Sparring Frequency - Live Rounds

[Frost]

I think that you have accurately understand what I am communicating.

Edit: It's why I am a little bit suspicious of OPs like the one here. Obviously, I am generalizing a bit, but I have seen these types of comments enough to rightly and fairly have suspicion.

Ok from my perspective I agree somewhat with you (don’t fall over anyone) because I have heard this said before by grapplers and MMA guys.
But I will say the following: Anyone who has grappled for longer than a few years will understand the value of light rolling, positional drilling and the fact that you can’t spar heavy all the time even in grappling, its detrimental to your game development and leads to way to many injuries
likewise anyone with both grappling and MMA or striking experience understands that rolling is not the same as hard stand up sparring, as I have stated before on this thread this is my belief. I equate rolling with light to medium stand up sparring: What I consider light stand up sparring is technical work with contact that is enough to make you keep your hands up and ensure you are throwing correct shots but which wont stop you from trying new things or working on weak areas (usually done with MMA gloves for me), medium sparring I consider would be you are going hard enough to keep things honest (you might get a bloody nose black eye etc but that’s it) but where you won’t receive any serious injuries or are in real fear of being knocked out.
The majority of my sparring is light to medium these days, ive probably at the most 10 rounds if that this year of hard sparring (seen stars and been on the ground winded type sparring) mostly in kung fu and not MMA lol and about 120-150 light and medium rouinds with gloves (this includes both MMA and Thai/boxing type sparring, also included isolated sparring against a cage wall, or ground and pound rounds) . If I include kung fu sparring (where we don’t wear gloves headshots are pulled but hard body shots and leg shots are allowed as is grappling and throwing) that’s probably another 100 hours,
This I know is nothing much but im just a hobbyist these days having fun
I probably also have over 300 rounds of grappling under my belts as well, guess which I prefer to do lol

[HumbleWCGuy]

I would also add that if someone has legitimately put in time with heavy upright sparring, their chin will start to go. Then comes the recognition, that you just can't do is like you used to. Light sparring becomes more of a reality because you don't have much left in the tank.

[HumbleWCGuy]

Ok from my perspective I agree somewhat with you (don’t fall over anyone) because I have heard this said before by grapplers and MMA guys.
But I will say the following: Anyone who has grappled for longer than a few years will understand the value of light rolling, positional drilling and the fact that you can’t spar heavy all the time even in grappling, its detrimental to your game development and leads to way to many injuries
likewise anyone with both grappling and MMA or striking experience understands that rolling is not the same as hard stand up sparring, as I have stated before on this thread this is my belief. I equate rolling with light to medium stand up sparring: What I consider light stand up sparring is technical work with contact that is enough to make you keep your hands up and ensure you are throwing correct shots but which wont stop you from trying new things or working on weak areas (usually done with MMA gloves for me), medium sparring I consider would be you are going hard enough to keep things honest (you might get a bloody nose black eye etc but that’s it) but where you won’t receive any serious injuries or are in real fear of being knocked out.
The majority of my sparring is light to medium these days, ive probably at the most 10 rounds if that this year of hard sparring (seen stars and been on the ground winded type sparring) mostly in kung fu and not MMA lol and about 120-150 light and medium rouinds with gloves (this includes both MMA and Thai/boxing type sparring, also included isolated sparring against a cage wall, or ground and pound rounds) . If I include kung fu sparring (where we don’t wear gloves headshots are pulled but hard body shots and leg shots are allowed as is grappling and throwing) that’s probably another 100 hours,
This I know is nothing much but im just a hobbyist these days having fun
I probably also have over 300 rounds of grappling under my belts as well, guess which I prefer to do lol

I am pretty much of the opinion that grapplers who haven't committed to a few years of hard striking probably aren't going to come to the correct conclusions about striking training whether they have an evolved view of grappling or not.

I think that is probably where I stand with the rolling. It is probably more like light or medium upright. However, those who are basically grapplers only seem to find that hard to swallow. It is probably a combination of the fact that they are buying intra-school propaganda and trying to rationalize why they deserve the title of "fighter."

[Wayfaring]

So you are saying then grapplers state because they train hard all the time, they have more real skill than stand up fighters because stand up by its nature can’t be trained at 90- 100% all the time simply because of the nature of the injuries received.

I don't know any grapplers that have this view. Roger Gracie doesn't. Robert Drysdale doesn't. I don't.

And grapplers are incorrectly equating hard rolling with hard stand up sparring because the dangers are nowhere near the same? And that whilst grapplers in your experience equate light sparring with not being useful training, the reality is for stand up fighters the majority of their training will be light sparring simply because of the nature of the stand up arts and the facts of life getting in the way?

