Do you think this is right?...............

[Asia]

JasBourne,

The point that I and others were trying to make is that how do YOU Know that the person posting IS NEAL? You DON'T! You can not be 100% sure. If you were faced with Neal in the flesh the by all means give the ******* his due. Now serious consider the medium in which these accusations are being presented.

[JasBourne]

No one can be 100% sure about someone's identity under any circumstances. Even DNA testing is not 100% foolproof. My point is that we seem pretty happy to push it all under the rug because "we can't be 100% sure", and "it was never proven in court". I don't need to step in dog poop to recognize it for what it is. I most certainly won't pretend I don't smell it when I do.

[Asia]

However, if RD or Abel were able(hehehe) to confirm that NC was not supposed to be on the internet, then they should not only contact the authorities, but it should be any moderator's responsibility to stop such contact

You hit the biggest issue there is. IF it can be proven that TWC = Neal Cameron and Neal is NOT suppose to be on the internet then by all means contact the authorities and ban him.

and would come back as a new member under another IP address, at which point ffab would not even know who it was

Another good point.

JB,

I don't need to step in dog poop to recognize it for what it is. I most certainly won't pretend I don't smell it when I do.

Er If you KNOW what something is then you don't have to "step in it" I am not happy to sweep it under the rug. The FACT is I want to pple to know that you can't prove anything in this arena therefore saying things like, "He DID this.." or "He DID that.." or "I know he DID.." is a hard thing to prove. Right now I can accuse YOU of any offense and post links to sites that post someone who has been charged with the crime. NOW YOU will have suspicion cast on you and it ISN'T TRUE. Caught what I am getting at? I have NO symphaty for anyone who violates a child, being a father of one and one on the way, I could not trust myself in dealing with a child molestor so DON'T assume I am defending anyone who IS guilty of this crime. This is to let you know with the info presented on the forums mentioned is NOT adequate in saying TWC IS Neal.

[ewallace]

Unless you are a seasoned hacker, you can easily be caught. If the forum is tracking IPs, they can find out who the service provider is, and that service provider can tell which one of their users had that ip address at that certain time. If there is a reasonable concern the ISP will most likely cancel the user's account and contact local authorities if the behavior is of an illegal nature. The ISP most likely will not give out the user's info to anyone aside from law enforcement, so we may not ever know, but they will definitely not allow that kind of crap to continue.

[SifuAbel]

Asia,

First of all read the article that jas has provided a link for. It clearly states that he is not to have unsupervised contact with children for the length of his probation. That SHOULD include the internet. There was a big bust not three weeks ago of kiddie porn rings and known sex offenders cruising the internet.

Second of all he established and admitted that he was neal some time ago on cyberkwoon. Look it up. He has not denied that he is neal and he has made many excuses for his past actions.

WAKE... UP...!!

[Asia]

ewallace,

I can change my IP in a matter of secconds!!!! I can even keep it it hidden as well. Like most pple in the work place I do much of my surfing at work. What do I do at work? I and the SA!!!! I have 6 IP pools in which I can jump to at ANYTIME. Win2K does not require a restart when changing network settings like Win9x or NT. And there is a variety of software that will either hide your IP or send out a 'false one' and most of these type of software is FREE!! (I even wrote one of them.) I do not consider myself a hacker in anyform.

[Asia]

ABEL,

REREAD AND COMPREHEND!!!


I really don't give a **** about NEAL (except for heckling him for giving excuse for not meeting my challenge) If you are so **** sure that this is guy shouldn't be around why haven't you pursued further action? Look up MY response on learning about Neal. It went something like, "Hey TWC if that is really you in the picture you got a lot of work to do before even thinking of taking me on." I am NOT a NEAL supporter! The only point I stick by is that NOONE is whoe they appear to be! I can admit to being the Lindburg baby but how can anyone prove me wrong? (other than common sense)

I am fully aware about pple cruising the internet in preying on childeren. Two weeks ago I was involved in building a case against a soldier brought up on charges of child porn and other things. My job was to RECOVER the files used to make this case. The biggest point make was PROVING that the individual involved was the one logged on and surfing the net. EVEN with his PERSONAL computer this had to be proven. Given the type of forum we are engaged in it would be a hard sell (but not impossible) to say this guy is who he is.

[SifuAbel]

Baka!

Are you calling me a cow? Better not.



I'm not saying that you are a neal supporter. I know he's done the same threatening BS job he does everywhere else. And, I know he has crossed words with you many times. The similarities might not stand up in a court of law. But I'm not a public officer making charges.

