Should girls carry pepper spray?

[BrentCarey]

I have a few comments.

1) Pepper spray is a fairly effective weapon in diminishing an attacker's capacity to attack. It will not stop a determined attacker, but it will reduce his/her ability to see and breath, and will be a significant distraction.

2) No handheld weapon is very useful if it is not held in the hand. It is not news that the weapon must be in the hand before the attack or it will not likely be of any use.

3) I used to work on a counter-drug task force where we put our lives in danger on a daily basis. In some kinds of situations we went in unarmed. We insisted that we needed some kind of protection for these types of operations and demanded vests. Instead, we got firearms. Unfortunately, mine wasn't big enough to cover all of my vital organs.

My point here is that people often mistakenly consider a weapon as an instrument of self-defense. Weapons are offensive instruments. (Yes, of course they can often be also used for defense, but you get the point.)

Rule #1 of self-defense is to be where the attack is not. Effectively, pepper spray gives you an extra margin of error provided you have it in hand at the time of the error. What I mean is that if you were unsuccessful at keeping yourself out of trouble, pepper spray can give you the extra edge you need to get yourself back out of trouble. It of course won't slay an attacker.

Throughout my training (military, law enforcement, Kung Fu) I've been sprayed, zapped, gassed, etc by pretty much every non-lethal weapon used. Pepper spray takes a pretty direct hit to do more than just aggravate the eyes, nose, and throat.

Peace,

- B. A. Carey

[wu_de36]

Originally posted by Kristoffer
Oh and wu_de36
"you should be hanging
your head in shame if you really consider yourselves "martial artists."

I do consider myself a martial artist. Who the **** are u to say I should hang my head in shame??
Who's a better martial artist? The coward who has to carry weapons to feel safe, or the normal guy who just relies on common sense and street smarts?

I can't tell if your head is stuck in the clouds or in your arse.

Common sense and street smarts are a good thing, and I don't think you will find anyone here who will dispute you on that fact. Most of the time, using your head will keep you out of trouble. And perhaps things are a little different in your country, but here in the US, there are times when normal law-abiding folks who make an effort to stay away from trouble have trouble pay them a visit.

All the common sense and street smarts in the world won't do squat against a fellow set upon killing or raping you. That's when you do what you are trained to do.

Carrying weapons is not a cowardly thing to do. It is a ****ed smart thing to do, IMO. Banning weapons is a ludicrous solution, as it will only prevent those people who fear breaking the law from carrying those weapons. If someone is intent on raping and killing, do you think they will be deterred because their weapon of choice is illegal?

My girlfriend carries pepper spray, good stuff. I would say she could get about 5 seconds of spray out of her canister. That is enough for her to use it as metsubishi and then disable her attacker. She has lots of martial training, but she won't get past the fact that she's under 60kg.

Maybe you don't want to carry a weapon because you're too much of a badass martial arts master to need them, but don't prevent smaller people, the elderly, and the handicapped from using "cowardly" ways to defend themselves.

And don't stop realists like myself from doing it either. I carry pepper spray, a yawara, and a knife. I don't want to use any of them. But I will if pressed, and I will end it as quickly as possible. You may be heroic and allow your chi to protect you.

[Dark Knight]

"It's illegal here. Cops carry it (no guns). "

Do you guys have any means to defend yourself in the UK?

[wu_de36]

And last time I checked, OC is perfectly legal in most of my country, and I haven't heard of any bands of crooks using pepper spray to disable their attackers.

I'd personally rather be pepper-sprayed than jacked with a screwdriver in the kidney.

If you ban guns, a killer will use a knife.
Ban knives (sorry chefs!) a killer will use a baton, nunchaku, pipe, etc.

Ban these, they will grab a stick or a rock and bash your head open.

Most knife attacks are done with either kitchen knives or nasty shivs such as screwdrivers. Don't believe me, you can acccess the FBI's Uniform Crime Reports. Yet, congress bans switchblades and balisongs. I'm sure the number of people knifed with a $150 Benchmade balisong are pretty low.

They run on fear. People are always afraid that when given access to such violent and efficient ways of killing, that the streets will be a river of blood.

In my state (Ohio) there is a large rush to legalize concealed handguns. The opponents use the same ol' "Ohio will turn into Dodge City" arguement.

