Iron Body Videos and other stuff.

[AllSkillsMine]

Hello all, I would like to ask for your help. I know from lurking here that all kinds of newbies ask for advice on training IP, and other things which should really be taught by an experienced teacher. HOWEVER--I am not by any means a newbie to Iron Palm and breaking. I have learned Iron Palm directly from two different (experienced and qualified) teachers, and have about 6+ years training Iron Palm in general. Also, I have been formally trained in the basics of the internal Iron Vest set from the GM Gene Chicoine method, and have several years experience with standing meditation. I'm no master, but I'm no moron either. Oh, and I have some 'Great Mender' dit da pills, an some 'Gecko Tonic' pills, and some other stuff...

I have lots of jow and Iron Palm liniment (galoons!) that I've brewed up from various herb packs I've purchased to try out. In a little over a week, Im going to have a lot of free time to train for the summer, until my nursing program picks back up in late august. It's been probably the most hectic year of my life, and some serious training (and some breaking) is just what I need to feel like a human again.

SO THEN, ON TO MY REQUEST....

I have been considering purchasing Sifu Wing Lam's "Secret Shaolin Iron Body Training Video". I want to get into the more physical conditioning-I always have wanted to do the Iron Body stuff, along with the Iron Palm I already do. The problem is, I dont want to pay for the video without knowing what's on it and also what type of success others have had with this method either by video or by personal instruction.
I could probably pull off the training by going really slow, but I'd rather try a proven method.


I know that Gene Ching has learned from Sifu Lam from reading other posts.


In summary, what I would like to know is:


1.)What is required to do this method--as in, diet changes, abstinence, etc..

2.)What exactly is included in the video information wise--Does it tell you everything you need to know to make it to the steel shot level? (Remember, I have lots of good jow, and a couple long distance herbalist/kung fu friends.)

3.) What type of experiences have you all had/observed with this method?

4.) What are the actual benefits of this type of training?

Lastly, does anybody know how difficult/easy it would be to train this under Sifu Lam directly?


Many thanks, I'm hoping for some good answers..

[Dale Dugas]

You have no need to purchase Sifu Lams material if you are training with Master Chicoines methods.

You have all that you need.

[GeneChing]

Be sure to buy our May June 2009 at a bookstore, because the bookstore edition has a special DVD insert: KungFuMagazine.com presents: Iron Body Showcase. Of course, subscribers got that free.

Check out our Iron Body Master Kit too.

As for Wing Lam's iron body, I only dabbled in it. I developed an allergy to tiedajiu (jow) but not from his method. Actually it was from an experience at Shaolin Temple. In all honesty, iron body wasn't my thing personally.

[AllSkillsMine]

So, I got the magazine...what was most impressive on the DVD were some of the finger skills.

So, Im still wondering if anyone has used Sifu Lam's 'Iron Body' method, or is familiar with it, and what exactly it requires besides free time and jow.

[Raipizo]

not so sure about how good the videos of Wing Lam's are but if you check the site the dvd/videos they seem rather in depth and if your learning from videos you dont really need to follow a diet regime or anything like that.

[Raipizo]

But with sifu lam pretty hard i believe he's retired and lives and California, easy for you if you live there.

[IronFist]

I had Wing Lam's iron body video from like 10 years ago. Not sure if that's the same one he sells now.

It starts with some general info and some iron body demos.

IIRC it's divided into different sections:

Forearms
Shins
Stomach
Chest
Back
Head

For each section there is a hard qigong exercise you do and then the hitting yourself with the bags part. General info is given and the exercises are demonstrated but a specific training regimen (as far as how much to practice and how many reps to do and how quickly to progress, etc.) is never given. It's basically like "do the qigong, then hit yourself with the bags, then massage with jow." But like I said, you've never told how many reps to do or how long to do it for or anything like that. It's probably vague intentionally so if anyone hurts themselves doing it, WLE can say "oh, well they weren't following our advice cuz we didn't give any advice about that stuff."

As for "special rules," I think it says don't practice for 24 hours before or after sex, and don't train during thunderstorms.

[AllSkillsMine]

Thanks for the reply, that was the type of info I was looking for.

So there was NO time table as far as how many strikes/time per day, or how long to wait before moving on to the next medium? (gravel, then steel..)

I wonder, Iron Fist, did you ever take up this training?

Im guessing it would be like the "Ultimate Iron Palm" (book) as far as progression-meaning that you would have to start with a little time per day, and gradually build up-starting with beans, moving to gravel, then steel shot. I imagine that how quickly one progresses through each stage will depend on how much time is spent training-with faster results achieved by those who train more than once per day.

The only real concern I have is the advanced stage--this seems like the place that would injure you if done wrong or too fast. Im pretty sure that it would be wise to use an internal dit da at this stage too.

