Hey guys, I need some opinions.

[Dark Knight]

My friend, like I said is "fantasy" prone. He lives in this world of comics, "Batman" stories, and the like....

First, tell him I am the only one and will not tolerate cheap copy cat wanna be's.

I have run a cross a couple hundred people like him. I actually know a 41 year old guy who told us how he took on 20 people at the same time.

There is no good answer for these types. I tried sparring with them and abused them, but they just justify it because you are a higher rank and should be able to beat him. Then he will tell all his buddies about the sparring session and how hard he trains. The more you beat him, the more he is convinced he is training super hard and can fight anyone.

just teach him, talk to him and correct him on how he carries himself. Point out what it looks like without saying its him directly.

We just picked up a Black Belt from a school that made up thier own style and called it "Masters Style Self Defense" His Black Belt has that in gold on it. I finally told him its in poor taste to have the word Master on your belt even though its referring to the style. Sometimes people do not realize how they appear to the world.

....look at Ralek.

[Ray Pina]

RYU, put the gloves on and beat him from wall to wall. Go to the ground and make him tap. Beat him in every possible way and, if he's serious, he'll want to know why.

Ralek, check your PM box.

[SanSoo Student]

You should take him to a really crazy MA studio/gym, one that is rough, so when he tries to brag about all he knows, the real guys practicing MA will show him how it works.

I recommend taking him to Muay Thai if you can, then u could let him see that his kung fu doesn't work against knees and elbows.

Its easy enough to learn where he could just train himself once he gets the basics. And then he could start learning real MA, cuz once he learns stand up fighting, he should have more interest in BJJ.

I hope my post makes sense, its 6:47 AM right now. My brain is still waking up cuz my coffee didn't brew yet.

[Mr Punch]

MP and Dark Knight have got the correct by the scrotum with their teeth and are having a tugowar with it.

As MP says, he needs three rules, and you need to keep beating him with them. You can probably use any three rules, but MP's seem practical enough to get rid of his delusional bent. But, as DK implies, you will need the patience of a saint, but then, you are Ryu.

I would shoot him, myself.

[apoweyn]

I think I'm going to differ a bit with most of the opinions here. Suggestions about beating the crap out of him are perfectly valid. He'll learn what's real and what's not, certainly. But what do people expect? That he'll experience some sort of blunt force trauma-induced epiphany? That he'll all of a sudden see the light?

I think it's more likely that the changes you're looking for, Ryu, are already taking place. But change to self identity is kinda terrifying on some gut level. So your friend is protecting his self image. By insisting that he is smart, and competent, etc. I'm sure he's experiencing a lot of the reevaluation you're hoping he is. But simultaneously trying to preserve his ego. Be patient with him. I don't think the ego preservation thing is really all that bad along the way (as much as we would all like to believe in zen ideals about extinguishing the ego, etc.).

I think you'll see a gradual shift if you're patient enough. Happened with me. And if one of my mates had been purposefully trying to engineer that shift in perspective, I'm sure it would have tried their patience horribly.


Stuart B.

[No_Know]

Approach: Oh really...; That's interesting...; tell me about that...

For openings--holes in his belief structure that you with your knowledge base can point out as holes--does not make sense does not follow; or introduce facts to suggest his concepts are off...

"(i.e. "Well I used to train greco roman wrestling and amateur wrestling for a long time...."
Him: "Well...I..... my friend showed me a few moves...""

After such mentions with your reasonable probes. Tying in the beginning of his claim with the clarifications of his ending statement might be your key.

Is it your understanding that a few moves equals studying for a long time?

Hopefully, hearing it, that won't make sense to even him and it wil den't his bravado.

I have concern from the design of his statement (you presented) that he feels inferior to the likes of you (idolizes you (perhaps you and your sort)). And he talks-up his experience and background to get your respect.

Look upon him as a little brother type. One who wants to do all the older boys stuff or go where they do and won't admit to Any inadequecies toone day be accepted. Proves he's as good as you all by not giving-up, when he will loose or doesn't know what's going-on nor what he's doing. He hopes to himself he can figure it out as he goes. And big talk when he is even partially successful so you think well of him. And excuses that it wasn't his fault he failed or that no one could have succeded.

...

[shaolinboxer]

Just keep practicing with him. If you disagree with on of his points, point it out in as nice a way as possible. Be gentle with this kid, and you have the best chance of helping him figure it all out. If you beat on him, physically, verbally, or emotionally you are most likely just reproducing the model that got him into this mess in the first place. Destroy his illusions with an open heart and a gentle nudge.

[Ray Pina]

I do not mean, kick him while he's down, hit him when he's turned "beat him".

Learning martial arts is different then scholastic schooling. I hated school as a kid, I went kicking and screaming and my teachers and parents had to do everything they could to get me to do home work, go to class -- and that didn't work.

