in a 3D space.

Hendrik,
I couldn't have said it any better.
The feeling is very similar to that of one being submerged in water

[Hendrik]

Hendrik,
I couldn't have said it any better.
The feeling is very similar to that of one being submerged in water

Sure, but I am here preaching for almost a decade and have big time difficulties to get people to see very simple things.

always people will tell me, oh I have it too. oh my baijong is what you talking about.....etc

all crazy stuffs and infact from their post one knows they dont even come close to know what I am talking about.



So, if you listen to me, give up those sinking, grounding, .... concept. go six directional force, thinking you are surfing. So you cant "sink"; no way, the wave wont let you and also you dont want to drown, but you want to track the wave so that you have a dynamic balance of lift and sink, and make use of the wave's motion as needed via controlling your lift/sink/drag/trust....anything you want to call it,
so use the six directional force vectors balancing to balance yourself and move forward.

Nothing fix, for there is no such thing as the same Wave you could ride twice. That is comes accept, goes return... not block because there is no break in surfing.


stop those non sense sitting there in YJKYM and thinking the world is under your belt as soon as you sink and press forward, ya, until some one hug your waist and you got take down. then where is your press forward and sink ?

[hunt1]

Hendrik we seem to be talking past each other not to each other. You did not start you first day of wing chun with an understanding or an ability to use 6 force vectors. I highly doubt your Sifu said " Here Hendrik this is how to use and apply 6 force vectors" on day One. He did however very early in your training show you a basic stance ,how to get into this stance and gave some basic explanation of why this stance instead of your karate stance.

The use of force vectors is advanced and complicated and many high quality athletes do such things naturally with out even understanding what they are doing. Also there are many ways to skin a cat. There is art and there is practical. However all of it starts with a basic stance and a basic understanding of the use of the body, biomechanics for the more advanced.

Be it golf or baseball or boxing or football or weightlifting or wing chun there is a basic stance and that is always the starting point for the advanced methods to come.

You said that the folks in the vids did not represent your way of power generation or force handling. There fore the question how do you stand?

[Hendrik]

You did not start you first day of wing chun with an understanding or an ability to use 6 force vectors.

I highly doubt your Sifu said " Here Hendrik this is how to use and apply 6 force vectors" on day One.

He did however very early in your training show you a basic stance ,how to get into this stance and gave some basic explanation of why this stance instead of your karate stance.

You are right.



However,

How do you think I was train the first night when I become In Door student and how much is my progress that same night? just one night?

That is when I realize why do we need to waste so much time for nonsense?
Sure, the nonsense is needed because one needs to make sure the student behave properly before one give them the real thing.


and I did it here because I love WCK and I would like to give you the best and just hope that I can trust you guys to NOT use it to hurt others and for macho reason.

Why do I want to waste your time and life?

You said that the folks in the vids did not represent your way of power generation or force handling. There fore the question how do you stand?

and I reply you all in my previous post and in the youtube, I dont stand, I "levitate"

[sanjuro_ronin]

However,

How do you think I was train the first night when I become In Door student and how much is my progress that same night? just one night?

That is when I realize why do we need to waste so much time for nonsense?
Sure, the nonsense is needed because one needs to make sure the student behave properly before one give them the real thing.

That speaks volumes.

[hunt1]

Good now we are getting somewhere.

Your first day as In Door student may have started with something like , Now I so you the good stuff, the longest journey begins with the first step and then your Sifu probably started explaining and correcting your stance and body usage. You did not levitate on day one. In fact I think it took you decades to " levitate in a useful fashion. If you could have done so a decade ago your meeting with Andreas would have been different would it not?

So neither Sifu in the videos levitate and this is clear. The question still remains what are the first second and third steps to learn to "levitate" stance is shoulder width that goes without saying the knees sink forward? Knees just soft? Knees locked ? knees straight without give or bend?

There is an order to things? What is your order? We see the other sifu's order.

[duende]

The use of force vectors is advanced and complicated and many high quality athletes do such things naturally with out even understanding what they are doing. Also there are many ways to skin a cat. There is art and there is practical. However all of it starts with a basic stance and a basic understanding of the use of the body, biomechanics for the more advanced.

Now you're talking crazy!


But you know don't you, that you have to be an in-door student to learn that we live in 3-d space, and there exists combined height, width, and depth elements to the understanding of redirecting energy.

