Originally Posted by
t_niehoff
As I have repeatedly said, what Bayer does is just one aspect (a limited tactic) but he's mistakenly taken it for the whole enchilada. All you have to do is look at Lam or Wan and contrast that with Bayer to see that he only got part of WSL's curriculum. And a small part.
And if you contrast that to what other, older legit branches of WCK teach, you see they also have a great deal more than Bayer.
The reality is that when you get inside you can't only punch (or tan/jum and punch) -- that you NEED to control the opponent or you will be run over (or at the very least get into trading punches). If you were realistically sparring you'd know that. If Bayer did any realistic sparring, he'd know that. And this is why what you guys are doing is fantasy fu: you're not DOING it (in realistic sparring) but have an "idea", a fantasy of how you believe things will work. And that's why Bayer puts up all kinds of videos but none show any sparring.
Moreover, just by looking at the videos he has put up, I can see that he has no body structure, uses only localized muscle, has no control over his opponent, his punch is weak and doesn't break his opponent's structure, etc. IOWs, it is an example of fast-hand, weak, low-level WCK.
Says the guy who has his head stuck up Bayer's ass and can't see beyond it.
Yes, he is. Why don't you ask him how much time he's spent training his WCK (ie, sparring) against boxers, MT or MMA fighters? Yup, none. So he has -- like you -- learned the curriculum (forms, drills, etc.) but not put in any work trying to make it functional. And so, he is a beginner with no real skill, and so no real understanding.
WCK is a fighting method, and if you don't fight (ride the bike), you have no skill or understanding about it (riding the bike).
Why don't you and he spar with some white-belt level MMA fighters and see how "very good" either of you are?
Sure, sure.
Chi sao is an unrealistic EXERCISE. It's unrealistic because you can do -- and get away with -- all kinds of nonsense. Hence the kuit: Chi sao Mo Lien Fa Sik – Don’t practice flowery techniques in chi sao practice. It's just a teaching/learning platform (so you can practice the contact tools of WCK). It's not for skill comparison.
There are two HUGE problems with unrealistic practice (whether chi sao or unrealistic sparring). First, it doesn't develop - or show - realistic skill (realistic skill only comes from realistic practice). Second, and related to the first, is that it doesn't develop realistic understanding of either fighting or WCK. Understanding comes only from realistic skill.
The curriculum of WCK comes from our ancestors, and that curriculum includes the faat mun, the forms, the dummy, the weapons, the kuit, etc. Traditionally, the method is to control while striking the opponent. The curriculum provides the things we need to do that. And that is the method they left us. Some people in WCK still retain that method, and others, like Bayer, seem to have never learned it.