I suppose that if I take up the training, I could contact Sifu Lam for a seminar or private lesson on the subject before I ever get to the advanced stage.

In any case, I appreciate your reply, is was just what I was looking for. Now I just wonder if anyone knows any more specifics about the video and training method.

Thanks..

[IronFist]

Thanks for the reply, that was the type of info I was looking for.

So there was NO time table as far as how many strikes/time per day, or how long to wait before moving on to the next medium? (gravel, then steel..)

Correct. Well there may have been as far as moving to the next medium. I don't remember. But as far as sets and reps, no, there was none.

I wonder, Iron Fist, did you ever take up this training?

Yeah I did for a while. I only did the forearm and shin parts, tho.

And it worked very well (of course the conditioning is gone now since I haven't done it in 7 or 8 years), but at the time, it worked well. I was able to take hard hits to the inner forearm and shin without pain and often without bruising.

To be perfectly honest, looking back, that time I spent training would have been much better used doing some other stuff, like working on actual techniques. But I was misguided in my training goals in my youth.

All inclusive, it's probably at least 20-30 min a day for just the forearms stuff (remember you have to do the qigong parts, and spend a lot of time massaging your forearms afterward and stuff). When I included iron shin, it went up to about 45 minutes per day.

As far as sets and reps and stuff, I talked with some other iron body practitioners online and arrived at a regimen that was very light to begin and progressed very gradually. Less is more. The key to all of this stuff is to go SLOWLY. Injuries and stuff along the way will only set you back and possibly cause long term damage. I used the mung bean bag for a year before I ever started the rock filled one. And at most I think I was only doing 20 reps (per side) per day.

Ah, youth. I spent way too much time wanting to learn secret conditioning skills that would make me invincible. Heh... and I still got owned in about 5 seconds the first time I trained with an MMA gym (this was with me having 3-4 years of kung fu and other MA experience AND iron body training at the time).

So basically I was wasting 45 minutes of my day every day for 1.5 years to learn these "skills" that don't really apply too much in actual combat.

At least you could say I was dedicated.

Im guessing it would be like the "Ultimate Iron Palm" (book) as far as progression-meaning that you would have to start with a little time per day, and gradually build up-starting with beans, moving to gravel, then steel shot. I imagine that how quickly one progresses through each stage will depend on how much time is spent training-with faster results achieved by those who train more than once per day.

No clue what that book is about.

Training more than once per day is nuts. Oh wait, now that I think about it, there may have been something on the vid about training up to 3 times per day. That's ridiculous. Like I said, I went very slowly and never did more than 20 reps, once a day, and I got very good results as far as conditioning goes. And I'm talking SLOW progression, as in like adding one rep per week when it was time to increase.

But if I had to do it over again, I wouldn't. Like I said, it was a waste of time as far as actual combat ability goes, and who knows wtf was actually in that jow that I used every day (Wing Lam jow).

You will get just as good of shin conditioning from kicking a heavy bag.

The only real concern I have is the advanced stage--this seems like the place that would injure you if done wrong or too fast. Im pretty sure that it would be wise to use an internal dit da at this stage too.

There's no need to go past the rock bag. In fact, the mung bean bag would probably be enough (altho eventually the beans will break down inside and you'll want to replace it... probably after a year of daily use).

I suppose that if I take up the training, I could contact Sifu Lam for a seminar or private lesson on the subject before I ever get to the advanced stage.

Like I said, there's no reason to ever go to the advanced stage. The bag filled with rocks is hard as hell. You don't need the steel shot.

In any case, I appreciate your reply, is was just what I was looking for. Now I just wonder if anyone knows any more specifics about the video and training method.

Thanks..

Glad I could help. Again, I don't think you really need this conditioning. It's not that it doesn't work, it's just that it's an inefficient use of time. How often do you get hit in the inner forearm? Almost never (unless you're doing weird kung fu drills). But in a real fight or actually sparring match I've never ever been hit there. You'll probably get hit in the shin a lot, especially if you do MMA or Muay Thai, but you will develop your shin from hitting a heavy bag over time, AND that has the added benefits of you working your kicking power at the same time so you're getting more than one benefit from the training at the same time.

The one thing that I would take away from the videos, tho, was that massaging after training is important. So whatever kind of conditioning you do for your shins or whatever, massage them for a while after to help the blood blow and everything. If you get bruises you can use arnica gel (homeopathic but supposed to help bruises heal). I never noticed that bruises treated with Wing Lam jow healed any faster than those that weren't, but then again I never did a side by side comparison (not that it would be possible to give yourself matching bruises on each arm, either).

Anyway, feel free to ask any question you may have. I'm totally honest about this stuff and I won't give you BS or the mystical run around that a lot of people do.