Is Your Art Legit?

[TenTigers]

Fook Kuil, I think sai-yan is perhaps the more polite term for non-Asians, as opposed to gwailo, or Lo-Fan, or Bak-Gwai. (I'm not offended either way)

[SPJ]

fook kuil is actually a very good name.

fook means wealth.

kuil means precious or something that is of good value.

as the saying goes;

Fu Gui Zai Tian. one's fortune or blessing is up to the heaven/god.

if one's MA practice is legit or not?

you may do the move/posture, you may say where it is from (a teacher, a video, a book or your modifications), these are traceable or verifiable.

if you claim something that they are not, you lost the credibilities.

---

[Ultimatewingchun]

Lo fan is a nasty put down word that Chinese use to describe white people...it's similar to the word n igger if used by a white person to describe a black person. (Moy Yat...my first wing chun instructor, gave me the scoop on that word back in the 1970's).

I wouldn't use that word if I were you. Not unless you intend to always remain anonymous and with no true location listed. Otherwise you could get a visit from some angry lo fan and get beaten up by his inferior kung fu.

Of course...as Michael Parrella has pointed out - you're probably a fraud. Fook Kuil sounds just a little too close to f uck you.

Nice try, a$$hole.

[D-FENS]

My family art is from the Ming late ming, known for the Ghost sword and tornado fist.

Any similarity to the succubus daggers and Avalanche Palm?

Somebody please flush Hong Kong Fooey over here. this ****'s getting ridiculous.

"Kung Fu Road," WTF?

[lkfmdc]

Why don't you or the person who brought his name into the mix answer that?

Strange, you so freely criticized those other well known sifu and said all of CTS's friends were frauds, yet you try to avoid commenting on this one sifu? He was after all a very good friend of CTS's...

Or maybe you just realized that there are some schools where the head sifu doesn't want his students to post on the internet, and so you want to follow that trend...

How is your sifu these days?

[Fook Kuil]

Yum Cha.

I do not know who Doo is all i did was jump on to try and stop these guys attacking some old man. Regardless of style yes kung fu people are all friends and brothers. But these guys took it too far and i gave some medicine back to them and they didnt like it now look at this sh!t fight?! When i return back to china next week ill ask some question on Pak Mae, what do you wish to know for me to ask? I know there are a few Pak Mae clubs close to Gung Fu road, you know where all the weapons shops and lion dancing are, have you been there? Most of the southern people before the war was farmers the rich wasnt, farmers are way out now as the city gets more and more poluted and busy with people and tourist. You own apple farms? Apples in china is expansive, refreshing like watermelons.

[djcaldwell]

Yum Cha.

I do not know who Doo is all i did was jump on to try and stop these guys attacking some old man. Regardless of style yes kung fu people are all friends and brothers. But these guys took it too far and i gave some medicine back to them and they didnt like it now look at this sh!t fight?! When i return back to china next week ill ask some question on Pak Mae, what do you wish to know for me to ask? I know there are a few Pak Mae clubs close to Gung Fu road, you know where all the weapons shops and lion dancing are, have you been there? Most of the southern people before the war was farmers the rich wasnt, farmers are way out now as the city gets more and more poluted and busy with people and tourist. You own apple farms? Apples in china is expansive, refreshing like watermelons.

Holy crap this dude's flipped his wig! Apples, Lions and bears oh my...

nut case.

[Lama Pai Sifu]

Actually, I have heard of other masters called Chan Poi a fake. No to his face, but behind closed doors.

FM,

Lots of people have said behind Chan Poi's back. They do this because re choreographed forms and taught them to Americans. Some people laugh at him because he does stuff like; include the Hung Kiu Sao (the commonly seen one-finger bridge hand) in his first first form - and it is supposed to be a mantis form.

The thing is, choreographed or not, his people have won - big time - at major Kung-Fu tournaments, he's got at least 20 branches teaching his KF at any time, he has lots of ads, has wrote books, made instructional tapes, owns the property that is school is on makes more money than most of the KF teachers in the world make.

Not to mention - even as an old guy, he can kick, punch and even hit the lowest stances - really well. Much better than 99% of the KF teachers in this country. Especially the other old guys.

It's just jealousy, that's it. When everyone sees him at an event, even the guys who talk sh1t behind his back, they all want to greet him and hang out with him.

I have met his several times, and he is a nice guy. I have 2 very close friends that were instructors under him and thier kung-fu is very good. He personally picked me, my classmates and my teacher up from the airport in 1990. He and my teacher knew each other in NY and they seemed like good friends.