I'm a private citizen informing others that the guy, Neal or otherwise someone posing as neal, has done what he has done; so beware. If this guy isn't neal then he should banned anyway for being the ULTIMATE DISGUSTING TROLL.

The only way I see that I can "take action" is to inform people of Neal's past. Whether or not this guy is neal is almost moot now. If he is neal then he deserves the ridicule he's getting. If he isn't neal and mearly someone posing as neal he deserves it anyway for being the ULTIMATE DISGUSTING TROLL.

[Asia]

I truly understand you doing what you feel is your civic duty. I am even thankful that there are pple like you how feel this way. I just want to call to your attention that you have to make sure you KNOW the person you are accusing is the right one and on the internet that is not easily done. He could easily file a lawsuit based on YOUR accusation on the internet. (Ask MC Busman or Don Cuningham about such thinks) The problem is for him to do so he would have to reveal himself therefore I see no danger in this. If the person in question is NOT Neal then I agree that he is on disgusting troll.



(I still called you an Idiot and I don't think you are man enough to make anything out of it. If so find me on the internet and come and prove that you are not. )

Anyways is ti 1am here and I need to go to bed. Enough of this for tonight.

[SifuAbel]

Originally posted by Asia
Re: BAKA no imi wa idiot/dummy etc. (Yeah I said it! Whatcha gonna do about it?)

Ok here's one for you "No seas Come mierda" there translate that one and do something about it.


Slander can only be charged if something is said that is not true. I'm calling NEAL on this one. If this guy is posing as neal then I can't be charged with anything against an impersonator. As far as I knew this was neal and he didn't deny it. Case closed.

[red_fists]

One thing about Computers and the Internet.

And I am talking from experience here, since I used to do IT-security at one of my Companies.
All you can do is track the logged in Person to a physical terminal, but you CANNOT look outside the hardware to see who is physically sitting there.
Unless they use fingerprint verification or similar as part of the Logon procedure.

All you can see is the User and which physical terminal was used.

In one case we had a fraud at the Company, but knew that the owner of the "Logon" that the fraud was commited with was in Hospital at that time.

Took us 3 months to track the real culprit.

And yes, you can track somebody even if they hide their IP or give a false IP.
Takes time and effort but it can be done, problem is that it is not worth it unless a big stake is involved.

Just some Info.

[ffab@cyberkwoon.]

This link, an "official" CK position

I understand the concerns and worries of many ppl.
This is a tough issue when we look at it on the broader perspective, however, in the case originating this thread, I think it is a pretty simple and clear situation.

[Stacey]

How exactly will hating Neal Cameron help anything? No seriously...how do you propose that by loathing him, we will make happier families and more loving communities?

We can start by hating him, then it can affect our liver, then we can have internal problems, be quicker to lash out, cut the guy off on the freeway and continue like a stack of dominoes.

We could also love and forgive him, not cling to it, protect the children out of love for them, and encourage Neal to get help and support him in his healing. I don't care if only 5 percent recover 58 percent of statistics are made up on the spot...or is it 79 percent?

Terrible things have happenend to me to, but I don't hate one person that did these things to me. I understand. I understand that they were continuing cycles of violence. They were responsible, I will not trust them as long as they remain askew, but I love them and move on. maybe they will someday straighten out to live wholesome live with long term kindness, then I accept them as nothing has been done wrong.

This is not religion, not even philosophy, this is efficiency in living.

[Water Dragon]

Pedophiles were generally molested as children.

Pedophiles generally molest multiple children before they are caught.

Each one of those children now have a greater chance of becoming a pedophile themself.

These numbers will grow at an exponential rate.

Pedophiles grow like a cancer in society and should be cut out, just like any other disease.

[Royal Dragon]

You know, I have always respected you, and I think your an alright guy from what I know of you. But your reputation as a f Moderation Natzi preceeds you, are you trying to shake that rep by allowing a known sexual preditor continue to use your forum??

By reading that post made in the first thread, it sounds like you've positively IDed TWC as Neal Cameron. How in good concience can you allow such a creature to use your facilitys?? For me, I couldn't sleep with the knowledge someone on THAT scale is useing and enjoying a service "I" am providing. I would have the creepy crawlys ever time I saw his name on a post.

My own sense of deacency would force me to delete and ban him just because I couldn't stand a creature like that benifting from me or my work in any way shape or form.

How are you sleeping knowng your aiding such a sicko in his persuites and hobbys? How can you sleep knowing his use of your facilitys are giving him fun and enjoyment??

Like I said, if it was me, I'd ban him just because the knowledge of him would gross me out so much I'd be sick every time I though of it if I didn't.