Which of these cheapens the reputation of martial arts more?

[Lebaufist]

I think people who cannot apply the art effectively in combat yet going around saying they know it or even worse, teaching it, would be the worst culprit. Followed at a close second by the $500 Bai Ci certificates and fake forms being taught to people thought not to matter....

If and only If the said student can't fight.

Combat is a tricky word. Which combat? where? War? The pub? context is everything.

[TenTigers]

I was invited to join some sort of Martial Arts organization, world council of sokeship, or something like that.
Anyway, after seeing the lineup of 10th dans, Grandmasters, Supreme Masters, etc...
I declined.
Do a search....
that's all I'm sayin..

[Iron_Eagle_76]

This is deep, though people of the very culture do it as well....

True, but that does not make any less revolting. Peoples of a dubious nature will always find a way to rip off or take advantage of an unsuspecting person, even if it means shi***ting on their own people. Americans, Brits, Russians, ect are no different in that regard.

Combat is a tricky word. Which combat? where? War? The pub? context is everything

.

Context is everything, but at it's core all martial arts should teach hand to hand combat unless it is strictly a weapons art such as fencing. Often times people read into things and make them more than what they are.

[TenTigers]

In the 70's, when everybody was Kung-Fu fightin', Guys with a kenpo backround, who had good kicks from a few years in TKD, donned black pajamas, made their shuto blocks into Tiger Claws, waved their arms up and down like Bruce Lee, did a cartwheel and a split and declared themselves as Shaolin Masters. (Northern if they had good kicks, Southern if they didn't.) They made up forms from watching Shaw Bros. movies, and took first place in tournaments-because the Karate judges had no more idea what Kung-Fu looked like, than the circus clowns performing this drek.
Well, now there are schools that are second or third generation form these Masters.
These new "Sifus," are dedicated to their art, train their students hard, and really think that what they are doing is Kung-Fu. Why wouldn't they? They are already three generations in. (their Grandmasters learned from an old Chinaman* in the park, or take-out, or when stationed in the Orient)






*intentional ignorance

[Shaolin]

Everyone has a solid argument and obvious passion against these individuals who "cheapen the martial arts." And it's very easy for all of us to fall trap to getting angry and slander these individuals in a martial arts forum.

So how in your opinions are you combating this?

[Lucas]

Never compromise your integrity.

[TenTigers]

So how in your opinions are you combating this?

By maintaining my integrity, teaching my art the best I possibly can, turning out good, strong students, and ****ing and moaning on the forum.

[Punch.HeadButt]

Everyone has a solid argument and obvious passion against these individuals who "cheapen the martial arts." And it's very easy for all of us to fall trap to getting angry and slander these individuals in a martial arts forum.

So how in your opinions are you combating this?

I fall back on that old classic "be the change you want to see in the world." I don't get involved in politics (though that's easy to do when you're not in the mix, even when I was teaching it was easy for me to side-step the talking...big props to Gene and those like him who can navigate the poop and come out clean(ish) ;-)

I don't butt into other people's training, I don't argue style vs. style or tma vs. mma (anymore, I admit to falling in that trap before), I don't give my opinions on what other people are doing unless they ask for them (assuming what they're doing is not a direct assault on something important to me, of course), I make a conscious effort to be respectful to other practitioners (and people in general) regardless of what, where, or how long they practice or what their opinions are...

Basically, I don't like ****heads, so I try not to be another ****head to add to the pile

I do put a lot of effort into my training, I do try to improve, I do try to learn from other people and their experiences, I do try and effectively teach what students I have, I do try and further my understanding of whatever the hell I'm doing....and I do my best to not disrupt other people who are doing the same.

You get the idea. Sure, I still falter at all this from time to time, but I'm still learning. I hope.

[Lucas]

this was tough for me to make a decision with the available options. at first i wanted to say all, as i do think all of them can be detrimental...yet when I started thinking about it further i came to a conclusion about this.

personally i think misrepresentation is the biggest harm. stage tricks, screaming little kids with plastic staves, sparring based around style restrictions are all forms of expression. which are ok, for what they are specifically; outlets. its when these individuals mis represent WHAT they are doing and to WHAT aims they are doing it is when these things become an issue. so these aspects can definately be bad, but as long as people are open and honest its not really a big deal. no worse for martial arts than movies are.

let people do their parlour tricks and their competitions. nothing wrong with that at all. as long as they are honest with what they do, its not an issue.

the too deadly guys are in a constant state of misrepresentation however. which is an issue for all involved. the teacher, the students, the prospects are all being fed mis information about what is actually going on.

[Faruq]

Everyone has a solid argument and obvious passion against these individuals who "cheapen the martial arts." And it's very easy for all of us to fall trap to getting angry and slander these individuals in a martial arts forum.

So how in your opinions are you combating this?

By never claiming to know martial arts. And if caught doing anything resembling martial arts immediately clarifying "No! I would have to have special training equipment (roller bar, claw bag, wall bag or palm bag), sparring partners, and regular sparring with the contact and speed boxers use. I definately haven't accomplished any of that. I can't do diddly".

Now I know this clashes with what a lot of people here consider necessary for mastery, but I'm probably the least skilled and knowledgeable here so take what I tell people with a grain of salt. That's just me.

And in response to:

Context is everything, but at it's core all martial arts should teach hand to hand combat unless it is strictly a weapons art such as fencing. Often times people read into things and make them more than what they are.

I'd have to say just being able to skillfully defend oneself on the street or pub would be enough in my opinion. I mean for a kung fu master to be as competent as an MMA guy without using MMA. I mean like the guys at http://www.pakmei.net/articles/articlelist.asp?ID=2 are.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Everyone has a solid argument and obvious passion against these individuals who "cheapen the martial arts." And it's very easy for all of us to fall trap to getting angry and slander these individuals in a martial arts forum.

So how in your opinions are you combating this?

When someone comes to me to learn to fight, I will teach them under NO PRETENSE of anything else than teaching how to fight.
If however someone comes to me to learn a specific style of kung fu that I have experience in such as Hung Kuen of SPM, I will explain that I am NOT certified to teach them, that I am NOT a lineage holder and that if they want a "legit and certified Sifu" I can find them one.

[mickey]

Greetings,

Going beyond the acts themselves, it is the money wh0res that cheapen the martial arts.

You should have listed bogus brick breaking.



mickey

[uki]

You should have listed bogus brick breaking.

as a mason, i can assure you i can make a seemingly solid heavy slab of concrete - with the recipe tweeked - that my 2 year old could headbutt apart... for the true masters i make them with rebar inside.

[Lebaufist]

(Northern if they had good kicks, Southern if they didn't.) .......

This made me chuckle.

[Lebaufist]

So how in your opinions are you combating this?

simple, a block, is a block, is a block. A punch. etc etc. put together, deal with whats coming. next.

The right tool for the right job. Its not rocket science.

yadda, yadda, yadda..............