A judge in Hamilton county suspended the law banning concealed firearms, and it lasted two weeks before the Supreme Court re-instated it temporarily. You know, for our safety.

Too bad there wasn't an actual problem.

Do you guys follow me, or am I talking to a bunch of hoplophobe ostriches with their heads perpetually stuck in the sand?

I realize a lot of you folks are from Europe, where the concept of weapons is a little foreign, but I'm asking you to be open minded.

I have been around guns and knives for 25 years, and never had the urge to use them against someone. I am not the lone voice of reason in a sea of psychopaths. Most people are the same way. "A man should believe in the right to bear arms, though he hopes never to use them."

We get awfully touchy when people start talking about what we should be trusted with, and what we "need" to own. Maybe you guys will never understand this.

Basic Premise:
- People have, and always will, kill. It is a hard indisputable fact.

- Laws banning acts, items, etc. are seldom strong deterrants. A person who wants to use a prostitute, buy drugs, speed, or murder will do so without thinking of the punitive ramifications.

- Rather than making it more difficult for the law-abiding citizen to have the means to defend themselves, why not encourage ownership of weapons?

[fa_jing]

Just wanted to share a personal anecdote with your guys - I know a woman who used pepper spray against an attacker (who she knew), don't know what type whe used, but it didn't do anything to the guy, at least as far as she could tell. She got away anyway, but it goes to show you, as others have mentioned, pepper spray can fail to accomplish the goal, especially against a determined assailant, as was the case in this instance.

-FJ

[wu_de36]

When discussing pepper spray, I make sure to get rid of any misconceptions about it being the "magic bullet" of self-defense tools. Too many people I know think that it will drop everyone.

Reactions differ greatly between individuals. I am not a fan of the stuff, and would prefer not to be sprayed with it.

Used more as a blinding technique and a set-up for a more incapacitating attack, I think it considerably more effective.

By itself, YMWillV.

[Kristoffer]

Maybe if u read my posts you will understand what I'm saying?
The fact that I dont carry weapons (not often anyway) has nothing to do with my superior martial art skills and high chi level and high iq (compared to u anyway).. This simply has to do with the fact that it is ILEGAL to carry any weapons where I live. I abide the law. That makes me "macho"?

[Kristoffer]

"I realize a lot of you folks are from Europe, where the concept of weapons
is a little foreign, but I'm asking you to be open minded."


I beleive your facts Wu_de. I do.
I'm sorry to pop your above statement but Sweden is a country with alot of ilegal hand guns. I fact, if u look at percentage of population/ guns you'll see that Sweden is one of the worst country in this sense. So to say that this concept of weapons is 'foreign' to us is naive, and wrong.
My country has alot of violence. MC gangs, organized crime syndicate's, Yugoslavian Mafia, Albanian mafia, several gangs, new-nazi punks, organized Nazi's, anarchy-kids who have traditions of trashing a city every year... I could go on alot to prove my point.

Not necesary, I have already stated my beleifs and my thoughts. They remain the same. So my beleives makes me a bad martial artist? That is a childish way of arguing.

[Kristoffer]

gotta go eat.. good nite

[wu_de36]

Originally posted by Kristoffer
[BMy country has alot of violence. MC gangs, organized crime syndicate's, Yugoslavian Mafia, Albanian mafia, several gangs, new-nazi punks, organized Nazi's, anarchy-kids who have traditions of trashing a city every year... I could go on alot to prove my point.
[/B]

Yet,

from what I can gather from your comments, it is illegal in Sweden for a common person to even own pepper spray.

so exactly how do the laws help?

[Kristoffer]

I guess it limits the criminal usage of pepper spray and leaves criminals with alot of guns insted

[WhtLotus]

I don't think pepper spray is that great of a thing. A lot of my friends carry it, and they think that that is all they would need to defend themselves. I think the main thing that women (all people, actually) should do for self defense is to remain aware of their surroundings and stay out of "danger areas." And, if for some reason you still attacked, a person should have some basic self-defense skills... like I was told, go right for the eyes. Dig your fingers in there, because the going for the eyes is more crippling than what most girls think (nads). People are protective of their eyes, and if they can't see you, they can't chase you... if you just knee them in the nads, they can still come after you. In fact, they may be just be more ****ed.

My two cents.