Beng Chuan

[MMARULESonTMA]

Cool, I'd like to see that when you find out, because I don't wann go saying Xingyi is shaolin, if some of my arguments are not right. But if it's not shaolin it still kind of is, and I don't care, internal or external cause I already know they are the same. But Shaolin is cooler than shape/mind fist.

[Buddy]

<<Buddy, this was my original statement.

Here are some of yours and my responses:

"Reminiscent? That's a bit different than saying it's the same."

-I didnt say they were the same>>>>>

most of what bagua is is xingyi done in circles... bagua is xingyi done in circles...hmm.

<<<"So what you're saying is Bagua is what Xingyi wants to be? That Bagua is more refined, sophisticated?"

-in less of an infantile way, yes>>>

In that you seem to agree please explain why you consider it infantile. You tend to see what you want to see.

<<<"Your comment was Bagua is Xingyi done on a circle."

-no it wasn't>>>

"bagua is is XingYi done in circles. " How do you propose to get away from your own words? Or are we going to argue on/in?


<<You use your name on here- man, that really says a lot about a person- good job; I'm so jealous of your integrity. >>>

Indeed. Want to check the website, too? Using my real name says I'm not afraid to own up to my words.


<<<I'm done responding to you, man. theres people much more knowlegeable and much less childish on here who havent attacked me for making any statements and then turned around to claim that I attacked them.>>>

I'm not going to judge who on an anonymous BB is better than me or not. I certainly hope there is someone better than me. I don't give a rat's patoot what you care for. You said bagua is xingyi done on a circle. That is nonsense and I said so. Sorry if it got your panties in a bunch but that is not an attack, it's an opinion. Now I guess I'll have to rent your Jet Li movie to see what the hell you're talking about.

Buddy Tripp
Yizong Bagua
Lungmen School

[MMARULESonTMA]

"I'm Not Afraid"- Luke Skywalker

" You will be, you will be" - Yoda

ROFLMAO at " rat's patoot"

[XVampireX]

Look what i did! One day i come here to comment on something, the other day, its all full of arguements!

Lets leave the theory and get to the obvious:

Xing Yi may have some shares with Bagua. But They are both different martial arts, so dont go on and tell me you're gonna do bagua stepping in xing yi, cause thats a little bit ridicolous!!! Xing Yi has a purpose there, why the stepping is pretty linear (And yes, there are angular stepping, but _not_ CIRCLE WALKING!).

And like Felipe Bido says: Each element fist has its own energy issuing feel, maybe Taichi "has" many of the moves in Xing Yi, it still doesnt mean that its the same element fist.

/me says he has seen "The One" but doesnt quite remember seeing Xing Yi and Bagua there exactly. But it could be his fault cause sometimes when he watches movies, he doesnt understand it, and he thinks that the movie is over before he even knows it :O

Yeah, thats what i have to say!

[cerebus]

WOW! And backbreaker is back...AGAIN!!!
MMARULESonTMA is indeed backbreaker. Surprisingly, he hasn't started ranting yet..... but it will happen, yes it will happen.

[Big_Phat_Wong]

Originally posted by DoGcHoW108
Thankyou for an elaborate version of an ignorant response. Accordant with your request, I will try to explain in simple what I mean- though I dont feel it necessary to.

Handwork in XingYi is very reminiscent of Bagua's with it's Intercrossing of arms to create locks, throws, etc. (good examples are Heng and Zuan chuen, but really all 5 and much of the animal system contain this).

The stepping, although linear in appearance, can be used very efficiently in applications of "linear" XingYi (again, monkey is a good example. Dragon, too. I dont know, so far, any other animals but i dont believe i will be too surprized when i learn others.) Actually, there are some steps in xingYi that might surprise you as far as turning and applicability in circles.

Other things, like the waist, posture and other structural components are very similar as well.

Thus, Bagua builds on much of what XingYi has to teach. Really, Bagua is what XingYi is trying to tell, or, hint to us.

This, as far as my comment, is an oversimplified but general explanation of my "nonsense".

The truth is that the only thing "Linear" about XingYi it is that the forms go in a straiglt line (as you might know, obsession with forms leads to all sorts of malfunctions and corruptions in martial arts and people's understanding of them). But I don't really expect you to know too much about this, since you sound like a beginner who got his ideas about Xingyi from Jet Li in "The One". You want to defend the uniqueness of your MA, and to some degree I understand that. But really, your response to my comment is "rather more revealing about your lack of understanding" of how martial arts relate to one another.

You seem to have absolutely NO knowlege or understanding (at best) of Hong and Ssu Jing circles in XingYi. Right off, this concept would show you how much is behind the dogmatic notion that XingYi is completely A to B linear and thus completely different from and unrelated to Bagua. Maybe DO you know- in which case i pity you for learning so slowly.

Perhaps you know better than I think you do, in which case you should restrain your comments about my information and inquire rather than assault. I am here to be your freind and a possible means of learning and teaching. I, myself, havent been in xingyi for very long at all and I would like to learn.

DoGsH!T108,

people like you are why I don't post here often. Now I've never met Buddy, but I know him from EF and think it's a safe bet that he's been practicing Xingyi & Bagua since you were just a bulge in your dad's pants. Your statements are completely arbitrary and off-base, and he simply called you on them. So you got all huffy and started flinging presumptious insults. Trust me, you are like a little chihuahua yapping at an elephant.

If you had a shred of sense and knew who you were talking to, you would realize you're outclassed, retract your statements and apologize for your childishness. Buddy's a nice enough guy, he might even toss you a clue. Otherwise? Enjoy your delusions of mediocrity.


