effectiveness of TKD to other arts.

[MonkeySlap Too]

I'm not talking about 'another master', I'm talking about a skilled HIGH SCHOOL WRESTLER.

And I have investigated TSD/SBD - bwah-ha-ha!! I think everyone should practice it. {snicker} It'll make the world safer for me.

How do you define your percentages? That sounds so precise. It is just annoying because I have seen so many Korean stylists play the China card because it helps them sell to the rubes.

I would not be surprised if more knowledge is being 'discovered' in your arts, as a lot of legit stuff is now available on video tape.

All I ask you are two things - Do you fight with your forms? Have you fought with a high school wrestler yet?

Oh, and I apologize if I sound snide - I just have years of lies fostered by TKD/TSD groups boiling up in me. Call like I see it. Maybe you see it different.

[rogue]

Welcome Kyo Sa Nim Moore, don't let Monkey slap get to you. After all he has recently admited to studying the art practiced by a losing side. ;)

I know zip about TSD, so how about filling us in.
What Okinawan styles does it draw from and has it retained any of the kata? I'd think Naihanchi/Tekki would be in there as that seems to be one of the most important to the Okinawan styles.

Monkey Slap, what style of Tae Bo are you doing now? I hear that the Tae bo live tape is *****in!
:D

[KFlearner]

Well for one I didn't think that this would get this many posts. Wow.

Ok I do plan on going to 1st, or 2nd dan black belt in TKD, then that is when I really want to go for a style of Kung fu. I figure, strong footwork and kicking, combined with strong blocking, jabbing and punching will suit me well!!!

well thank you all!!

lataz,
kflearner

[Kyo Sa Nim Moore]

Ok, in response to MonkeySlap's comments first. I have fought both college wrestlers and BJJ practitioners, and have fared well against both of them. The problem with most TKD artists is that they have a set of strategies to use against only other TKD artists, rather than adapting to their opponent.

Wrestlers tend to move in very fast, but if you are a skilled TSD martial artist you will learn to kick harder and faster than they can move in. We also focus on the joint locks, arm bars, leg bars, etc. of Hap Ki Do which are effective if you are taken to the ground.

Of course there are many fake TSD and TKD instructors and schools out there - the same goes with Kung-Fu, but if you are trained by an experienced Master you will see the true effectiveness of every martial art.

Those percentages I gave come directly from the Founder of Tang Soo Do Moo Duk Kwan, GM Hwang Kee. There is no way to verify the exact percentages, but they seem accurate because there are many Hyungs (forms in Korean) that are based on Shaolin Kung-Fu (mainly Long Fist).

There are Naihanji forms (from the Okinawan traditon) in Tang Soo Do, but some schools have translated their names into Korean - so they are called Keemah forms now. These are very characteristic of the Shotokan style forms. Whereas, the forms such as Bassai (snake style form) are very quick and aerobic in nature - similar to some styles of Kung-Fu.

[MonkeySlap Too]

Never one to think I know it all (but I won't agree just to make nice, I have this thing about honesty), and not one to be bothered by Rogues churlish Tae Bo inference, I'd like to see if there is Video anywhere of the Long Fist as practiced by TSD.

Having met TSD practitioners, I have a hard time seeing how the principles of these two arts could blend. My assumption would be that the TSD version of Long Fist would be Long Fist motions with TSD principles.

Just curious.

I am a big beleiver in luck. The more I work, the more luck I have.

[Kyo Sa Nim Moore]

There is a hyung called 'So Rim Jang Kwon' which is an advanced Dan level hyung. It translates from Korean into 'Shaolin Long Fist' and it uses many of the movements that I've seen advanced Shaolin Long-Fist practitioners use. Another Kung-Fu related hyung in TSD is 'Tae Geuk Kwan' which translates into 'Grand Ultimate Fist' which is related to Tai Chi-Chuan forms.

Most likely your friends are not trained by a very knowledgeable Master or are not very advanced. I'm a 3rd Dan about to test for 4th Dan (Master) and have been training in TSD for 15 years. I speak out of experience, not ignorance.

[Kyo Sa Nim Moore]

There is a hyung called 'So Rim Jang Kwon' which is an advanced Dan level hyung. It translates from Korean into 'Shaolin Long Fist' and it uses many of the movements that I've seen advanced Shaolin Long-Fist practitioners use. Another Kung-Fu related hyung in TSD is 'Tae Geuk Kwan' which translates into 'Grand Ultimate Fist' which is related to Tai Chi-Chuan forms.

Most likely your friends are not trained by a very knowledgeable Master or are not very advanced. I'm a 3rd Dan about to test for 4th Dan (Master) an

[rogue]

Aw c'mon Monkey I'm just having fun with ya. Anyway one day you might want to take up the martial arts and that Tae Bo will come in handy. :D

Hey did you read all of that link I posted to you?
If not scroll on down it you'll get a laugh out of it.

[MonkeySlap Too]

Actually there is a high level form in Tae Bo called 'ow I popped my knee'. I think it comes from TKD...I speak from experience...

I am a big beleiver in luck. The more I work, the more luck I have.

I think it would be very diffucult to "serve two masters at the same time" so to speak. Then again there are vast difference between Northern & Southern KF styles.

For example a freind of mine has been able to train in TDK as well as Wing Chun. Both styles don't require the sophsticated waist movements as in the Northern Syles.

My background had been in TDK. The first go i had atMantis was very very difficult. The main problem was the "stiffness" in TDK (you'll know what I mean once you start training in Northern KF) was really working against the KF system.

Nevertheless, the stifness was purged after a 5+ years of absence from martial arts (due to unrelated reasons) which during that time I trained in free style partner dancing (modern Jive).

So looking back - I don't thnink TKD really helped that much. True it taught the basic stances but that's about it. From my persepctive mantis is by far a more efficient system. Oh BTW the training method is just as important - got to make sure that it is consistent with the objectives of the style ( but that's another topic for discussion).

All the best in your search. Listen to Obiwan - he is a more accomplished Jedi than I!

Ego Maximize!

[joedoe]

My answer to the original question is this:

It doesn't matter what style you do, it is the practitioner (amd the teacher) that makes a difference. If you are good at TKD, and have a talent for fighting, then you could just as easily beat a Wing Chun practitioner, and vice versa.

I once met a guy who combined TKD with a Southern kung fu style (kicks from TKD, hands from the kung fu style) and he was an awesome fighter.

Just pick what works best for you - it is difficult to say that one style is better than another.