On the other hand, I was in my gi and ready for class before dinner telling my dad to hurry up that I'd be late for training. That's because I wanted to learn.

Now, you're friend may seem interested in learning, but is he really? One never learns anything by opening their mouth. So, I suggested beating him, just to show who has authority concerning martial arts. If that doesn't shut his mouth and open his ears/mind ... then just forget him. He's a flake. He's more interested in the MA title than the skills associated with it. There's a ton of monk robe wearing, wushu sword swinging folks like him. Fine. But don't waist your time.

Those that really want to learn will come with an open mind. Those that "know it all", know it all already. Congratulate them and let them be.

Too much talk and discussion and trying to find common ground already. I would've said, "Let's put the gloves on" long ago. You're a good man. But you can't open someone else's eyes for them -- especially if their head is burried in the sand.

[apoweyn]

You're a good man. But you can't open someone else's eyes for them -- especially if their head is burried in the sand.

Is that a direct quote from Teachings of the Compassionate Buddha?

[Merryprankster]

Right. I didn't mean beat on him either. I meant, just continue to win. He'll ask "How did you do that?" And that's your teachable moment.

[Ray Pina]

I didn't think I was quoating anyone, but now that you mention it that does sound highly quoatable.

Anyway,

RYU, you're the teacher. Don't put up with that crap. Serious, "how to" questions, or even an occassional, "but what if I do that," can be tolerated. But if he's more or less challenging your postion, you have to make it known who's the manager and who's the coffee boy. There can't be any discussion there.

[apoweyn]

Originally posted by Merryprankster
Right. I didn't mean beat on him either. I meant, just continue to win. He'll ask "How did you do that?" And that's your teachable moment.

I like that. The teachable moment. Absolutely. Just expect that when you use that moment, there's a good chance he's not going to experience enlightenment then and there. He's probably going to hem and haw. Or offer counterpoints. Or whatever. But I don't think that means the message wasn't heard loud and clear. I think people do hear and understand at times like that. Even if their behavior doesn't seem consistent with that.


Stuart B.

[No_Know]

If you could post the comics he uses as guides That would help me...

You'd mentioned Batman comics. Perhaps some animations, television...Point out such things to reach him...Robin started as an aerial acrobat. He and Batman studied from many experts as he was growing-up. Bruce Wayne was humble as he studied in Japan. His humility helped him to progress. He practiced the lessons as he was shown and taught. And he practiced them on his own those things. to have it as good as his understanding allowed when he got to show his instructor.

Batman did little training. Bruce Wayne studied from experts all his life. Batman wouldn't exist without Bruce Wane's Drive and slow progress throughout his life.

Pointing out that you were not always as good for each technique...what you went through before you even did it fair and that there is better than you. Might help.

Perhaps recommending Jademan comics Force of Buhda's Palm, Bloodsword (Dynasty), Iron Marshal.~

They are strong but recognize that even they have limitations.

[mantis108]

I think Cody hits the nail dead on. Your friend is most likely looking to you for approval and don't know how to ask for your help. I have a feeling that he looks up to you in a certain area (physical attribute?) He definitely don't want you to look down on him and his stuff.

MP also suggested a practical approach. The only thing is that I don't think showing that you are superior both physically and in knowledge is going to help him. I think it would be better if you speak to him at his level. As you mention that he's gain a little confidence over the years, it would seem that confidence is pretty fragile. So I am not sure if breaking what is left is a good idea. I think use MP's approach but do it as an equal no more no less. Hopefully he sees your respects towards him and realize that MA is about the human being (how we act accordingly) not about the cool stuff (skill that we process).

Dark Knight has a great point about the people who turn things arround. The point about sparring with a more compatant person means that they "train" hard and therefore deserve to have at least the same ranking if not even better. These people knows how to boast their own ego. It is not much of a point to tell that to their faces because they will hardly see it themselves and think that you are merely trying to discredit them.

Be yourself and go with the flow. Offer your help and your view as is. Avoid discussions and justifications. When in doubt, act. Let them doing the rest. It could be really irrateting at times but that's what friends are for. If you are a true friend, you will take that like a man. May be you will eventually help him to realize that he should rather channel his energy in writting comics base on his experiences in the so called Kung Fu that he is learning.

Good luck

Mantis108

[Ralek]

Dark Knight. I know all about how i'm percieved on the internet. I purposly make people percieve me in a negative way becuase that is the only way the truth about kung fu can be taught to true kungfu believers.

You have to be blunt and just say the truth about kung fu training. Kung fu is like a religion, not a science. It's based on myths, superstitions, and traditions, instead of facts and tests.

UFC was a scientific testing ground to see how styles did when there were no rules excepet for biting and eye pokes. Kung fu failed miserably. We must reject false theories like kung fu and move on to scientific facts like wrestling, BJJ, boxing. muay thai.