Should I sue temple kung fu?

[Fu-Pow]

Yeah, it might be a good idea to consult a lawyer. But I personally don't think you have much of case. How are gonna prove that Simon didn't study with a Shaolin monk at some point? Now, as someone mentioned you might have more of case if it was a class action suit.

All I'm saying is that this is going to take a lot of time, money and sweat on your part. Is is worth 4000 dollars, that's the real question? Consulting an attorney is a first step. Unfortunately, in the U.S., if you want a good attorney, that consultation is gonna cost you. You might be able to find an attorney that will take the case on contingency, but they usually only do this if it is a strong case.

Firepalm-

The car analogy is full of holes. A car is a tangible object and there are a lot of laws written about cars. Martial arts training is an intangible thing and very subjective. If you don't believe me look at the history of MA's. It's a nightmare. No one can even define Shaolin for Christ's sake.


Peace

And I hope whatever you choose it works out for the best.

[firepalm]

Simon has already been to court in Canada once over this. Someone had previously posted the court transcripts on this forum, in which he states that he did not in fact study at the Shaolin temple with any monks and had never been to China. The evidence is a matter of court record.

I fully agree that Shaolin is a hard thing to define but that is not my point. Nor is MA history, it's a simple matter of a product sold under false pretenses, see the following;

Simon, as KFguy said, sold him a very costly membership on the story of Simon being the only westerner to study in Shaolin with the monks. Simon has pushed that propaganda on many unknowing customers. This is where KFguys case lies; Simon sold him a product - lessons from a Master that learned AT Shaolin from monks (high performance turbo whatever), when in fact Simon does not possess those credentials. Again as a matter of court record Simon has never been to the Shaolin temple nor learned from any Shaolin monks.

$4000 vs a nominal consultation fee (if any) is certainly worth it.

[KungFuGuy!]

I just realized something. The propaganda of simon being trained with the monks isn't documented anywhere, it's something the instructors tell you. Considering my case would mostly be based on this, there's no proof of any claims of him training there, it was just word of mouth from instructors. I don't know any student who would testify against their beloved temple kung fu, so getting witnesses to back me up would be hard. I've only told one person what I found out, and he chose not to believe me. There is this code of conduct in the change room that have a couple of rediculous rules. First of all, they don't allow you to cross train anywhere while at temple kung fu. Secondly, and this is the kicker; "Temple Kung Fu has a great reputation in this country, so naturally we will attract the attention of jealous schools, who send students in to sabotage temple kung fu, and say slanderous and untrue things about this school and it's founder. It is your job as a kung fu club member to find these infiltrators and report them to an instructor". Due to that 2nd rule, I thought I'd be kicked out the next day for confiding in that other student "Luckily" he didn't report me.
I did sign a waiver, and probably a release, so I'm sure that'll come back to bite me in the @ss.
I don't think I have a case here. JFspringer is a lawyer, maybe he can give me his advice.

[Fu-Pow]

Simon has already been to court in Canada once over this. Someone had previously posted the court transcripts on this forum, in which he states that he did not in fact study at the Shaolin temple with any monks and had never been to China.

That's a good point. He may be able to use that in court. That would definitely make his case stronger. Perhaps consulting a attorney would be a good idea.

[firepalm]

Waiver & releases are usually stating that you understand there is an inheritent risk in the activity and that you will not hold the instructors or company responsible for any injury you might sustain. Not that they can con you. Don't be a 'patsy'.

Cons & frauds like to stay out of court, just letting em know you're pursuing this through legal channels you might have a chance of getting your money back (at least in part).

Listen KFguy while I've got your attention might you be interested in buying a bridge?

Just funning ya!

[firepalm]

If said instructor that told you the line is willing to lie in court you might not have a case, in which case get a buddy to go into Simon's with a hidden recorder acting as a potential sign up. Record the pitch and then you have your evidence.

I just really hate Simon's they are so full of sh*t!

[firepalm]

Triads,
Hire some from Toronto to collect on the monies. I was in an office years ago in Hong Kong, the owner of the company had an outstanding debt to another businessman, who hired a Triad collection agency. Nothing more intimidating then being in an office when a dozen very unfriendly nasty looking Asian guys walk in demanding money or they will start taking apart the office.

Second thought just stick to conventional within the law approach. KFguy, given any thought to that bridge?

[KungFuGuy!]

Hey, why don't I just hire the mafia instead. Better get, a biker gang. The hell's angels were in the neighborhood recently, maybe I'll look them up
As for that bridge, there is an overly large puddle in my backyard, but I don't think it's bridge-worthy. I'll have to pass ^^

[grogan]

"His Holiness the Dalai Seng Shih" when someone calls himself this it's time to ask yourself in a years time will I be inside a compound waiting for the ATF to come knocking? While his Holiness is off to Brazil on his 40 ft yacht!

[KungFuGuy!]

Hmm, that's the 2nd person who said I was there for a year. I was only there 6 months, where did you guys get a year from?

[joedoe]

Holy fu(king sh!t - $4K in 6 months? Man, I would be really pi55ed off. Sue their ar5es, destroy their property, whatever. $4K in 6 months is criminal.

[KungFuGuy!]

Well it did cover 3 years but still, I agree that it is an outrageous amount of money to pay up front like that.

[Majic Sam]

I seriously despise Rev. Simon and his faygot cult cronies.They will dupe unsuspecting students in a second.You messed up,you admit it.Still,pursue them to all four corners of the globe until you feel the crush of their skulls beneath your feet,hear the lamentations of their wenches(that is ,if they aren't a "men's club only"),and get back the loot!It's worth a try.

ALL of his cattle are complete Mc Kwoon wankers,and I'm not suprised to hear about the locker romo paranoia.Sound like a bunch of speed freaks.Shut up!Drink the Kool-Aid!Fokin' disgusting,man!

[Serpent]

Get someone unknown to them in there with a hidden camera and mic. Get the whole sell thing for a prospective new student. Then get that student to go along to a few classes, get all the change room stuff and everything you can on tape. Then go public with the whole story and discredit the sh it out of him. You must have those current affairs progrmas over there right? Like The Cook Report in the UK, A Current Affair in Australia, etc. Get as public as you can, bring him into the public eye as a conman, fraudulent baastard.

And, just to be safe, on the last day of infiltration, dump a couple of firebombs on your way out - that's for personal revenge!

[relaxed]

Man, for a MA forum I can't believe the stuff Im reading regarding replies and solutions!

Firebombing? Attacking whoever? Triads(heeeee)?

You guys are a little to short triggered to have been training in most any art for any reasonable amount of time. Kung Fu guy, you payed 4K for three years or so? Thats not that horrible for anyone in a decent school - that is one that isn't a part-time community centre run org.

If you're not happy try the BBB like some of these smarter guys suggest, or even legal aid, but don't take it to the street, thats just B..Sh..!!! The only reason to use your art is in defense. Make sure your problems are with the school and not just some yokel instructor or mis-informed student or friend.

Good Luck.

Peace