Body Size in Mantis

[TaoBoy]

I've seen a 5' 6" (approx 60kg) guy throw around a 6' 4" (120kg) guy with ease. They were both SPM practitioners.

[Frogman]

This is a good issue, and I like the point by Stacy that most original KF systems were developed by people that are of a smaller build. I was in the smaller build category for most of my life. Now I am of what could be considered a larger build at 5’10” 220lbs, some fat mostly just wide. Keying off what Grifter721 posted, my weight effected my forms a lot in the first two years. As the forms got longer I had a hard time finishing. Start strong and finish like a soggy noodle. Over time as the forms averaged out to be close to the same length I became better at finishing strong as I built up the strength to carry my weight all the way thru. I still struggle. No, I don’t move as well as most of my smaller brothers and sisters, but there are some moves I do, do better. For me speed and timing vary depending on the move I am doing. My hand speed is twice as fast as my feet. When doing basic drills I will finish punches ahead of most of my Bro & Sis and with kicks I finish behind. I feel this has to do with the fact that my hands are not holding up my weight. As for size and power if you use your body weight properly your size will be directly prepositional to your power. This is different then strength. One of my personal favorites when inside on a smaller opponent is to just body check them. As for advantage, the person that uses the attributes of their size most efficiently will come out ahead. Smaller is faster and more agile, larger is generally more powerful and harder to up root. Of course, size speed and agility do not make up for technique.

RibHit
fm

[hungy]

I have no doubt little guys can kick my ass and throw me around. my sifu is probably only 160 and at the time i was like 200... and he threw me around like a little rag doll...

[BeiTangLang]

Interesting point about the originators body size,....but the Northern Chinese are not all that little of a people. The far.ther north you go(at least in my research on the subject) the larger & taller the people seem to be. I believe the system was created for what I classified as medium build people, not the small frame as is the predominant size in the Southern areas. From my understanding, Luo Guang Yu nor Fan Xu Dong his teacher were small people either. I will agree that if I were to loose 50lbs or so I could probably be a better fighter with much better agility (which I am working on). Another point on the kicking techniques is what they wore on their feet; they did not wear slippers in the snow. They wore something more akin to the hard-soled boots we have now-days which makes me wonder about "tornado kicks" that some are enamoured with....but thats another story.
Best Wishes,
~BTL

[TaiChiStorm]

There is one guy learning BAJI in my Mantis school. He has is rather big seized. He had been a Mantis student for 2-3 years. (He was under the first students of my master. this group was still training VERY hard (asian style). Anyway. Although he was really good in Mantis and also VERY quick, my master asked him to change the style to Baji which is better "related" to his body structure.
He is very happy with Baji now. He is the only one in the group who is being teached Baji by my master.

[draco]

I am considered small, muscular and old. If you have ever climbed to the top of the mountain where it is cold and windy in a harsh enviroment, the only trees you will find are short strong ones. I have practised many techniques on other people and do many forms. When it comes to the fight there is NO technique, NO form. A fight is a fight, an understanding that there is a huge gap between useing a technique and fighting. A person has one good weapon. The smart fighter big or small should know what he is getting into, to walk away or to teach a lesson respectively.

[Jotun]

Do any of you heavier guys have knee problems?

[BeiTangLang]

Originally posted by draco
I am considered small, muscular and old. If you have ever climbed to the top of the mountain where it is cold and windy in a harsh enviroment, the only trees you will find are short strong ones. I have practised many techniques on other people and do many forms. When it comes to the fight there is NO technique, NO form. A fight is a fight, an understanding that there is a huge gap between useing a technique and fighting. A person has one good weapon. The smart fighter big or small should know what he is getting into, to walk away or to teach a lesson respectively.

..? What does this have to do with the price of tea in China?

[BeiTangLang]

Originally posted by Jotun
Do any of you heavier guys have knee problems?

Yes,....Why? I have seen all sizes with knee problems.
Sorry to sound rude, but if you have a reason for asking ( maybe explain it), you would get better answers.

[yu shan]

Poor execution of stances and training surfaces can hasten joint pain which will lead to damage. Proper supervision by your teacher is the key. All weight classes suffer joint damaged.

[draco]

Originally posted by BeiTangLang



..? What does this have to do with the price of tea in China?

Curious as to what your opinions are about what you have noticed about the size of mantis practitioners vs their ability to perform the art. I am of a relatively large frame-size & I personaly find that most things work very well for me, but what about you other practitioners?

[BeiTangLang]

Originally posted by draco
I am considered small, muscular and old. If you have ever climbed to the top of the mountain where it is cold and windy in a harsh enviroment, the only trees you will find are short strong ones. I have practised many techniques on other people and do many forms. When it comes to the fight there is NO technique, NO form. A fight is a fight, an understanding that there is a huge gap between useing a technique and fighting. A person has one good weapon. The smart fighter big or small should know what he is getting into, to walk away or to teach a lesson respectively.

O.K,...You are considered small, muscular and old. I do not see in your bio that you do mantis. You talk about , h@ll,..I don't even get most of what you're talking about pertaining to my original question if you don't train mantis, & philosophy is great too,...except it has nothing to do with bodysize in a mantis practitioner & the way he performs.......So, what was the price of tea in China again?

[BeiTangLang]

Originally posted by yu shan
Poor execution of stances and training surfaces can hasten joint pain which will lead to damage. Proper supervision by your teacher is the key. All weight classes suffer joint damaged.

I agree with you 100%. Other joint injuries also occur with incorrect technique regardless of body-size. About jing generation & other techniques, have you noticed a difference in the way certain motions/movements/techniques are performed?

[draco]

Originally posted by BeiTangLang


O.K,...You are considered small, muscular and old. I do not see in your bio that you do mantis. You talk about , h@ll,..I don't even get most of what you're talking about pertaining to my original question if you don't train mantis, & philosophy is great too,...except it has nothing to do with bodysize in a mantis practitioner & the way he performs.......So, what was the price of tea in China again?

I do not have a great vocbulary and my writting techniques could use alot of polish. But if I'm to write a bare bone comment (an opinion) it would be this. If I'm to enter a serious FIGHT (being a small person) I leave my techniques behind.

oh yea e-mail me if need more info.

[isol8d]

Originally posted by BeiTangLang


I agree with you 100%. Other joint injuries also occur with incorrect technique regardless of body-size. About jing generation & other techniques, have you noticed a difference in the way certain motions/movements/techniques are performed?

I'm a fellow big man studying mantis. 6'2" & 265lbs. I've been the same weight for about 2 years now, and I can only lose weight through extreme dieting, which in turn, leads to me not being able to physically make it through training. Catch 22. The good things that have come from studying at this weight, has been the development of strength from my stances. Naturally, this has to occur to combat the forces trying to wrench my knees out of whack. My instructors have pointed out to me time and again that I should use my body more like a smaller person, because I generate more force with less effort. It really came to light last week, when I was doing bag work with a new student, and I had to pull my kicks and punches as much as I could, to keep from hurting her. Even a humble side kick with as little force as I could muster was sending her flying. Good discussion.