Why Jiu-Jitsu is more important than Kung Fu

[David Jamieson]

The Boxer Rebellion was not a matter of armed master vs. armed master. It was armed Chinese vs unarmed Christians and foreigners. And then it turned into something else when the numerically inferior foreigners with weapons arrived.

This doesn't negate the mentality behind what happened. Many of these guys thought they actually had a chance. They didn't and by elementary deduction of the situation should have known that they had no chance.

It was essentially a chinese version of the charge of the light brigade.
In other words, just because you think you can doesn't mean you actually can.

also, in regards to rudy losing, I think it had to do with being pulled out of the freestyle fight that was happening and moving it to what anthony was more familiar with. it was only after they started form the kneeling position and went into the groundwork where rudy failed. in the standup he dominated anthony completely.

but a loss is a loss.

[Ray Pina]

This doesn't negate the mentality behind what happened.

I wasn't posting about the Boxers' mentality. I was pointing out that it was being used erroneously as proof of Chinese master vs master weapons fighting. There is however ample evidence suggesting a broader-than-normal case of irrationality by Kung Fu practitioners.

also, in regards to rudy losing, I think it had to do with being pulled out of the freestyle fight that was happening and moving it to what anthony was more familiar with. it was only after they started form the kneeling position and went into the groundwork where rudy failed. in the standup he dominated anthony completely.

but a loss is a loss.

I don't know Sifu Rudy and didn't see the fight. But I would only commend someone for putting their stuff to the test. Learning and improving is what is important.

That sifus with 20, 30 years experience but no fights comment on others putting their bodies and long term comfort at risk for something they love... it's shameful.

[1bad65]

also, in regards to rudy losing, I think it had to do with being pulled out of the freestyle fight that was happening and moving it to what anthony was more familiar with. it was only after they started form the kneeling position and went into the groundwork where rudy failed. in the standup he dominated anthony completely.

But on his feet he showed no technique. He was flailing around throwing haymakers. Despite his opponent throwing ZERO strikes, the Sifu was unable to stop him. And the fight was standing for almost a full minute. Pictures taken the next day even showed his opponent with not a mark on his face.

[Wild Monk]

This response is based on the original thread and felt no need to read the threads in between.


My response is based on that i study TCMA and MMA. I like mma but other than great conditioning mma is almost useless in real street fight application in comparison to kung fu. I used to be a bouncer and trust me most troublemakers come in pairs and there is no way I am going to wrestle anyone down in a street fight now I will sweep the crap out of someone followed by a stomp and a swift sidekick to his nearest buddy who is probably coming up behind me with a yeungling bottle or heineken.

Anyone who thinks UFC is real fighting must have never been in a street fight. I can tell you I have never had a street fight which took 3 - 5 minute rounds.

P.S.
I do not condone getting in street fights for trained martial artists, it is so said seeing someone who trains to strategically destroy his opponent pound on someone who spends 8 hours of his day trying to roll the perfect blunt.. Sad so Sad.................... VIVA TCMA

[sanjuro_ronin]

But on his feet he showed no technique. He was flailing around throwing haymakers. Despite his opponent throwing ZERO strikes, the Sifu was unable to stop him. And the fight was standing for almost a full minute. Pictures taken the next day even showed his opponent with not a mark on his face.

Didn't Anthony admit he was rocked a few times?

[sanjuro_ronin]

This response is based on the original thread and felt no need to read the threads in between.


My response is based on that i study TCMA and MMA. I like mma but other than great conditioning mma is almost useless in real street fight application in comparison to kung fu. I used to be a bouncer and trust me most troublemakers come in pairs and there is no way I am going to wrestle anyone down in a street fight now I will sweep the crap out of someone followed by a stomp and a swift sidekick to his nearest buddy who is probably coming up behind me with a yeungling bottle or heineken.

Anyone who thinks UFC is real fighting must have never been in a street fight. I can tell you I have never had a street fight which took 3 - 5 minute rounds.

P.S.
I do not condone getting in street fights for trained martial artists, it is so said seeing someone who trains to strategically destroy his opponent pound on someone who spends 8 hours of his day trying to roll the perfect blunt.. Sad so Sad.................... VIVA TCMA

Where do you train MMA?
Why do you think or who told you that MMA revolves around "wrestling" ?

[Knifefighter]

T
My response is based on that i study TCMA and MMA. I like mma but other than great conditioning mma is almost useless in real street fight application in comparison to kung fu. I used to be a bouncer and trust me most troublemakers come in pairs and there is no way I am going to wrestle anyone down in a street fight now I will sweep the crap out of someone followed by a stomp and a swift sidekick to his nearest buddy who is probably coming up behind me with a yeungling bottle or heineken.

One of the ways you can tell someone is completely full of sh!it when they claim to have trained MMA is that they cannot see the applicability to the street and make claims about the street not having rounds, rules or referees.

And one of the ways you can tell someone has never been in a street fight in his life is how he talks about throwing all his perfect techniques against multiple opponents... and, of course, he always worked as a bouncer.

