Has Kung Fu made you a better person?

[Neurotic]

Hey folks,

This is just an extension of a discussion that grew out of another thread in the Wing Chun forum:
Would you ever say that you're good?

But would you say thay Kung Fu, or martial arts in general has given you the skills to become a better person?

Confident, humble, disciplined.. whatever...?

Thoughts and feelings?

Neurotic

[Souljah]

definately confidence in myself is one of the things i have developed.....I would say I've developed disciple too and being humble about things was something I guess I had from the beginning (risking arrogance there.....LOL)

[Suntzu]

I would say it has made me an obsessive perfectionist with an occasional bi-polar tendency…
...... see!!!

[SanSoo Student]

Yea confidence is a big thing martial arts gives you, also humbleness. Well I became humble after getting the crap beat out of me by my sifu for being ****y.

[Budokan]

Yes, it's made me stronger and healthier. That's always a good thing.

[crumpet]

character building is the most important aspect of kung fu training imho. too many people these days or even back when the legendary masters existed, are so caught up in having great fighting skills so they can be better in reputation than the next master. we've all heard the arguments about going to church to become a better person and how kung fu IS for fighting, but to me it's a lesson in life to respect others from all walks of life and from different types of thinking. i could learn that from a priest as well, yes... BUT martial arts in general is violent by nature, and it shows that we ALL have weaknesses that can be exploited, no matter how big or strong we are.

my training is EXTREMELY traditional. not in the sense that it's physically hard, but it's mentally draining. it's taught me to be patient, and it's taught me to respect not only traditional training, but modern training as well. mma always have the argument that we must evolve with the times. that is a disrespect to MY way of thinking. but hey, i don't bother to argue with peoplel who disagree with me, because i've also learnt that we can't change the way others think if they don't have any room in their heart for oppossing views. i believe i'm a staunch traditionalist who loves kung fu in it's original form (or as close to possible), but it disappoints me that whilst i can respect other's POV, they can't or won't respect mine. why is that? my guess would be because their training is focused too much on fighting and self defence. to beat an attacker and go home safely. perhaps i look further into my training than most and read in between the lines. knowing that we are all weak in some respects was not TOLD to me by my sifu, it is something i realised along my journey in kung fu. it is also an endless journey that has no end. we have an ideal that there is an end, and we work to reach that goal... my goal is to be good. and i can't even define good, so i just keep training and training hoping that one day i'll reach this 'goodness' that i want. and it's not even with fighting. yes i want to be good at kung fu, but i also want to be a good person in every aspect of life. this thinking all came from my training and nothing else. it's quite bizarre really...

there are also people more traditional than me in thinking, that it even frustrates ME sometimes. but that's another thing i've learnt. that we can't make assumptions on other's characters from 2yrs or so of knowing them. i believe it takes MUCH longer to know how other's are like. it's just like a personal friend. u can't claim to KNOW a friend after 1yr of knowing them. it usually takes alot longer to open up our hearts. kung fu sifus are exactly the same as everyone else. they won't open up their heart and their thinking after only knowing a student for a few yrs.

what else... teaching students who constantly question your abilities is a hard thing, BUT that goes back to respecting other's POV. if they don't agree with your way of doing things, there's no use trying to persuade them otherwise.

ok i've ranted on long enough!

[GeneChing]

If I didn't practice martial arts, I'd probably sitting at a stoplight with a carboard sign that said "will administer kungfu online forum for food."

[Merryprankster]

perhaps i look further into my training than most and read in between the lines

Ah yes, more crap along the lines of "I'm so humble! Look how humble I am!"

Perhaps the peoples' POV's you claim to respect are tired of hearing that MA's are a spiritual endeavor and they're doing it all wrong, too.

Just pointing out the sword cuts both ways.

If MMA arrogance is aggressive thuggishness, TMA arrogance is pseudo-enlightened snobbery.