Would this be fair to say?

Listen, all I was doing on this thread is presenting a basic general inquiry about ANY form of sparring. I guess reading my OP, I did exclude chi sau. IMO it's not free movement but more static. If someone does full free range movement chi sau then OK.

Light sparring is very useful, both in striking training and grappling. I wasn't excluding those sessions in my poll. In fact, if I had to gauge my MMA AND grappling sparring I would say in each, 1-2 hard sessions per week, with maybe 3-5 matches in a session, are as much as athletes can take for wear and tear on the body. Many of the rest of the sparring sessions are going to be lighter. In those lighter sessions you build repetition, technique, try and go for an approximation of the speed, and have less power. These concepts hold true for BOTH grappling and striking sparring.

[Wayfaring]

I am pretty much of the opinion that grapplers who haven't committed to a few years of hard striking probably aren't going to come to the correct conclusions about striking training whether they have an evolved view of grappling or not.

I'm pretty much of the opinion that those who haven't committed a few years of grappling training should probably keep their yap shut about it, as they won't know what they are talking about.

I think that is probably where I stand with the rolling. It is probably more like light or medium upright. However, those who are basically grapplers only seem to find that hard to swallow. It is probably a combination of the fact that they are buying intra-school propaganda and trying to rationalize why they deserve the title of "fighter."

So let me get this straight. Your opinion on a form of training that you don't perform is that it's easier than the one you do perform. Wow. That's a great way to build delusion. My opinion on training that I don't perform is "I don't know".

My opinion on grappling and striking training is it's straight across the board. Hard = hard, medium = medium, light = light. You can get more banged up in hard sparring sessions, especially before you learn to move correctly. You can get injured in hard grappling sessions. Either presents danger.

[Wayfaring]

But I will say the following: Anyone who has grappled for longer than a few years will understand the value of light rolling, positional drilling and the fact that you can’t spar heavy all the time even in grappling, its detrimental to your game development and leads to way to many injuries.

Agreed.

likewise anyone with both grappling and MMA or striking experience understands that rolling is not the same as hard stand up sparring, as I have stated before on this thread this is my belief. I equate rolling with light to medium stand up sparring:

I consider an average class roll and an average MMA class sparring session equivalent. So do my MMA teammates. An average roll in my experience scales between light and medium. However, both can escalate to hard easily. All it takes is one guy landing a little to hard of a punch, then retaliation, or one guy turning up the steam a bit in grappling leading to a scramble and a hard takedown or submission. The experienced guys try to limit that kind of escalation to keep things in control (except for designated training sessions).

What I consider light stand up sparring is technical work with contact that is enough to make you keep your hands up and ensure you are throwing correct shots but which wont stop you from trying new things or working on weak areas (usually done with MMA gloves for me), medium sparring I consider would be you are going hard enough to keep things honest (you might get a bloody nose black eye etc but that’s it) but where you won’t receive any serious injuries or are in real fear of being knocked out.

I can live with those definitions. One exception is I've seen a dozen or so knockouts in medium sparring with someone getting clipped right on the button.

The majority of my sparring is light to medium these days, ive probably at the most 10 rounds if that this year of hard sparring (seen stars and been on the ground winded type sparring) mostly in kung fu and not MMA lol and about 120-150 light and medium rouinds with gloves (this includes both MMA and Thai/boxing type sparring, also included isolated sparring against a cage wall, or ground and pound rounds) . If I include kung fu sparring (where we don’t wear gloves headshots are pulled but hard body shots and leg shots are allowed as is grappling and throwing) that’s probably another 100 hours,
This I know is nothing much but im just a hobbyist these days having fun
I probably also have over 300 rounds of grappling under my belts as well, guess which I prefer to do lol

Cool. Add them all up and you're in the poll.

[Wayfaring]

I would also add that if someone has legitimately put in time with heavy upright sparring, their chin will start to go. Then comes the recognition, that you just can't do is like you used to. Light sparring becomes more of a reality because you don't have much left in the tank.

That recognition for me drove me to the conclusion that it wasn't a good idea to keep standing in the same spot with my head in a static position where my opponent can punch me in my jaw.

This is why some boxers have long-term brain damage and others do not.

[Wayfaring]

I am saying that grapplers usually don't know what they are talking about when it comes to training upright correctly which is why a lot of guys turned to grappling. Either decent upright wasn't available or they chose not to take advantage of it.

Over-generalization that's mostly incorrect. A good percentage of the people I see doing well in grappling tournaments are pro and amateur MMA fighters.

The point being, grapplers will often try to overlay their grappling training as a blueprint for upright training. Sure, there should be similarities... Athletics's training is athletics's training. However, they aren't precisely the same. The concussion limits how it has to be trained.

