Siu Baat Gwa

[ZenMindT]

To any Fut Sao guys out there, I've been curous about this practice for a while but have had little info on how its done/ the steps ect. Does anyone know where i can find a written explanation or something of the sort via a web page or a link to another board ect.

Thanks in advance.

[stonecrusher69]

Hi ZenMindT... there is no written explanation or website of how the sui baat qua is done that I know of. I was taught it many years ago.You usualy learn it after you complete the Bil gee form.Then you combine everything you learn within the sui baat qui stepping.The stepping pattern consists of moving or stepping around your opponent either in 45 degrees , 90 or 180 degrees incraments.There are a few ways to do this. There are two basic ways to step one is called steeling a half step which is a small step.This type of stepping is very fast.The other basic kind is called cross step or cross stepping in which one leg crosses over the other one.this is also called a full step.There are reasons and ways of stepping for each type. This type of stepping is called the outer baat qua because your moving to th eopponets out side we also have an inner baat qau which is used to counter or shut down the outer baat qwa. I hope this helps.

[stonecrusher69]

One other I forgot to mention about the full step.It's also called a full step because within taking one step we can move 180 degress behind our opponent.

[Vajramusti]

Kow zilch about fat sao wc- Ip man's jong form has ba qua stepping.

joy chaudhuri

[stonecrusher69]

yes Ip Man dummy form has a part of the Baat qwa but it only travels 45 degress then back to the center so it's not complete.We travel completely around our opponent 360 degress before returning to the center.also the way you step is very limitted IMO we have many ways of stepping which is not found in any other WCK style That I know of.

[Vajramusti]

Again, I dont know fut sao wc...but with Ip man dummy steps well learned you can easily go completely behind an opponent as well. Mui Fa Ip Man wing chun plum flower steps further complements those skills.

joy chaudhuri

[ngokfei]

To do the various stepping patterns on the Jong, would it not be a simple solution to construct one that can accomodate this

a 2 sided - 6 limb &/

2 leg or even a 4 sided Jong 12 Limb & 4 Legs

(I'm not a WC teacher but do have this training regiment as well)

[stonecrusher69]

one solution is perform the movements not on a dummy but just with a form which is what we do.The jong is just another way to practice it.

[Sihing73]

Hi SC69,

I am curious if you are familiar with the footwork patterns of Pak Bok Nams Pakua and if so how they may compare to the Siu Baat Gwa, if at all. In Pak's system (please forgive my spelling especially relating to names ) there are a series of patterns one practices on a linear line which deal with all directional changes. Once this is learned then the circle stepping is practiced. I was curious if this is similar to what you do. Also, Randy Williams had a stepping pattern based on the Plum Blossom shape and I was wondering how that may compare as well.

Also some may pratice using ropes or poles shaped like a tepee which they step around, over and under as the focus would be on the multiple stepping against various shapes and levels of height, etc. Joseph Simonet has a row of WC Dummies he uses as well.

[stonecrusher69]

HI Sihing 73

Pak Bok Nams Pakua I remember looking at a book of his or maybe one of his students years ago but I don't remeber that much about it.I do remember when I was looking at it that it had similiar ideas as what we do,but I would not say it's the same. I have to look at it again then give you an answer. The stepping we practice is not on a linear line it's based on 8 directional stepping on a bent curve or circle. Also all the Bagau systems that I ever saw always stepps forward never backward which in Futsao Sui Baat qua is half of the equasion..

The blum Blossom shapes(randy williams) do not resemble the sui baat qua form or idea.we also uhave our own version of the Blum Blossom which is also much different.

[Sihing73]

[QUOTE=stonecrusher69;804372]HI Sihing 73

The stepping we practice is not on a linear line it's based on 8 directional stepping on a bent curve or circle. Also all the Bagau systems that I ever saw always stepps forward never backward which in Futsao Sui Baat qua is half of the equasion..

/QUOTE]

Hi SC69,

If I recall correctly in Paks' book they do practice to step backwards as well as forward. It seems to be based initially on a linear approach and then goes to 8 directions. I would be interested in how closely, if at all, it is to how you approach the footwork.

[stonecrusher69]

[QUOTE=Sihing73;807269]

HI Sihing 73

The stepping we practice is not on a linear line it's based on 8 directional stepping on a bent curve or circle. Also all the Bagau systems that I ever saw always stepps forward never backward which in Futsao Sui Baat qua is half of the equasion..

/QUOTE]

Hi SC69,

If I recall correctly in Paks' book they do practice to step backwards as well as forward. It seems to be based initially on a linear approach and then goes to 8 directions. I would be interested in how closely, if at all, it is to how you approach the footwork.

Hi Dave,

As Far as Park's bagua or any Bagua system is general I can't say with certain that what we do is what they do.I don't believe that it is.I once went to visit a Baqua master once who knew Yin Fu style.I deminstarted our foot work and he said that its Bagua but then it did not look like what he was doing so I'm not sure what to make of it.If you like to see what we do just pay me a visit.I'd be happy to show you.

[Phil Redmond]

Again, I dont know fut sao wc...but with Ip man dummy steps well learned you can easily go completely behind an opponent as well. Mui Fa Ip Man wing chun plum flower steps further complements those skills.

joy chaudhuri

Hi Joy, in the Fut Sao WC jong form there is a turn where your back is turned towards the dummy.
Phil

[Vajramusti]

Hi Joy, in the Fut Sao WC jong form there is a turn where your back is turned towards the dummy.
Phil
----------------------------------------------

Hi Phil- didnt know that. FWIW given choice I wouldnt do that.
Its ok by me if they want to do that.
Thanks for the info.

joy chaudhuri

[stonecrusher69]

Hi Joy, in the Fut Sao WC jong form there is a turn where your back is turned towards the dummy.
Phil

The turn your talking about is a pivot where you turn 360 degress but you do not leave your back to the jong.