[fa_jing]

Well, the cultural angle is very important, I imagine that in China learning Calligraphy is supposed to make you more virtuous. I remember that Tennis was supposed to make us into better people. If you are looking to become a better person, any activity can be used in this manner. Any competitive activity, however, could just as easily be used in the opposite sense, and you see this all the time from unscrupulous coaches and nasty competitors.

[fa_jing]

Some kids that are lacking discipline at home might find it at the Dojo. But, IMO the teacher is just taking parental responsibilities upon himself for a fee.

[SaMantis]

Martial arts initially got me out of the house and into a social life, of sorts -- even if it was just talking to people before and after class. It was exactly what I needed at the time.

Am I a great martial artist? Heck no. Am I confident? Yes -- which is different from being c o c k y or arrogant. Confidence is the ability to deal with the world; c o c k i n e s s/arrogance is the mistaken notion that one can conquer the world.

So I can deal with daily BS with a minimum of stress (most of the time), and I'm in better shape, too, thanks to martial arts. My changed outlook has also made my mother happy, so there.

[KC Elbows]

Practicing kung fu has made me a better kung fu fighter, and made it so that I can hang out and have fun with other kung fu people. As far as making me a better person, I give credit first to my parents, then to a few other people. I've only had one kung fu teacher who I can say shaped my morality in any way, and that was more because he was a good man than anything to do with kung fu(though he was a great martial artist). And the only teacher I've had who taught a "martial morality" subsequently spent six years in a federal pennitentiary.

I'm not discounting the concept of a good person who teaches kung fu and morality to some underpriveledged kid being helpful, but I think expecting martial skill and morality to be automatic brethren is naive. Look at the great artists in history, and you will find that some of the best were also sonsAbiches. Magically, martial arts are supposed to be different than all other arts.

Life is too short. I try to learn from the best at whatever I'm learning. I have had excellent kung fu teachers. I have had excellent moral teachers. Need they be the same people?

IMO, Merry is correct. The convenience of a moral system as part of ones martial one is that they can have something to be proud about. Of course, pride never caused no harm...

Life made me a better person. I give credit to no single aspect. My life as a writer and my life as a martial artist and my life as a husband, all the same life. How could I possibly parsel it up and say "I'm good because...".

There was a time that martial arts made me a bad person. Intolerant, prideful, arrogant, potentially violent. Full of myself, narrow minded, easily led. Single minded in the most stupid way.

Maybe it will make me a bad person again. Hard to say. Maybe I'm a good person despite it. Maybe it was all the fault of video games.

I did play Q'bert quite a bit. It confused me. What was Q'bert? Did Q'bert have an assigned gender? I couldn't really figure that all out. Perhaps that was why I started smoking.

Then again, did I become good because I never watched Baywatch?

Actually, I think it's all the fact that I read Malcolm X's autobiography. That inspired me quite a bit.

Most of the morality I learned in martial arts applied specifically to martial arts. I already knew it wasn't good to be fighting all of the time. I learned that sometimes you have to fight in order to protect yourself, but that isn't, in my mind, morality. I did learn that it is good to meet as many other practitioners and experts and learn what they have to share, but I would have learned that as an engineer, or as a computer programmer.

So, here's my answer:

[fa_jing]

I hung out with the author of Q'bert ( a friend of a friend) and let me tell, you, the man is a h-omosexual, descended from English nobility and one of the pioneers of the rave scene. Not that there's anything wrong with that, or with YOOU KC!!!

[KC Elbows]

The odds of me making a Q'Bert referrence and someone coming in with such info must be incalculable. This stinks of synchronicity.

Thanks fa jing. You've cleared up a lot of confusion in my life. I finally know why Q'Bert held such fascination for me.

I must be an english noble.

[fa_jing]

Actually, the odds are 1. It happened. Sorry to be a stickler. Now, what are the odds of two Amish buggies getting in accidents on the same day? Warning: tragic http://abcnews.go.com/wire/US/ap20021028_1240.html