Buddy,

sorry to interrupt the conversation, but this thread steamed me like Chinese broccoli. I'm over it now. Hope you guys had a good time hosting Master Luo.



Big_Phat_Wong out.

[Buddy]

BPW,
mmmm gailan and oyster sauce. maybe with some lop cheong...
BTW did you ever get to see Guru Plinck's vid?
B
PS Luo Laoshi was brilliant and very open this year. After having him here for a week LeoV, Aurelious, and I went and spent four days in Maryland with George Wood, his students and Bernie Langan and his students. It was xingyi from 6:30 till breakfast, Gao xiantien till lunch, Gao houtien till supper then theory and history till bed...repeat. Next year Bai He will have to go. It was great having four days with Luo in the countryside.

[DoGcHoW108]

Originally posted by Big_Phat_Wong
DoGsH!T108,

people like you are why I don't post here often.

Dude...i dont even know what to say. The very first word between us is an insult- and i havent even done anything to you. How can you logically say...ah, forget it.

Look, this thing has been blown out of all proportion. Here's how i see it:

I made a statement. Somebody disagreed and insulted my opinion by calling it nonsense.

It is very possible that my statement was nonsense, since i have little experience in both XingYi and Bagua. But precisely because of this, i am willing to listen and learn.

I am NOT, however, willing to listen and learn from someone who insults me for merely stating an opinion. I have never heard the slightest hint of this attitude from my teacher EVER, and i dont see why i should hear it from others.

Buddy- I have tried to PM you; i cant do that. I have tried to e-mail you; i can't do that. despite my claims to the contrary, I really wanted to continue my interaction with you (though not in this thread but i cant do it any other way) because it looks like you might be someone who knows what he's talking about.

Look, seriously, i will more than willingly retract my statement, but please explain to me the flaws in my understanding other than by simply calling them nonsense. I said that MOST OF WHAT BAGUA IS is xingyi done in circles- you disagree- i didn't say you were wrong to disagree. Just explain to me why, with a little less zeal.

from what i've learned of bagua and xingyi, they seem very similar, and to me, it seems like bagua just kind of takes XingYi into another dimension. also, if you look at my responses and ignore the fact that you kind of ****ed me off by responding the way you did, you will see that we do agree on quite a bit.

seriously, please explain to me why you disagree. I am being as sincere as i can.

PS: i did NOT say they are the same. i am actually kind of tired of this convenient and incorrect augmentation of my opinion.

thanks, DC

[Brad]

I said that MOST OF WHAT BAGUA IS is xingyi done in circles-

I don't quite understand what you mean... I've done a bit of baguazhang and a bit of xinyiquan, but the feeling and look of the techniques feel completely different to me. I don't remember ever doing anything like the wu xing quan in a circle...

[DoGcHoW108]

Ok, i happened to stumble onto this- http://www.yizongbagua.com/forum/vie...asc&highlight=

forget how i phraised things by word- i really thing that what i'm trying to say is kind of said on this thread from www.yizongbagua.com



Anyway, the original comment, for better or for worse, was that most of what bagua really is xingyi done in a circle.

Perhaps i shouldn't have worded it that way but really i dont see how anyone can miss the xingyi in bagua, or even the bagua in xingyi. its just one (xingYi) of them dosent necessarily have circular stepping drills. of course, i might be wrong seeing as to how i have only learned a small fraction of what xingyi has to offer as far as actual sets. the other one does have this curcular thing to it, but even in the bagua, especially since we are talking Gao and i happen to know some Gao Bagua, you have the straightline sets, and a lot of what i see in Gao's straightline sets i kind of see and feel in the 5-elements. If the HouTien sets can be incorporated into circular bagua, why can't the 5-element or the animal forms?

is anyone seeing the connection i'm trying to make? I'm wiling to keep trying until someone gets where i'm getting at.


of course, everything is relative- it could even be that Xingyi and Bagua are so **** different from anything else i've done that i just dont see it as mangified yet to be able to distinguish between them.

[MMARULESonTMA]

DOn't worry, I got your back . These idiots are just internet geeks. BUt you know, you're not really gonna find a good internet site. This forum was good like 5 months ago . EF vs. KFM, geesh, pot calling kettle!

[CaptinPickAxe]

These idiots are just internet geeks

Funny... You've been banned 3 almost 4 times now and you still show your rotten face... I'm thinking you spend more time on Kung Fu forums than actually training. Therefore, making you an internet geek...NOW TRAIN and quit shoveling the crap the only forum I enjoy.

[Buddy]

<<<forget how i phraised things by word- i really thing that what i'm trying to say is kind of said on this thread from www.yizongbagua.com>>>

Yizong bagua? Where I have I heard that from?

<<<especially since we are talking Gao and i happen to know some Gao Bagua,>>>

Really? From where?


<<<of course, everything is relative- it could even be that Xingyi and Bagua are so **** different from anything else i've done that i just dont see it as mangified yet to be able to distinguish between them.>>>

Now you're getting it :^)

------------

Back breaker, you too funny

[Big_Phat_Wong]

Hi Buddy,

best place to get Chinese spareribs & greens around here is Won Kok in L.A. Chinatown. Open 24/7, with a Dim Sum bar & banquet room in the back where Ark Wong & Share Lew used to give demos.

Still haven't seen the Pukulan tape, but I get paid next friday so I'll pick it up then. I hear there's a part on it where he spars three attackers while dancing a jig...now that I've got to see!


Take 'er easy,

~J