-
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mantis boxer:
I looked at the link and that is NOT the move that I am talking about. The left hand would be above the knee. It's done in a horestance, crane stance or cat stance but never that stance. That is a different move. It's nice that you've seen 90 but the WHF version does not have 90. It has about 30. Kung Lik Kuen is not a praying mantis form but a Jing Wu basic form. It's from northern shaolin. Now someone is going to post and say it's not " shaolin" blah blah[/quote]
It seems that Mantis Boxer has a major chip on his shoulder. What is the problem MB? What is the true purpose of this line of questioning?
Looks to me you are trying to start something that I think you will not be able to finish.
WHF or CCM? does it really matter? Even Sifu Albright stated that one is no better than the other.
If you have something to say, be man enough to say what you mean instead of hiding behind some obscure questioning
------------------
Life is like a hourglass, how much sand is left in yours?
-
Well MB all I can say is I give Sifu Albright two thumbs up on his last reply addressed to you... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]
PEACE [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]
------------------
RAYNYSC
[This message has been edited by RAYNYSC (edited 09-07-2000).]
-
Is it just me, or doen anyone ever notice that when most people on this forum are asked a direct question it seems that that is the exact time the person being asked has selectice memory loss or the computer they are using happens to go on the lam.
I don't know......Hey M.B. car to answer Y.H.S. question in a intellegent manner?
------------------
If you have nothing to do, don't do it here!
-
Mantis Boxer,
I study the WHF lineage and have been doing so for about 14 years. I have learnt and practice 24 of the WHF forms thus far.
I am neither picking a side nor validating anyone else's post but I want to share my thoughts. I do not understand your line of questioning nor do I understand your animosity towards Northern Shaolin. Praying Mantis was born from Shaolin. The majority of the other 17 styles were Shaolin or Shaolin based. Wong Long trained in Shaolin, took what he felt was the best techniques and created the Praying Mantis system, taught PM to Shaolin and we can proudly say was the highest level style taught at Shaolin. Why are you so bent on making a distinction for some techniques?
To call Gung Lek Kuen not part of NPM is true and false. You are right, it is not a true Mantis form nor does it have any of the unique mantis techniques or strategies. You are right it is originally a Northern Shaolin form brought to Jing Mo by Master Chiu Lin Wor and adopted by many of the other styles. But it was Master Law Gwong Yuk that decided to adopt this form along with a few others. If you choose not to learn or practice it, it is your choice and quite frankly that is fine because it is a very basic form. Nevertheless, it was part of his and WHF's curriculum. I think to discredit it is disrespectful of their decision to include it.
It is hard to make the argument that a form is not an original Mantis form. That argument would depend on which generation you want to start counting from. It is said that JoSi Wong Long created three forms: Bung Bo, Lahn Dzeet, and Baht Dzao. Then are the other 27 forms in our system not true PM forms?
I think there are other factors to look at. All PM forms have distinguishing characteristics. Techniques should link together, they should alternate between high and low, left and right. There should be conditioning throughout the form. They are well thought out and designed. If the forms follow these guidelines, then I can call them Praying Mantis forms.
Now I do believe in tradition. I think the forms as it stands now presents all the information you will ever need to know. Anyone can put a form together. I can, you can even with the 10 forms you have learned already. It is not difficult to take a section from one and mix it with another. But each form was designed for a reason, to teach a praticular theory, to practice a particular technique in various situations. Each form has a distinct flavor. I do not see a reason to create new forms although modification is acceptable and has happened throughout the history of the style. By modification, I mean a change from fist to palm, seven star stance to bow stance. These are all based on application and personal preference.
But getting back to your subject, do not reject the Northern Shaolin roots. It is not necessary to compare one lineage with another. They are different from us and we from them. Some of the forms are almost identical. Concentrate on your studies and don't worry about what the other people are doing.
Sorry for the long winded post, I kind of got carried away.
Mantis Boxer, if you wish to discus the WHF forms some more, email me.
-
Albright,
The northern shaolin move that I have been talking about has the left hand ABOVE the knee. Whether it's in a horse stance, crane or cat stance- it's always above the knee. The picture on that book is below the knee. That pose is from 4 directional attack. Also your forms have CLF looking uppercuts. Why is that?
-
Mantis Boxer,
It is obvious at this point you have me confused with someone else. Please don't waste my time with a false line of questioning (actually statements)which pertain to someone else. If you want to know something about Seven Star Mantis you can ask of course.
