What is qi?

[taai gihk yahn]

You know they even taught that when I was in medical school.

and where, pray tell, did u attend medical school? and did u graduate? and what is ur specialty?

[Scott R. Brown]

except, of course, for the ones who took it literally, ingested cinnabar, and subsequently "became one with the Tao" in a rather decided manner...

Well I guess they got what they deserved then.

Practice the forms well- the Qi will take care of itself.

Hmmmm.... I think that is what I have been saying!

This thread demonstrates that fruitcakery also transcends culture and geography, including astral geography for those so inclined.

Fruitcakes have a place in the the Taoverse too!

This is like saying God exists regardless of a coherent physical theory explaining the subjective experience of God.

Your belief in qi is therefore a faith, not a rational position in accordance with reality and supported by evidence. It is unfalsifiable and doesn't amount to an argument any rational person should take any notice of.

All experience of reality is determined by subjectivity. Life is nothing but a subjective interpretation of phenomena. There really is no such thing as objectivity. Objectivity is founded upon subjectivity.

[nasmedicine]

you are wrong


it's fine to increase intra-abdominal pressure for bracing while lifting - it's called a vasalva maneuver - u do it every time to have a bowel movement, there's nothing wrong with it, it's part of normal physiology - it's a common misconception amongst qigong people that this is harmful, even though it's actually done during certain types of qigong; if u have ever lifted, u realize very quickly how it helps - u r not straining anything, it actually helps stabilize ur core

hernias and aneurysms are pathological conditions that occur on their own, doing a valsalva doesn't create them; it may exacerbate them, but that's once they r already there

Sorry but that is simply not true. Valvalsa should never be done when when lifting heavy weight period. The amount of the intrabdomal pressure you have during a bowel movement is not the same as when you're lifting heavy weights! My god. What you end up doing is increasing not only the intrabdomal pressure but you also increase intracranial pressure and the pressure within all of the other organs. No physician in there right mind would recommend this unless the person was extremely fit and even then still not a good idea. For the record and anybody reading this I would advice please do not hold your breath, you'll hurt yourself. If you don't get hurt you eventually will.

Lol, Your suppose to physical therapist yet you don't know this basic physiology? You don't even take into consideration the patients risk factors? You just assume everyone is a perfect specimen? I may not be an authority on chi cultivation but I definitely not sit back and let you give bad health advice. I wonder how many referrals you get from physicians...

[nasmedicine]

and where, pray tell, did u attend medical school? and did u graduate? and what is ur specialty?

LOL you are not serious right? Are going to interview me for some type of fellowship? Unless you're offering me a job there is no reason for me to give you my resume especially on this forum? Seriously you are ridiculous.

[xinyidizi]

see, apparently you missed the part where you were told what it really means:

Originally Posted by xinyidizi
I meant what I said in my example. "each person experiences reality differently according to their foundational beliefs about life/reality"



how could you have missed something this obvious (well, evidently so did I...)

You are clearly dishonest in quoting the complete sentences from my post. I suspected that you were such a person. Now I suspect that most probably you were also dishonest about your in depth training in qigong.
There is no shame in failing. It might be because of lack of discipline, lack of talent or not having access to genuine instructors but whatever the reason is I suggest that you stay with what you know in terms of scientific explanations and don't get yourself involved in things like qi which you were not trained enough to know.

@guy b.:

Um, what to say to this?

The fact that deaf people can't hear noise does not mean noise does not exist.

Exactly. By the same logic if you were not trained to open your heavenly eye and see qi doesn't mean that qi doesn't exist.
In Buddhism 5 different kinds of eyes are mentioned and the second type is your 天眼(heavenly eye). If you read chinese search for 开天眼. You can also search for 看光法 which I think is the daoist term and consists of 内光(internal light) and 外光(external light) which refer to internal and external qi. There are also books on seeing aura in English that might be helpful.

[Happy Tiger]

A good, up to date paper on the subject
http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&...w38ftssHN5lyfg

[taai gihk yahn]

Sorry but that is simply not true. Valvalsa should never be done when when lifting heavy weight period. The amount of the intrabdomal pressure you have during a bowel movement is not the same as when you're lifting heavy weights! My god. What you end up doing is increasing not only the intrabdomal pressure but you also increase intracranial pressure and the pressure within all of the other organs. No physician in there right mind would recommend this unless the person was extremely fit and even then still not a good idea. For the record and anybody reading this I would advice please do not hold your breath, you'll hurt yourself. If you don't get hurt you eventually will.

have u ever actually studied Olympic weight lifting technique?
http://www.catalystathletics.com/art...p?articleID=37
while there are potential adverse effects, but also means of mitigating them;
the key point as the article points out is using the breath to stabilize;
I have done this, it's totally fine - of course, I was not lifting anywhere near the level of the top guys, but in terms of the technique itself, there was no sense of straining - I have felt more from doing something like "Closing the Iron Gate" type of qigong

[taai gihk yahn]

LOL you are not serious right? Are going to interview me for some type of fellowship? Unless you're offering me a job there is no reason for me to give you my resume especially on this forum? Seriously you are ridiculous.

no; u say that u went to Medical School, attempting to establish yourself as an authority of some type; u volunteered the information; since you brought it up, I am asking a f/u question; if any one is behaving ridiculously, it's you;

why is it such a big deal to relay this? for example, I am a PT w a Master's Degree from Columbia University; there; that wasn't hard, was it?