[sanjuro_ronin]

One of the ways you can tell someone is completely full of sh!it when they claim to have trained MMA is that they cannot see the applicability to the street and make claims about the street not having rounds, rules or referees.

And one of the ways you can tell someone has never been in a street fight in his life is how he talks about throwing all his perfect techniques against multiple opponents... and, of course, he always worked as a bouncer.

You know, you should learn to mellow out in your old age, its bad for your blood pressure Dale.
Ever thought of taking up Tai Chi?
I hear its good for the stress.

[Wild Monk]

Most of the Kung Fu I have seen relies very heavily on the intercepting and or jamming of an attack and an immediate counter attack... And if it was an MMA fighter, not only would he have clinched you, he would have thrown you or at least wrestled you to the ground. At that point, if he has Jiu-Jitsu and you don't, you are at the mercy of his response to your tap or the swiftness in which the referee can come save you.

Sanjuro my response is based on this quote from the original post. 7 pages in I don't blame you for forgetting the original thread. I am simply saying that Kung Fu is not only trapping and jamming an attack it is also digging my thumb in his eye or cluthing his throat while squeezing with my 5 fingers as if it were a tennis ball and sweeping him where he is introduced to the sole of my Timberland boots.

I enjoy and respect MMA but all I can say is next time your opponent in mma goes for a double leg takedown. drop into a low bow and arrow stance and get an underhook with your lead arm then proceed to turn to a bow and arrow stance to the direction behind you but in the transition when you are going from bow & arrow to horse stance to bow & arrow. You are going to use that underhook and a turn of the waist to toss your opponent on his back. where you can follow him down into sidemount . just a little TCMA application for MMA .. again VIVA TCMA

[David Jamieson]

One of the ways you can tell someone is completely full of sh!it when they claim to have trained MMA is that they cannot see the applicability to the street and make claims about the street not having rounds, rules or referees.

And one of the ways you can tell someone has never been in a street fight in his life is how he talks about throwing all his perfect techniques against multiple opponents... and, of course, he always worked as a bouncer.

only slightly assumptive on your part kf....but, I do agree somewhat - the disparaging remarks.

mma is totally applicable to streetfights, or any fight. in fact, take away the rules and it can be downright vicious and need not involve wrestling at all. If you wind up wrestling , then wrestle, but mma doesn't dictate that it HAS to go there.

[sanjuro_ronin]

Sanjuro my response is based on this quote from the original post. 7 pages in I don't blame you for forgetting the original thread. I am simply saying that Kung Fu is not only trapping and jamming an attack it is also digging my thumb in his eye or cluthing his throat while squeezing with my 5 fingers as if it were a tennis ball and sweeping him where he is introduced to the sole of my Timberland boots.

I enjoy and respect MMA but all I can say is next time your opponent in mma goes for a double leg takedown. drop into a low bow and arrow stance and get an underhook with your lead arm then proceed to turn to a bow and arrow stance to the direction behind you but in the transition when you are going from bow & arrow to horse stance to bow & arrow. You are going to use that underhook and a turn of the waist to toss your opponent on his back. where you can follow him down into sidemount . just a little TCMA application for MMA .. again VIVA TCMA

I see.
Interesting, very interesting.

Note:
I assume some of you have noticed my new posting style for 2009, if you can't say anything good...say how interesting that view is.

[Kansuke]

LOL, judging by what is claimed on forums, there must be A LOT more bouncers out there than I've ever noticed all the bars and clubs I've ever been to put together!

[sanjuro_ronin]

LOL, judging by what is claimed on forums, there must be A LOT more bouncers out there than I've ever noticed all the bars and clubs I've ever been to put together!

That is directly applicaple to my new sig line for 2009 also.
Ask the bouncer where he bounced and when, simple enough.
In my case:
In Toronto:
The world nightclub.
Venus
Meow
G-Spot
Flamingo Road
Jillys
In Hamilton:
Monoply

All of this in the 90's.

[Wild Monk]

Whoa Knife Fighter ,

Calm down I am new to the forum and stay away from flame wars. My comparison to MMA to the street is simply stating that MMA does not prepare you for multiple opponents. I do train MMA at a gym in Lodi, NJ . Yes I was a bouncer until they required you to get a S O R A License and my boss told me I had to pay $ 340 for my license.


I did not mean to offend anyone with my post it is simply my experience.

[Knifefighter]

I enjoy and respect MMA but all I can say is next time your opponent in mma goes for a double leg takedown. drop into a low bow and arrow stance and get an underhook with your lead arm then proceed to turn to a bow and arrow stance to the direction behind you but in the transition when you are going from bow & arrow to horse stance to bow & arrow. You are going to use that underhook and a turn of the waist to toss your opponent on his back. where you can follow him down into sidemount . just a little TCMA application for MMA .. again VIVA TCMA

A quick trip to your local university wrestling room will immediately show you the problem with your theoretical non-fighting imaginings.