How much does one have to pay for THESE ancient Chinese secrets??

Must be lot's because from what I've seen in most vids... 2-d Huen Sau's are on sale!


Actually, I understand Hendrik being bitter about his Sihings doing his forms with Hung Gar energy.

But like you say.... there are many different ways to skin a cat. And there is MUCH more knowledge to Bai Jong and Kiu Sau, than what was presented in those vids of his..

But then again, maybe his Sihing didn't pay as much as Hendrick did, for the REAL stuff.

Heck... Maybe Yik Kam taught all his students White Crane just to throw them off from the real deal Wing Chun!

Just saying... Haha..

Sorry, but you got to laugh at this $hit once in awhile.

[Hendrik]

Your first day as In Door student may have started with something like , Now I so you the good stuff, the longest journey begins with the first step and then your Sifu probably started explaining and correcting your stance and body usage.

You did not levitate on day one.

In fact I think it took you decades to " levitate in a useful fashion.

Your speculation is certainly possible for some one else. However, that is not my experience.

Similar to those who learn how to swim instead of standing in the pool.
They are clumpsy the first day however they are swimming.
They swim better and better as training accumulate.

As for those who standing there in the pool might or might not swim, and chances are they will not be able to swim. Because they are standing.


You might surprise the different.

If you could have done so a decade ago your meeting with Andreas would have been different would it not?

it is in appropriate to bring Andreas up while we are having a technical discussion; I hope you understand that.

What happen between Andreas and me is none of anyone's business.

But since you bring it up, I put it straight here once for all on record.


1,
I am Chinese Martial artists and the moduk my late sifu taught me is:

Yee Hei means do anything so that your friend is in a good position of encouragement while he is teaching.

It is about supporting a friend's seminal with fun and laughter. it is nothing to do with win or lost. there is no point to compete with friend.

any serious response in action while your friend is teaching a school or seminal in his terretory is consider a challenge.

and that will have to settle with formal kong sau. All friend will avoid to get into those type of trouble at all cost.





Since you brought this up, I am more then welcome for you to:

1, Ask Robert who is there and witness the whole thing, see if I put up any defense?
2, Ask Andreas himself directly why does he said " Hendrik why do you open yourself up? "

Go check it out and get it straight.




2,
After that seminal, a certain group due to their own agenda starts to use ANY information to stir things up with Andreas, Robert, and me.

and, there is an article Written about How Robert propose to not listen and dont respect the older generation.

In fact, before Andreas left after the seminal; Andreas, Robert, and myself were in airport of LA, it is Andreas who brought up the subject of older generation issue, Robert is just listening.

Robert at that time ask me what is this B$ article about, I told him, make believe you are Wong Fei-Hung, will you response to this type of nonsense accusation? It doesnt matter, that got nothing to do with you isnt it.


For those who mis-understood Robert due to that article, this is the time to clear Robert up. It got nothing to do with Robert, it is a make up with an agenda.




3, finally, to answer your question on "would have been different would it not?"

It doesnt matter if it is Robert , Andreas, or any of my other martial art friends; disregards of what is the capability or level of my kung fu,
the out come will have no different -- I support my friend in public. Be it I am playing a clown.

I was taught kung fu is not for showing off in the friend's expense. kung fu is also not for ego boosting. and there is no incentive to show off one's kungfu unless one want to use it


Saying the above, you might not living with the same value or code I have, that is fine with me.

We need to get back to technical topic instead of this side track.

The question still remains what are the first second and third steps to learn to "levitate"

stance is shoulder width that goes without saying
the knees sink forward? Knees just soft? Knees locked ? knees straight without give or bend?

Your thinking pattern lead you to these questions. and that is perfectly normal. because you are in a different paradigm.


There are examples and details orientated type of teaching;
and there are principle or Sum Fatt (heart method) orientated teaching.

those who understand the six directional force vectors will not has to ask these question of knees....etc. because they dont think like you do, They are principle orientated based.
And thus they dont train like you either.

There is an order to things? What is your order? We see the other sifu's order.

EVeryone choose their own path. if you like this way, go a head.

My path is Zen, and NOw is not present, future, or past. Time is non linear. Flow never show up twice.

I expect no one to take what I share with blind faith. and also time will tell if what I share is in fact proper.