Sifu Joe Keit vs. Shaolin Monk

[Fu-Pow]

I still think this thread is stupid.

Its about the most non-intellectual thing I've ever read.

It kind of reminds of when you were a kid and one kid goes "hey my Dad can beat up your dad" and the other kid goes "oh yeah, shut up, my Dad can beat up your dad."

What's the point of this thread?

To cut down Joe?

Tell you what...you guys are grown ups....you guys that have a problem with Joe. Go to the school where he trains (www.leekoonhungkungfu.com) walk in and challenge him to a "Gong Sau" match. Mono e mono. Not to the death or anything but just till someone's in a lot of pain.

If he's a player of any merit he'll accept your challenge.

Come back and tell us who won. And if you win you can tell us how bad he sucks and how he's full of **** and there's no way he could have beat a shaolin monk.

Until then it's all claims and words and true kung fu men don't live by those rules....we live and die by the fist.

[Jamesbond_007]

I have to agree with Fu-Pow, this really is out of line. Although I have never met Joe, I have had contact with the people from his school and they are among the niced martial artists I have met. A couple of years back I used to manage a big martial arts store and I met a lot of martial artists, sifus, and instructors. I came across a lot of egos and some nice people. I says a lot for a school and the head instructors if their students are polite and kind. It shows what the school teaches and stands for.

About Joe as a marital artist. I have seen a lot of tapes of him and he along with his current sifu and Lee Koon Hung have some of the best stances I have seen any from any CLF practioner. I have a home tape of a big CLF demo in China with a lot of CLF teachers from all over the world. There is a lot of great stuff on it but Joe and his sifu have such beautiful stances and technique its inspiring. Watch how they move, very graceful, they sink in their say ping ma's and flow from one move to another.

How about we talk about what we have learned from Joe or Lee Koon Hung instead of who beat who?

[freezeme4]

OK THEN, let turn this to a productive topic, like judging, and fairness. or, unfairness if you like. How many of you out there have gone to a tourn. and have bin judged unfairly? and on top of that watched another competitor get high scores from a judge from their own school. Well i have. And it just so happens i was at that tourn. and saw this happen more than once. and just to set the record straight, I'm not talking about the grandchampion comp. here. But, I do think when the stakes are high, then integrity in judging should be high as well. And if you are a sifu and you have a student competing in the grandchampionships, then you should step aside and let a alternate judge in. Maybe this is one of the reasons that tourn. arn't as large as they use to be. add all the politics and you have poor attendance.
So lets hear some other stories or ideas to promote CMA. HOW CAN WE IMPROVE THE SYSTEM.

CFNOLES, I have not seen the tapes in question. but if they do claim something that is not true, it's not the same as pumping your self up in a program. the program is not for sale on the net. and i think this is misleeding. this is really none of my buss. but just my opionon. Do you think sifu would aprove if he where still alive? I don't know. I have my doubts. Are you going to ST. Pete? I have a sweet wip chain i would like to compair. all stainless steel.

[CLFNole]

Freeze:

You know my answer to your question without me having to say anything. Don't think I will be going to St. Pete cuz I don't think he (you know who I am talking about) has any students who will be competing or a practicing to compete for that matter. Maybe we can compare whips another time like if Andy has another tourney.

Good luck to you guys.

Hey I saw a tape from the show you guys did in Fort Lauderdale, why didn't you perform? Resting for the Dragon Boat race? LOL

Peace.

P.S. Say hi to Bill for me and tell him I still have his book if he wants it.

[Serpent]

Originally posted by freezeme4
But, I do think when the stakes are high, then integrity in judging should be high as well. And if you are a sifu and you have a student competing in the grandchampionships, then you should step aside and let a alternate judge in.

Agreed. But it's never going to happen.

[freedom76]

I didn't expect this much of a response. First of all, I wasn't criticizing Sifu Keit by any means. I was simply asking a question.
Second, I have only heard good things about him and his CLF lineage. If I offended anybody, I apologize. I now learn the Northern and Songshan lineages of Kung Fu. I am looking to take private lessons with a monk here in the US and am trying to find a good one that can do the forms well as well as can teach well. I was hoping to find out who the monk was because I was working under the impression that Sifu Keit had won, and perhaps to learn more of a monk here in the US. That Sifu Keit had won would have NOT been a surprise to me. I don't buy into the "legend" of the shaolin monks. Most of them are good, perhaps great (like Shi Guolin in NY) but not all. That easily carries over to any style. What we gain is up to us. Having a great Sifu is not enough, training in this style or that style is not enough. It's up to each of us, but finding a reputable instructor does help. Having one that understands much and can move well helps, but it still takes time and practice..."kung fu". I originally started in a style called Chung Moo Quan (or Doe, now Oom Yang Doe with John C. Kim) about eight or so years ago, spent nearly three years there, and if you know anything about that style, I believe you'd easily understand why I want to know more about an instructor before I learn from them.
I fear that there will be those people here that don't accept my words as the truth, but I've done my part.
Peace.

[Serpent]

Fair comment.

[Eddie]

Just made me wonder...., at our kung fu tournies here in SA, they follow a system from the IWUF where the judges score the competitor, then they drop the highest and the lowest score, and take the avarage of the rest to determine the score result. When there are 9 judges, it effectively meens that they only take the avarage of 7 scores.

Even if your sifu does favour you in any way, it wouldnt really matter much with this system.

I was told by a friend (Jose Figurao) from NYC that they also use that format at some tournaments in the states, so I pretty much doubt that Master Li's score could really make that much of a difference with this tournament (unless they didn't follow this system).