Maybe garage grapplers and strikers. I just listen to my coaches, and depend on coaches that have real experience in what they are training, including MMA fights and grappling competitions.

Then of course, we don't like to talk about it but life is a factor in the real world. Through high school, I hard sparred a few hours per week. That's a load of sparring. Then, my good training partners moved on so my opportunities were diminished. Eventually, I started college. Because I had to start applying myself to my studies, headaches all day were not working for me so I had to limit what I was doing. Then 50 to 70 percent is what I had to do.

Sure life is a factor.

I have heard it said by grapplers, "I train hard all the time and I have more skill on the ground than a person training upright can develop." Well maybe, but in terms of upright, we all work with the same set of limitations so I am not really sure what those kinds of comments mean.

I would not make a statement like that. Skill is skill. I started training ground because I noticed holes in my overall game that were exposed. Tapes like the original "Gracies in Action" showing footage of the Gracie Challenge matches were an inspiration.

I do like that you can in general go harder on the ground without getting as banged up. However, that's just a sweat and conditioning factor. It means nothing as far as building comparative skill. It's just fun Putting them both together - striking and ground is another barrier. You have to learn to walk and chew gum at the same time.

[Wayfaring]

I think that is probably where I stand with the rolling. It is probably more like light or medium upright. However, those who are basically grapplers only seem to find that hard to swallow. It is probably a combination of the fact that they are buying intra-school propaganda and trying to rationalize why they deserve the title of "fighter."

I don't really care to "deserve the title of fighter". My titles are probably more accurately "sparring partner" and "grappler", or possibly "competitor". I wear Mickey Mouse shirts to watch the UFC out in public, not Tapout.

However, I reserve to call hard competitive grappling matches in competitions "fights", mostly for the same reason the Brazilians have a phrase for BJJ as "the best fight". Yes, I realize that technically they are not fights they are grappling matches. However, the people I will allow to call me on this are my MMA teammates and other fighters, not people who did a couple of smokers in the '90's who like to mouth off on the internet.

[HumbleWCGuy]

I don't really care to "deserve the title of fighter". My titles are probably more accurately "sparring partner" and "grappler", or possibly "competitor". I wear Mickey Mouse shirts to watch the UFC out in public, not Tapout.

There is hope for you then.

However, I reserve to call hard competitive grappling matches in competitions "fights", mostly for the same reason the Brazilians have a phrase for BJJ as "the best fight". Yes, I realize that technically they are not fights they are grappling matches. However, the people I will allow to call me on this are my MMA teammates and other fighters, not people who did a couple of smokers in the '90's who like to mouth off on the internet.

You can believe any **** fool thing that you want, but that doesn't make it so.

[HumbleWCGuy]

I would say that if a smoker is no big deal then grow some balls and compete in one.

[Wayfaring]

You can believe any **** fool thing that you want, but that doesn't make it so.

My experience gives me an opinion. When you get some experience in that area, I'll listen to your opinion. Until then, you have a malformed and uneducated opinion about that topic.

[Wayfaring]

I would say that if a smoker is no big deal then grow some balls and compete in one.

I have in the 80s. It was a big deal to me then. Not so much now. I don't know what the future holds for me w/r to amateur MMA fights, but am not ruling one out. With the training I'm doing I'm most of the way there. However, not many other middle-aged men seem to want to take MMA fights (or enter grappling tournaments for that matter). The fight would have to make sense.

Apparently most middle-aged men like to drink tea, discuss chi, theory, and transforms, and argue about lineages. Most don't like to spar. I feel it keeps your blood flowing, increases your physical conditioning, helps keep weight under control, relieves stress, and overall keeps you younger as those years creep up.

[HumbleWCGuy]

I have in the 80s. It was a big deal to me then. Not so much now. I don't know what the future holds for me w/r to amateur MMA fights, but am not ruling one out. With the training I'm doing I'm most of the way there. However, not many other middle-aged men seem to want to take MMA fights (or enter grappling tournaments for that matter). The fight would have to make sense.

Apparently most middle-aged men like to drink tea, discuss chi, theory, and transforms, and argue about lineages. Most don't like to spar. I feel it keeps your blood flowing, increases your physical conditioning, helps keep weight under control, relieves stress, and overall keeps you younger as those years creep up.

That's fair. All you want a fair match. I guess that I am not as old as you, but I don't look forward to the prospect of fighting too many twenty somethings. I may as well ram my head into a brick wall.

[HumbleWCGuy]

My experience gives me an opinion. When you get some experience in that area, I'll listen to your opinion. Until then, you have a malformed and uneducated opinion about that topic.

Denial isn't just a river in Egypt.