In general, a good guy and excellent skills. The one bad thing I will say about him, and I'd say it to is face - WE ALL FEARED FOR OUR LIVES WHILE DRIVING WITH HIM. SAFE DRIVING DOES NOT SEEM TO BE ONE OF THE SKILLS HE HAS AQUIRED OVER THE YEARS.


OH, but Noone says that he was one of the guys who laughed at my teacher....

Fact is, lots of teachers choreograph or re-choreograph their forms. So what? Someone had to choreograph them in the first place! And what is fake? Aren't they all using the same techniques, just changing secquences or number of moves?

Please....with the exception of people creating new moves that are not based on any real fighting concept, I think every teacher should choreograph some sets - and they do - to meet the needs of their students, to help them learn easier, etc.

We have some 20 moves sets to teach people before they learn the harder and more complex forms, so what? CTS didn't make up 'moves' so to speak. Sure he choreographed forms, again, so what? Some forms are the same as his teachers son remembers, (whom I've practices/trained with in Toi San) and some forms are his creations. Again, so what?

Noone, Cung-Fu, Fook-Yuil - you haven't spilled an secrets. Chan Tai-San taught at lots of people's schools. So what? Are you suggesting that they all did it out of their charatible hearts and NOT because they felt that CTS had something to offer his students? C'mon...

Grandmaster of the Fu Jow Pai, Sifu Ng Wai-Hung was a friend to my Sifu as well. Three of his top Sifu trained with CTS. I only saw TWO of them train personally with him, but I was told about the third. And I mean LEARN from him, not compare notes. One would train at his apartment and we would go to one of the other's schools, and my teachers would teach him before his classes started. Been there several times. SO what? People like to learn stuff. DO you think that they would have wanted to learn from him if everyone thought his KF was bad? Again..C'mon....a little common sense here.

Maybe, perhaps, YOU are the ones who have been misinformed? Odds are, noone and his co-horst have never learned anything from CTS but may know someone who did. They may be carrying on (to the next power) rumors from other jealous people they might have heard from. Who knows?

And because a few teachers had wispered jealous remarks to each other about his forms being 'fake' (because he choreographed them), does that make his skill fake? Uh, no. You have even heard them wisper this about Chan Poi. I have heard them wisper this about half a dozen well known teachers in NYC's Chinatown. They make fun of guys who came here as teen-agers, studied for a few years in Hong-Kong or Canton, and then started teaching the Americans. 35 years later, they are well respected, but truly, what have the really learned? I've got a friend in Hong Kong (Yes, Noone knows who it is) who mentioned to me about a few teachers that are actually considerded NOONE back East - even less then a 'someone'. He laughed at quite a few of them....

Sifu Frank Yee helped my teacher out the most when he came to this country. He had him teach his own students for YEARS! Why? He also had them pay top dollar the the time. Why would he do that. Sifu Yee told me that Chan Tai-San made $4,000 in the first month or two that he taught at his school. Is Yee a bad guy, trying to decieve and his students by letting them learn from a guy who you say is fake? NOT!!!!!!!! Just to help a guy out that had no value? Hardly...

And as far as my Sifu being a drunk? He was a diabetic, not a drunk. I've seem him drink one beer at dinner and have trouble keeping his head up. I've seen him have a drink maybe a dozen times over a dozen years. He liked to play lotto. He smoked. Those were his vices. He was not a drunk. Where do you even get this stuff??

Fact is - CTS's stuff was very very good. I've been all over the country and in China as well. I've been training for 26 years and seen a lot of schools. I've worked as a consultant for over 13 years in the martial arts business industry, and it's allowed me meet more school owners than you can shake a stick at. I've seen a lot. CTS was a high level practitioner. He killed people and fought with his KF. He fought in world wars and the cultual revolution. He grew up around famine and poverty and fought to stay alive. He wasn't politically correct and he wasn't a diplomat. He was a very 'rough around the edges' Kung-Fu guy, who spent the better part of 60 years, learning and training in Kung-Fu. They guy started training at 8 years old and was still learning stuff well into his forties.

And for a little validation, my friendly trolls, ask Sifu Frank Yee. He and I sat in Toi-San and listed to people talk about what a tough fighter CTS was. About his fights and what he and his classmates went through during their training.