Last thing on Shaolin monks....
I have a friend down here who was a circular disciple at De Yangs school in china. Although his kung fu is very good, I can honestly say that his san da doesnt impress me. He is a very 'sloppy' fighter, although very boastful.

So, shaolin monk or not...

[GeneChing]

To the best of my knowledge, no Shaolin monk has competed in a tournament yet on U.S. soils. Many Shaolin disciples have competed, and many of them don robes, so this may be the source of the confusion. Hell, I'm a Shaolin disciple. If Joe wants to challenge a disciple, he knows where to find me, and I'm sure he'd make short work of me (but then I'd write a nasty article on him ) J/K Actually Joe is a bud and I have great respect for him and his skills. Joe, if you're reading this, you know you have an open invitation to come by the office any time you're in town, but for a beer, buddy, not a brawl.

The 'monks' at that performed as part of the Wah Lum sponsored tour Shaolin 2000 were actually just disciples. If you check the Shaolin 2000 video that we carry, we clearly say that the headmaster Zhu Tianxi, is a disciple. In fact, this is a point that I emphasized in my July 2000 article When Mountains Meet.

Shaolin monks do lose at tournaments just like everyone else, but to the best of my knowledge, that is limited to within China. Most of the monks have already won a lot of medals and awards before the are fully indoctrinated. Then once they become monks, they stop competing, just like how most professional masters here no longer compete.

[yutyeesam]

Thanks for clearing that up, Gene. I was going to say. Devoting oneself to live the way of the Buddha by abandoning the materialistic way of life and competing in tournaments seems to be in direct conflict with each other.

Sometimes it's easy to forget about what the "monk" part of Shaolin monk really means.

123

[Serpent]

Originally posted by yutyeesam
Sometimes it's easy to forget about what the "monk" part of Shaolin monk really means.

Sadly these days, at least in the west, it seems to mean "licence to print money".

[yik-wah-tik]

fool paw you are just a joke. a baby who cries when noone responds to his posts. but one thing is for sure, you will always remember my name regardless. you are another joseph who will never reveal his true identity because if mak hin fai knew of your exploits here, he would boot you from the school.

amongst the true clf masters i have a good name and they laugh at you and the rest of these fools on this line. the forum is the only place you exist and you hate it!

all you fools are out of your mind. you are so bored you have to question joe keits beating a shaolin monk. for What? what will it prove? you all act like you are the end all of choy lee fut. at least joe keits name is becoming famous to the outside world. did you see him with those pretty females in the kung fu magazine?
where are you? did you buy his video tape? then you are the trick, and he is the pimp so you got pimped.

this is why i no longer need to be on this forum. it is for psychos like you, while i was just made honorary president in the malaysia hung sing kwoon without them meeting me. my work is being done. what are you doing? playing on this forum? then have fun.

leave my name out of this losers!!!!!!

your friendly neighborhood hung sing kwoon gung fu man!

joe, kick their asses!

[NorthernMantis]

Originally posted by flyingeagle
I was actually in Orlando for the tournament in question. Not only did he not fight the monk in sparring, he was unable to even win his division. However, he did perform well in forms, which enabled him to compete for Grand Champion. When competing for the overall title, his own sifu, Li Siu Hung, was one of the judges. This was widely known at the tournament and highly criticized. As I recall, there was actual booing when it was announced that he won.

Not really. I'm a wah lum student and my sifu personally spoke to sigung Chan Pui about the monks. The one that Joe competed with had strained a muscle in his lower back.Not bad for an injured man huh? Well anyways I think Joe had won fair and square ,in the forms division, and seemed to have a lot more power in his form. Well you have to give it up for the monk for competing with a hurt back. I don't think sifu Li really had anything to do with Joe winning to an extent, since sifu Li does know what a correct clf form looks like unlike other non-cfl sifus, but other than that I don't think sifu Li's judging had any bad influence on the judging.

Hmm as far as monks sparring I didn't see any but I was mostly in one of the rooms preparing for my division.

[Serpent]

Originally posted by yik-wah-tik
fool paw you are just a joke. a baby who cries when noone responds to his posts. but one thing is for sure, you will always remember my name regardless. you are another joseph who will never reveal his true identity because if mak hin fai knew of your exploits here, he would boot you from the school.

amongst the true clf masters i have a good name and they laugh at you and the rest of these fools on this line. the forum is the only place you exist and you hate it!

all you fools are out of your mind. you are so bored you have to question joe keits beating a shaolin monk. for What? what will it prove? you all act like you are the end all of choy lee fut. at least joe keits name is becoming famous to the outside world. did you see him with those pretty females in the kung fu magazine?
where are you? did you buy his video tape? then you are the trick, and he is the pimp so you got pimped.

this is why i no longer need to be on this forum. it is for psychos like you, while i was just made honorary president in the malaysia hung sing kwoon without them meeting me. my work is being done. what are you doing? playing on this forum? then have fun.

leave my name out of this losers!!!!!!

your friendly neighborhood hung sing kwoon gung fu man!

joe, kick their asses!

No one mentioned your name, Frank. We were really enjoying the forum without your polluting presence, yet here you are again, shouting and ranting and raving like a lunatic. I would really suggest you seek professional help.

Meanwhile, as you "no longer need this forum" why don't you go away and masturbate over your "honourary presidents" certificate.

[extrajoseph]

Uncanny! Serpent often says what I was thinking but too polite to say so.