[Scott R. Brown]

Sorry but that is simply not true. Valvalsa should never be done when when lifting heavy weight period. The amount of the intrabdomal pressure you have during a bowel movement is not the same as when you're lifting heavy weights! My god. What you end up doing is increasing not only the intrabdomal pressure but you also increase intracranial pressure and the pressure within all of the other organs. No physician in there right mind would recommend this unless the person was extremely fit and even then still not a good idea. For the record and anybody reading this I would advice please do not hold your breath, you'll hurt yourself. If you don't get hurt you eventually will.

Your suppose to physical therapist yet you don't know this basic physiology? You don't even take into consideration the patients risk factors? You just assume everyone I a perfect specimen? I may not be an authority on chi cultivation but I definitely sit back and let you give bad health advice.

You don't know what you are talking about. Every weight lifter hold his breath for part of his lift and then slowly exhales as the lift progresses. There are no rampant aneurysms or hernias amongst this group.

You are a fine example of a Doctor Who is full of himself..... If you are a Doctor.

[nasmedicine]

have u ever actually studied Olympic weight lifting technique?
http://www.catalystathletics.com/art...p?articleID=37
while there are potential adverse effects, but also means of mitigating them;
the key point as the article points out is using the breath to stabilize;
I have done this, it's totally fine - of course, I was not lifting anywhere near the level of the top guys, but in terms of the technique itself, there was no sense of straining - I have felt more from doing something like "Closing the Iron Gate" type of qigong

No but I have studied orthopedics. It may be fine for you, it may be fine for an olympic athlete. But unless you're trying to defecate, or ascultate or heart murmurs, it is NOT fine for the general public.

[taai gihk yahn]

You are clearly dishonest in quoting the complete sentences from my post.

yeah, and also I provided the links back to your original post, meaning that if someone wants to read the post in its entirety, they r perfectly capable of doing so; so how is that being dishonest?

I suspected that you were such a person. Now I suspect that most probably you were also dishonest about your in depth training in qigong.

wow, you will just try to come up with any sort of rationalization to support your perspective; you can't possibly entertain the slightest possibility that I am correct; you must be either massively insecure or...no, I guess that's all there is;

There is no shame in failing. It might be because of lack of discipline, lack of talent or not having access to genuine instructors but whatever the reason is I suggest that you stay with what you know in terms of scientific explanations and don't get yourself involved in things like qi which you were not trained enough to know.

lol; I guess you have succeeded in ur qigong training, since it's resulted in ur becoming an arrogant bastid like most qigong "experts";
trust me, u have NO idea about my training - if u did, it wud make ur brain short circuit, because it wudn't jive w ur limited world view of how u think that things shud b

[Scott R. Brown]

No but I have studied orthopedics. It may be fine for you, it may be fine for an olympic athlete. But unless you're trying to defecate, or ascultate or heart murmurs, it is NOT fine for the general public.

Most athletic activities are not for the general public! This is a martial arts forum where participants may be presumed to be somewhat fit!

[nasmedicine]

You don't know what you are talking about. Every weight lifter hold his breath for part of his lift and then slowly exhales as the lift progresses. There are no rampant aneurysms or hernias amongst this group.

You are a fine example of a Doctor Who is full of himself..... If you are a Doctor.

LOL, Of course, of course you would know right? Tell this to all the average (not a "weight lifter") people who ruptures these hidden aneurysms (most people don't know they have them until they do rupture) or those who come to the ER for inguinal hernias/abdominal hernias. These people are athletes nor are screened by physicians before injuring themselves. Yes I am a horrible doctor. ;-)

[nasmedicine]

Most athletic activities are not for the general public! This is a martial arts forum where participants may be presumed to be somewhat fit!

Presume away my friend. It's really working for you. :-)

[taai gihk yahn]

No but I have studied orthopedics.

r u an orthopedist?
from ur defensiveness, I have the feeling that u either a) never completed medical school; b) did so outside of the states and never got ur ECFMG certification; c) u are a DO practicing family medicine; d) a PM&R doc who really doesn't do much of anything at all
I'm also surprised that u haven't trashed me for being "only" a PT - usually by now that's where the conversation goes w docs when I have the audacity to not be shocked into abject silence when they post here...

It may be fine for you, it may be fine for an olympic athlete. But unless you're trying to defecate, or ascultate or heart murmurs, it is NOT fine for the general public.

u r wrong; it's perfectly fine; heck, they teach this at cross fit classes all the time - I have seen middle age Long Island housewives do this and be just fine; really, u r embarrassing urself, and shud just stop now