I'm sure you could ask Yee about this, but you probably would get in trouble if he found out who you are, Noone,...posting and talking sh1t. I thought you were already told not to do this sh1t. Oh..that's right. THAT'S why you hide your names

[mantiskilla]

This has nothing to do with Chan Poi, as my question is really directed at your statement:


"The thing is, choreographed or not, his people have won - big time - at major Kung-Fu tournaments, he's got at least 20 branches teaching his KF at any time, he has lots of ads, has wrote books, made instructional tapes, owns the property that is school is on makes more money than most of the KF teachers in the world make."



Is this your definition of good kung fu?

[Lama Pai Sifu]

This has nothing to do with Chan Poi, as my question is really directed at your statement:


"The thing is, choreographed or not, his people have won - big time - at major Kung-Fu tournaments, he's got at least 20 branches teaching his KF at any time, he has lots of ads, has wrote books, made instructional tapes, owns the property that is school is on makes more money than most of the KF teachers in the world make."



Is this your definition of good kung fu?

Not necessarily. I've seen good and bad people accomplish the same thing. Chan Poi has demonstrated very good physicall skills in public, many times. He has been a promotor of Chinese KF for a long time. I know some of his instructors personally. I couldn't really say anything more about Chan Poi without fighting with him myself.

Since most of us haven't fought all the teacher who are out there, it's kind of hard to conclusivly. Don't you agree? There are many teachers who people say are 'good' but don't even have any good physical skills. So on that level, Chan Poi is better skilled, physically, than most of the teachers in his generation, in this country. I don't think that can be easily disputed.

We can only go based on what we see, what we touch and what we hear. Other than people giving him a hard time for his choreography, I've not heard that he is 'fake'. I know students of his personally, that have good skills, applications and fighting ability. I've seen his students do stuff. They look good.

'Nuff said!

[racerX]

Nice post,Lama

[lkfmdc]

Strong stances, strong punches, powerful kicks, fluid movement... Chan Poi has all of them, and has them STILL at an old age and with a horrible case of being a diabetic.... add to that the fact I know that on three occassions Chan Poi demonstratd the APPLICATION of his moves in real life and I'd say he has good kung fu.....

People on the fringes of the Mo Lum speak badly about famous teachers. It's because those people are outsides, wannabes and jealous.... As these threads have proved, the stories they tell only impress the uneducated and the uniformed, IE they have no basis in fact and like a vampire shrink and crumble in the light of day

Wai Hong's iron palm is famous, he even shreds bags by just running his fingers over it. He also trained guys that went to Asia, fought full contact and won. One of his students was the full contact champion of the world and undefeared for 14 years

YC Wong is another living legend, his kung fu combines uniquely "hard" and "soft". His Hung Ga is strong yet fluid. His Pek Gwa fast and nimble. HIs internal impressive

Tai Yim probably has the most impressive form of anyone ever seen in the US. Anyone should look at his clips on youtube. He stresses basics with his students and his students have gone to China and won both forms and full contact

These people were all close friends of CTS, and they respected him.

Whether you like it or not, Frank Yee, Wai Hong, Tak Wah Eng, Chan Fei and many others PAID sifu to teach their students in their schools. They didn't do it because it was "fun". They did it because CTS had unique knowledge.

Kwan Shi Yu, one of Wai Hong's seniors, came to Chan Tai San to learn weapons because CTS had a unique skill with them

Chan Fei asked to learn the "Faan Kahm Na" because he never learned it

Tat Mau Wong learned a CLF short hand form from CTS because it was a version unique to CTS's lineage

All this stuff happened, and it is WELL KNOWN. You can banter all day on the internet but you won't change that fact. And most of the trolls here are of so low a skill level that all they do is make themselves look bad in the process

[mantiskilla]

Lama--

ok thanks. Again this wasnt really about Chan Poi ( I have also met him several times, lunch, etc. and he was always very nice to me. I really like the man.). That's all I will say about Wah Lum.

In this day and age, unfortunately, skill and knowledge has little to do with success of schools...its really both sides of the spectrum as you mentioned.

[Yao Sing]

The one bad thing I will say about him, and I'd say it to is face - WE ALL FEARED FOR OUR LIVES WHILE DRIVING WITH HIM. SAFE DRIVING DOES NOT SEEM TO BE ONE OF THE SKILLS HE HAS AQUIRED OVER THE YEARS.

Chan Poi navigates by Qi. It's actually the same principle he uses when he looks the other way when you're testing yet nails you on what you did wrong. He's been known to catch students making mistakes even though he was in another room.

[Golden Arms]

Amen to Chan Poi's driving being scary...