Sifu Carl
[This message was edited by LawClansman on 10-06-00 at 11:02 PM.]
-
CLF uppercuts?! LOL!!! This proves you definitely have no idea what you are talking about. You must be mistaking our school with someone else's. Hey, you can always pay us a visit. Our school is listed . Maybe you can personally show us what it is you are talking about cause honestly, we don't have a clue. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]
NO ROAD IS AS LONG OR FILLED WITH AS MANY OBSTACLES AS THE ONE TRAVELLED BY THE CHINESE BOXER. FEW ATTEMPT TO TAKE IT . THOSE THAT REACH IT'S END ARE EVEN FEWER.
-
You guys have uppercuts that have the other hand behind the back trailing. This along with the northern shaolin move makes your mantis weird.
-
At this point I really don't know why I'm even bothering to answer as this is going nowhere but may I ask where are you getting all this stuff from ? Have you actually seen anyone from Sifu Albright's school ( Lawclan Martial Arts Association) or Sifu himself doing the forms with the moves you describe? Maybe somebody is giving you bad information? Or maybe you are just making stuff up because of your own personal biases?
Sifu has answered your previous questions concerning these bogus techniques you say "we" do. You don't even bother addressing what he's saying. Instead you jump to antother question. He has already told you the moves you mention are not in our forms.
As to forms containing Northern Shaoiln techniques well, that is a mute point. This was already addressed but in case you forgot, all of the northern mantis branches come from the same root and that is the Northen Shaolin temple. Would you not think that mantis would contain some Northern Shaolin moves?
Our mantis looks weird? Different flavor than most maybe but weird? That is a first. Anyone that has ever seen our forms played properly has never said anything negative about them.
Like I said before , please feel free to drop by our school if you ever get the chance and we would be more than happy to clarify for you anything you like in person. Just please stop being so petty and trivial on this board as I am sure the members here would like to be reading more useful and interesting threads than this one.
NO ROAD IS AS LONG OR FILLED WITH AS MANY OBSTACLES AS THE ONE TRAVELLED BY THE CHINESE BOXER. FEW ATTEMPT TO TAKE IT . THOSE THAT REACH IT'S END ARE EVEN FEWER.
-
Mantis boxer,
This is the last thing I have to say on the subject. First of all it's not "my" mantis. It is the mantis that was handed down from CCM to CL to me. It is also the mantis handed down fron the monks of Yip Ming Duk temple in China to CL to me.
Before you judge me, let me refresh your memory,
1. I have 40 years in Mantis as well as other CMA
2. I spent 12 years in Asia mostly China and HK but also Korea, Japan, Bangkok, Taiwan, Hawaii and Vietnam. Researching the martial arts.
3. I have trained with some of the more well known masters of the arts.
4. I am the undefeated full contact bare knuckle champion for 10 years straight (1975-1985). U.S. and Asia.
5. I was Muhammed Ali's sparring partner in Korea in the seventies.
6. I have been teaching since 1968 and toured with Aaron Banks and the Oriental World of Self Defense for years including the 1969 Long Beach demo that Bruce lee made famous.
7. I Have won over 200 trophies in Forms, Weapons, Fighting, Breaking and Self Defense. And my students have made their own mark in tournament circles. Probably before you even started.
8. I have been working for the last 12 years in the New York City Transit subway system on the graveyard shift. I have taken over a hundred weapons from perps during that time. I deal with street gangs, muggers, rapists, crack fiends, mentally unstable homeless, razor carrying slit and run gangs. This is MY reality EVERYDAY. Right now. No tournaments. No gloves. No rules. And there have been newspaper articles about it so it is documented. (My favorite article was "Kung Fu Motorman Keeps The Bad Guys In Line") So I have to be on point on a daily basis because I never know when something is going to jump off. And I NEVER look the other way. And I'm no cop. I carry no weapons. Just my knowledge and experience.
I don't mean to toot my own horn here but YOU quention ME? You need to wake up and smell the herbal tea. Empty your cup and stop listening to false information. Like Loki said come to the school and see FOR YOURSELF what we do. Stop making up stuff and trolling and join a real school.
So, what's really WEIRD here is that you waste your time and mine with unproductive posts. I hope you can (finally) realize this
Sifu Carl
Posting Permissions
- You may not post new threads
- You may not post replies
- You may not post attachments
- You may not edit your posts
-
Forum Rules
Reply With Quote